This is my response to what someone said over on the tam forums. The stuff in speech marks is from them.
"As a man, you're driven to being recognized, loved and victorious. Most of your thoughts revolve around those three things".
I think this underpins a lot of the hurt I am feeling now. My wife provided me with all those 3 things and so I stopped looking to achieve them for myself. Due to battles she is having with herself, she isn't providing them any more so I have to start the search anew. I just haven't got a clue where to even start looking. When I get told to focus on myself I really, really struggle to find something to focus on. So instead, I end up making short term changes that don't really move me forward at all. Maybe, I'm overthinking things but it seems like a very good time to address things like this. I'll give the IC a bit longer and point out I'm not looking for feelings based therapy.
I've also been thinking about our conversation yesterday. I really enjoyed it! She was being open and friendly and it reminded me of why I asked her to marry me and also how hard this has been on her too. Unfortunately, it is also a reminder I'm not at the letting go stage yet. All I want to do right now is text to say what a nice time I had. This would be a 180, but would also constitute pursuing I think. Good idea out not? The whole Shields up thing concerns me, and the fact she wants me to go for a 7 course meal with someone else blows my mind. Is that a test or something? I just don't believe she could deal with it if I did. She'd use it to validate her own doubts, unless that is there is an ea/pa in progress, which I have no evidence of, in which case she's trying to assuage her guilt.
Also, why did she tell me about her IC? Why ask about mine? To prove that because we both have issues that we shouldn't be together? That I should run away? I mean telling me that she has an electra complex, self worth and neediness issues is strange to say the least! I am quite happy with my response though. As a recovering "nice guy" I didn't try to caretake but instead just let her talk.
Arggh, just broke down in tears AGAIN! I don't want to go for a meal with someone new. The woman I want was stood in front if me yesterday flirting with me. Then she slapped me down again. I'm so frustrated right now.
Question. There is a music festival going on near here that I want to go to and I think my wife would too. I'm going to go anyway but should I ring and invite her. It could be great fun and as long as we stay of the topic of us we are still getting on well. Or is this a terrible idea born of desperation?
You're in a panic state right now, try to get the perspective to see that. You want so many things to be made better all at once, but it takes time. Think of it like riding a mountain bike -- if you put the mountain bike on the climbing ring on the front and the big ring on the back, it doesn't matter how fast you pedal, you're going to move slowly. You can furiously pedal and wear yourself out, but that doesn't make the bike go faster, it just makes you tired.
You need to find a way to "just be" for periods of time. GAL helps with that. GAL does not mean go to the gym by yourself -- GAL is about going out and doing things with other people. It is the social interaction that will replace some of what's missing with W's loss. It will give you a foundation to rebuild the things for yourself you listed above.
GAL is hard if you haven't been doing it. There's a website called "meetup" where you can join ad hoc get togethers to pursue recreational interests. i.e. there might be a meetup group based on "hiking", and they'll post hiking events. You find it on the website and then you just "show up". The context of those meetings is that they expect new people to show up every time, so it's not like you're joining a group of 10 friends and you're the outsider. Meetup is one idea, but there's volunteering, taking a class at a gym, taking a class in any other context, joining a casual sports team, whatever it is, get yourself going on that front because it WILL help.
W is sharing with you and talking to you because despite what she says, she is NOT done with you. If she were, she wouldn't tell you about her IC or ask about yours. When my W asked for divorce she didn't want to talk to me at all, she tried to completely avoid me. She is keeping the door open, and is carefully watching you to see if a future with you is going to be exactly the same as your past has been. It is an opportunity for you to surprise her with your 180's, but at the same time you have to walk the delicate balance of giving her space and NOT PURSUING.
So in answer to your question, you should NOT invite her to the music festival. Here's what will happen, you'll get your expectations up that she'll accept, you'll both have a good time, that it will rekindle a spark, and that she'll agree to reconcile.
She will KNOW you have those expectations, you are completely transparent to her right now in that regard. Therefore, she will REJECT any overture you make to her that she feels carries a bundle of expectations with it. Why? because if she accepts and goes to the music festival with you and has a good time, you are going to start pressuring her to get back together, and she's going to have to push you away, and that will make her feel badly because she doesn't want to keep hurting you. It took a ton of strength on her part to push you away because she KNOWS it hurts you, and she doesn't want to be the bad guy.
When you invite her to do something that's going to lead to a reconciliation expectation, you are in effect inviting her to be the bad guy again and she doesn't want to play that role at all!
That's why if you "act as if" you are OK by yourself, and go out and GAL, you make it apparent to her that your happiness is being derived elsewhere and is no longer SOLELY DEPENDENT UPON HER.
When that happens, she can SAFELY approach you, because you don't have this giant ball of expectations. If she's not going to disappoint you every time you get together, she can start to relax and enjoy you again.
I've used this analogy before on this board -- your W views you as a giant dammed up reservoir of needs and expectations. She's afraid that allowing just the slightest bit of water to come over the top of the dam will make the whole thing come crashing down and carry her away in your sea of wants. Therefore, she will do all she can to avoid meeting ANY of your expectations, because it's not SAFE for her to do so. Giving just a little risks sweeping her away.
It is YOUR challenge to change that dynamic. You have to empty that reservoir of needs and wants so that she has nothing to fear. Then you become completely approachable and she can start to feel love for you again.
Doing that is HARD, but that's what it takes. That is why you do NOT invite her to the music festival, or anywhere else for that matter.
In the course of light conversation, you can mention to her that YOU are going to go to the music festival, and then change the subject and talk about other things you're doing and things that she's doing. If she wants to go to the music festival with you, she'll say so, but in that context, there is no expectation. She is not rejecting you if she doesn't offer to go, and therefore she's not put in the role of being the bad guy.
Does that make sense?
Accuray
Married 18, Together 20, Now Divorced M: 48, W: 50, D: 18, S: 16, D: 12 Bomb Dropped (EA, D): 7/13/11 Start Reconcile: 8/15/11 Bomb Dropped (EA, D): 5/1/2014 (Divorced) In a New Relationship: 3/2015
Perfect sense. I guess I knew the answer really but I'm just frustrated by the fact that I think it would be a fun thing to do on the spur of the moment (literally in the next 15 minutes) but don't feel I can ask her anything now. As you say I'm trying to fix things again but going about it wrongly by focussing in the wrong place. Thanks Accuray.
