Ok, it’s probably best for me not to date for now. Today’s father’s day, for the first time in my life it’s such a sad day. My own father passed away less than a year ago and within the last couple months the W and I separated, what a year. Talk about being kicked while I am down!!!
Yes, I will be seeing my kids for a couple hours today but it’s just not the same. I was such an active dad when the W and I were together. My relationship with my kids just doesn’t seem the same, so so sad.
Me(M):37 W:42 T: 14 M: 11 S: 1 D: 1 W wanted separation 5/5 Stopped living together 5/5
What a weekend! I went to pick up my kids and spend a couple hours with them on Father’s Day. I made sure to look my best. A nicely pressed button up shirt, good cologne, etc… My wife even asked me if my shirt was new.
Like Jessica M said in the previous post, it’s just so confusing and I want to make sure I am not doing anything to sabotage things. Some of the comments from my W over the last couple days baffle me. Some of them include:
“I hope you are having a nice time with the kids right now. I know this is really hard and I really, truly hope that you are doing okay!”
“Hang in there... Happy Father’s Day”
“Kids and I have had a nice day alone today. I'll send you some pictures from my phone”
She also called me this morning to go over some logistics and to let me that our son is having a tough time with all of this. W started to cry when I was opening up gifts from the kids yesterday and she did the same when she called me this morning.
I feel her comments are genuine however when she makes statements like “hang in there, I know it’s hard, I hope you’re doing ok” It just makes me wonder, because I don’t show her that I am hurting. I am just over analyzing the comments but I don’t want W to pity me and they are comments that seem to allude that I am down in the dumps, why that might be so, I do a darn good job acting “as if”, that I have GAL and that things are good. I would love some outsider input of what to make of this? Thanks for any feedback.
Me(M):37 W:42 T: 14 M: 11 S: 1 D: 1 W wanted separation 5/5 Stopped living together 5/5
Help please! Ok, my W has always had a good relationship with my mother and she’s always lived just a couple minutes away. They love each other and they both value the relationship between the two of them. As we all probably know, many of us are in sitches that effects a lot of people in our lives. Anyway here’s my dilemma.
My W just sent my mother an email and W also cc’d me. Here’s a couple excerpts from the message from my W to my mother.
1. “I know that this is extremely hard on everyone. H seems to be putting on a happy face but I don’t exactly know what that means.”
2. “I want you to know, as I have said before, that I love you and you will always be my family no matter what happens! I am not sure if you would ever be up for meeting for a bite to eat or drinks, but I would love to see you! Our relationship may be different but it can be redefined. Let me know if you’d like to meet. We don’t have to talk about H and the difficult stuff”
So, what should I do? Even though my W says they don’t have to talk about the difficult stuff, I think it would be inevitable. I know my mother likes my W and I’ve spoke to my mother a lot about my sitch and she would always paint a good picture of me since I’ve given her my DB strategies ,she wouldn’t ever relay them to my W. Also, she’s my mother so I am not concerned on that end.
The main problem is that my mother will tell my W how hard it is on her. I don’t want my W to feel guilty from the comments my mother says. The two of them meeting just seems like a slippery slope and I feel it could cause more harm than good. I wonder if this would be crossing boundaries?
While they have free choice to see one another, I know my mother would avoid a meeting with my W at my suggestion. Am I missing something here? Do you think it could be a good thing for them to get together or do you think there’s a chance this could cause more harm. Just need to weigh this one out.
Love to all the fellow DB’ers out there! We are all probably going through the most difficult times in our lives. Your guidance and support is something I will never forget and always be thankful for.
Me(M):37 W:42 T: 14 M: 11 S: 1 D: 1 W wanted separation 5/5 Stopped living together 5/5
“Nothing can stop the man with the right mental attitude from achieving his goal; nothing on earth can help the man with the wrong mental attitude”. Thomas Jefferson
I saw your post on the piecing forum. Reading your thread I haven't seen what your W's complaints about you were or the reason she gave for wanting to separate. What were they? What's her side of this?
Did you two come up with a "separation agreement" that spells out if you'll date other people or not, if you'll expose them to the kids or not, etc. etc.? There's a book that I believe is called "Controlled Separation" that provides guidance on how to manage separation, may be worth a read.
What books have you read, what have you learned about yourself? Did you ever do MC with W, and if so, did it help?
Your post above references that your wife was distant and left you feeling unsatisfied in the marriage for a long time. Can you give us more history? How long did you date before you got married? Who pursued whom? Was there a time when you felt she was very in love with you, and if so, when did that change?
Were there any defining events in your marriage that drove a wedge between you? What were they?
If you give us more to go on we may be of more help. In the meantime, keep doing what you're doing, give her space, act as if, GAL, etc.
The cold behavior you're seeing from her is not uncommon. You're locked in a game of "distancer chicken" and she doesn't want to be the one to crack first. When you stop pursuing her, and stop sharing intimate information with her, that makes her uncomfortable. She likes it much more if you're "on the shelf" waiting for her should she decide to return -- it's an insurance policy.
You do need to take that policy away. That's not to say that you're not interested in reconciling -- you are, but the point is you're not just going to wait around until she decides she's interested, you're going to live your life and take what comes.
When you pull back, she will pull back more. This is a ploy to get you to pursue her again. She wants to make you uncomfortable enough to come running back professing your love and telling her that you miss her, etc. It's a self-esteem boost for her and a return of the comfortable insurance policy. Don't do it. Eventually one of two things will happen -- either she'll make an overture to you (or start pursuing you), or she won't.
In the first case, you'll be tempted to think that she's back to the table -- be careful! Once you re-engage you may find that she withdraws again. Expect that may happen so that you're not crushed when it does. In the second case, there are three explanations: (1) you haven't given it enough time, she needs more space, (2) you have been backsliding, pursuing her, or not following DB, or (3) there is OM involved and she is getting her needs met elsewhere.
Given the abrupt nature of your split, I would be very surprised if she wasn't involved in at least an EA. People almost never jump without somewhere to land, so staying in an estranged marriage is usually preferable to being alone (unless there is abuse). If there is OM involved, then you need to set your expectations -- you're in for a LONG wait, it could be 8 months to 2 years before that ends and she emerges from the fog. During that time, you will not be able to make much progress, but you can certainly make things much worse. Your goal is to make her WONDER what you're up to, make her QUESTION if she really knows all about you that there is to know, and to begin to see you as a happy independent person.
I think you're doing the right things so far, keep at it. Managing your expectations is often the hardest part. It takes a woman months to decide to leave a marriage that is not meeting her needs, despite the fact that it feels to you like it happened overnight. Something that's been months in the making can't be repaired in weeks.
Accuray
Married 18, Together 20, Now Divorced M: 48, W: 50, D: 18, S: 16, D: 12 Bomb Dropped (EA, D): 7/13/11 Start Reconcile: 8/15/11 Bomb Dropped (EA, D): 5/1/2014 (Divorced) In a New Relationship: 3/2015
I don’t think it could be said much better than that. Thank you for your time and effort to understand my sitch. Some of the books I’ve read include Love Must Be Tough by Dr. James Dobson, literature by Homer McDonald and DR. We haven’t come up with a formal separation agreement however we’ve been working amicably on some of the terms. Now, if I want more accurate guidance I need to let the skeletons out of the closet.
My W and I were together for about 4 years before we got married. After a couple years of marriage my W got pregnant with our first son. I made one of the biggest mistakes in my life. While my W was pregnant, I had a 3 month affair with a lady I met at my work. My W found out about it and I ended the affair before our son was born. An affair is bad enough, but to do it while my W was pregnant. I am ashamed of myself, we went to MC, my W worked towards forgiveness and I’ve spent years working on rebuilding trust.
After time, I felt we were on the right track and a couple years later we had our second child and our financial situation was in good shape. Then our financial situation went downhill and it’s been that way for years now. I was self-employed for 4 years, we had collection accounts, backed taxes and my wife was even garnished once for one of my medical bills. Since then, I went to work for an employer and I’ve had consistent income for the last 3 years. In our 14 years together I’ve never been out of work for more then maybe a week at the most. I haven’t been making the same amount of money as I used to and my W works part time.
Besides her complaints about finances, she feels she does everything. Getting our taxes filed, setting up payment arrangements with creditors, etc… While all this was taking place I had been sleeping on the couch for years, she seemed to have lost all respect for me and we were in “stand still mode” and not working towards solutions. During this process I felt alienated from my W, she had physically and emotionally withdrawn and I did all the wrong things for years. I was insecure, needy and when she consistently rejected my advances I would argue with her about it and still continue to make the advances with the same dismal results. Over the course of time, we both ended up with anxiety and depression.
We’ve been living beyond our means for years. Over the last 6 months my W started using Facebook obsessively, losing a lot of weight, buying attractive clothes, new hairstyle, locking her phone and computer and talking with her single friends more. (A lot of the telltale signs of OM)
We tried a loan modification recently and we got denied. My W comes from a fairly successful family, her father put all their kids through college and my mother in law has never had to work a day in her life. My W has told me multiple times that she wished I was like her dad. Yes, I have made a lot of mistakes over the years however I am sorry, I am not her dad. To sum it up, our house went into foreclosure and that was her final straw.
Me(M):37 W:42 T: 14 M: 11 S: 1 D: 1 W wanted separation 5/5 Stopped living together 5/5
“Nothing can stop the man with the right mental attitude from achieving his goal; nothing on earth can help the man with the wrong mental attitude”. Thomas Jefferson
That's a lot of useful detail. The book "His Needs, Her Needs" talks about the 10 most important emotional needs that people have in marriage:
Affection
Sexual Fulfillment
Conversation
Recreational Companionship
Honesty and Openness
Physical Attractiveness
Financial Support
Domestic Support
Family Commitment
Admiration
The trap that many of us get into is that we do an excellent job providing for the needs that we most value, and neglect the ones we do not. If your spouse happens to value a different set, then you're heading for trouble.
Some of these will be MOST valuable to your spouse, filling them will make them feel most loved, and will cause major problems if they're not met, but NONE of them can be neglected or resentments will build up and eventually overshadow the good.
It sounds to me like your W places a high value on Financial Support and Domestic Support, and feels you weren't meeting her needs on those two fronts. That should give you a good clue on where to focus with your 180's.
For domestic support, figure out how to start assuming that everything is YOUR responsibility and not hers. Go overboard in terms of making sure things are taken care of -- taxes paid, finances arranged, appliances fixed, yard work done, house clean, clutter eliminated, etc.
For financial support, speak with a financial planner or a lawyer and put together a plan to get out of debt. Work with the financial planner on a budget so that you're not living beyond your means. That's going to be a big, painful adjustment, but that's the kind of hard work you need to do on yourself to dig your way out of this. It's going to require sacrifice.
The other thing that would really help would be to make more money. I know you can't snap your fingers and magically make that happen, but start working on a plan to get there. Learn new skills? Find a better job? Start working on a career path. Even if you're perfectly satisfied with your job and with what you make, your W is not, it's a love killer for her, so if she's the one you want, you need to address that issue.
I would evaluate yourself on all 10 -- how important is each one to W, how well do you do fulfilling it? Note that affection is not foreplay, it's creating a climate of affection that does not lead to the bedroom.
VERY IMPORTANT: Do not discuss with W, don't work with her on your plans. Don't tell her about any of this, just start living it. She'll notice, don't point it out. Pointing it out makes it look like "an act" staged for her benefit. That's not what you want.
Accuray
Married 18, Together 20, Now Divorced M: 48, W: 50, D: 18, S: 16, D: 12 Bomb Dropped (EA, D): 7/13/11 Start Reconcile: 8/15/11 Bomb Dropped (EA, D): 5/1/2014 (Divorced) In a New Relationship: 3/2015
So sorry. It seems like you are doing the best that you can. Her wanting to have a relationship with your mother right now seems kind of weird given the situation. I can't imagine my husband trying to have a relationship with my parents. Not that they were close but still, he is the one that is divorcing me and separating from us.
Me:29; W:37 T: 6 M: 4 D: 2; SD: 14; SS: 17 H filed D: 6/13/12; H moved out: 6/14/12 H moved back in: 6/28/12 Confirmed EA: 8/12
