B) You dig in harder and do not ALLOW yourself to be disregarded -- in effect you make your marriage WORSE in the short term to make it better in the long term. That's boundary setting and enforcement which has been discussed on this thread before.
Accuray, isn't that what I did when I just calmly walked off? I really wasn't even mad, just not going to play the game. Yet KD responded like that was the worst thing I could do.
Can you explain for me? Do I have to scream and yell in the middle of Home Depot to qualify as an adequate scene for a boundary enforcement?
SS, you're entitled to your opinion and offering it up to CV on her thread is appropriate, but maligning her motivations while talking about her in the third person strikes me as crossing the line.
I believe that our threads are for talking WITH each other, not for talking ABOUT each other. Well, I'm certainly more comfortable reading the former rather than the latter.
[/quote] Yesterday, we took S to a movie. Afterwards, we stopped by Home Depot to get a few things. H wants to look at ceiling fans for the deck (he's obsessed, we can't use it for 3 months.) he likes to plan ahead and is excited about the project.
He could have gone to look at them himself while I shopped some other things, but he insisted that I go with him. "Come on, come on, well just look."
your first boundary should have been here.
H: What about this one? (huge, 58" fan) CV: It's too big.
you just invalidated his choice.
H: No it's not. (then why did you ask me?)
because you took a negative approach to his choice. you could have said something a little less confrontational, i.e., i don't know...what do you think? do you think it may be too big?
CV: Look, see this picture on the box? It shows that we would need to drop it more than 48" inches to clear the ceiling.
(look, see, i'm smarter than you, can't you see this picture, i told you so.)
H: No we wouldn't. That shows it mounted on a slanted ceiling. We'll be mounting it at the peak.
(he needs to defend himself and his choice) CV: Right, which means we have two slanted ceilings to consider (vaulted ceiling.)
(you're so f'ing stupid. why do i have to keep telling you the obvious?)
H: (pause) Oh. Well I still think it would work! We have that much clearance.
(he has to prove you wrong. you have to prove him wrong.)
CV: You can keep looking, I'm going to lawn and garden. (and walked off)
what you should have done in the beginning so you wouldn't have had resentment.
Later when we got home, when I was out on the deck, he measured the ceiling and showed me that it would come just below the side beams.
H: See, it would drop to about here.
(see, i'm right.)
CV: I know, that's too low. (no, i'm right.)
H: No it's not.
(no, you're not)
CV: Whatever.
(F--k you)
H: Just think how much air it would move! We could sit out here.... (blah-blah)
(i'm really excited about this fan. i can't wait to experience the benefits.)
I feel like the bad guy all the time. He wants me to be happy with what he's happy with, but if I'm not, he has this look like I'm raining on his parade. I'm not entitled to have a different opinion.
and YOU want him to be happy with what you're happy with and he's not entitled to have a different opinion.
So yesterday I tried to engage, but it does not make me feel good to look back on. Personally, I would have felt better if I had declined and went my own way in the first place. Sorry. [/quote]
and you should have instead of then feeling the resentment of going along.
M:63 H:53 S:41, SS:28, SS:25, SD:23 M:15 T:16
Bomb:12/17/11, "I think we should go our separate ways." H moves to his mother's house, 4/1/12 12/21/12: H moves back home, piecing
Can you reconcile this with anything anyone else is saying, about "giving him a chance," "extending him an opportunity," "let him try again," etc.? I believe that discussion was about going to dinner with him, which I wasn't doing because he would eat off my plate in spite of my request, but again the topic shouldn't matter.
To your conversation example...
H: What about this one? (huge, 58" fan) CV: It's too big. What do you think? do you think it may be too big? H: No, it's not.
Sorry, don't see a big difference there.
And you never did answer my question. What do you suggest I do when I DO care about something.
He sounds like a big goofball. He snores and eats everything in sight, can't do fix-it projects but tries anyway, attends counseling and really wants to get better and just can't get it right. Even though we only hear your side of things, CV, the sense I get is that more of the people who read you sympathize with him. Why is that?
I have noticed you're extremely smart. You back up your opinions with examples, and you really seem to have given this a lot of thought and effort. Yet you come across as unpleasable, inflexible, and a bit mean. Why is that?
I think that part of the problem is you're in a place where the focus is all on ourselves and what we can improve to be better people. In a sense you're trying to hammer a nail with a screwdriver. What you want is for your H to change.
It's a real puzzle.
Life is in the details, so although you'd like to use them only to support the bigger picture that you see, the implementation is going to get down to details anyway.
You and H have a fundamental disagreement. He thinks he is fine and you think he is unacceptable. When you say he doesn't respect you, what does he say? In a situation like the fan one, when he said what do you think and you said it's too big and he said no it's not, you could stop the conversation and say - THIS. This right here is an example of something I feel is disrespectful. You disregarded my opinion. Are you willing to work with me and find a size we can both agree on, or do you want to disregard my opinion and I'll go to the flower shop? (Note his actual answer.) And repeat.
You've tried counseling, but it sounds like you need to try a better counselor. You both may have a lot of resentment built up.
You have a chance to try. Instead of saying "but we already did" try someone different. Tell your H while he still has a chance. Tell him you are thinking about leaving, the only question is when, and you (if you do) want to try again to get through to him what it is you're feeling.
What makes your side so unsympathetic, to me, is that you rigidly stand by your opinion as though it is fact, even when your H doesn't agree. The fan is an example. It's going to flatout ruin your idea of the deck because you're so set on some other kind of fan. You don't want to shop because the deck's no good for three months but H is trying to implement something to make it usable now. You just seem unwilling to look at him as anything but completely, obviously, totally wrong. At least in the examples you gave.
The one thing you think is good about him, his social nature, isn't even good in your book because it doesn't float your boat. It's a really tough situation and I agree with Accuray that probably the sum of all the many offenses over the years has become such that it colors how you interact even on things you might not have had a problem with if you generally got along.
I think you should try counseling, together or on your own, to give this another shot. It would help if you could consider the possibility that you're part of the problem. I think that's my takeaway as a spouse on the other side, that if I had the bomb drop 5 years ago we could have addressed my problems and h's problems. Instead H went 5 more years thinking I was the root of all the problems and finally couldn't/wouldn't take it anymore.
That's where I feel like my sitch is a little like yours. If you've tried it and he slipped back into old habits then you didn't learn effective ways of responding. There has to be an element of you in the solution, I believe. Although you seem to insist there isn't, as an outsider looking in I think there's more that you can work on.
Adinva 51, S20, S18 M24 total 6/15/11-12/1/12 From IDLY to H moving out 9/15/15-3/7/17 From negotiating SA to final D at age 50 5/8/17-now: New relationship with an old friend __ Happiness is a warm puppy.
Can you reconcile this with anything anyone else is saying, about "giving him a chance," "extending him an opportunity," "let him try again," etc.?
if you didn't want to look at fans, you should tell him that. there's a nice way to do it.
H: What about this one? (huge, 58" fan) CV: It's too big. What do you think? do you think it may be too big? H: No, it's not.
Sorry, don't see a big difference there.
no, you don't and i suspect that's a big part of the problem. you leave no room for him. if you ask him if he thinks it's too big and he says, "no, it's not", can you let him find out on his own? if it's truly too big, won't that become apparent? i think you take the position of his "teacher" a lot.
And you never did answer my question. What do you suggest I do when I DO care about something.
i think you care about everything, in spite of what you say. everything. every way everything is done or not done.
BTW, can you give me one example that supports this statement of me?
well, read what you write. it's all about how he's the problem.
M:63 H:53 S:41, SS:28, SS:25, SD:23 M:15 T:16
Bomb:12/17/11, "I think we should go our separate ways." H moves to his mother's house, 4/1/12 12/21/12: H moves back home, piecing
