The Climb - Thread #6

[25yearsmlc]

Hey everyone. Pretty busy at work today but wanted to get a semi-quick summary of what happened Sunday night posted up here.

W was again sitting by herself outside on the deck, smoking and drinking wine. I went outside and told her I needed to talk to her. I told her that I am concerned about her drinking, for her, for me, and for our kids.

I then told her that it feels like she is drinking so she can "put up with being around me". She concurred.

GEE, too bad she can't possibly learn a new coping skill (other than booze) for the PAIN of being around a decent man who, by his nature, highlights HER shortcomings...good grief...

I told her that I will not live with someone that has to drink just to be around me and that I never in a million years imagined that someone would need to do so. I then used an analogy of me being someone's boss and them feeling like they had to drink so they could come to work. I think that helped her see that maybe I'm not the problem here. I dunno.

She responded with telling me she feels like I expect so much of her and that she feels judged. I told her that I think my expectations of her are next to nothing, and defintiely far less than a typical marriage. I also pointed out that I hadn't said a single thing about her in this convo, I was only telling her how I feel and what I am no longer willing to tolerate.

Then I told her I am "in the place" (using her favorite term) where I will not live like this anymore. If I am that bad of a person that she needs to be drunk and put on an act of pseudo-happiness just to be around me, I don't want to be with her. She is free to leave.

Then she tried going down the road of our past and all the horrible things I did to her. I stopped her before she got very far


BLESS YOU for doing that!^^^ It serves you and HER well! THIS IS HUGE!!


and said I have owned and fixed those things, and I can't do anything more about that than I already have.

CRUCIAL TO POINT OUT, REPEATEDLY...she does NOT get it. If you are already working on your issues and problems then they are no longer real problems...b/c they are being worked on!

Sounds simple but it's true!

If you identify a problem & are working to solve it, then move on to the NEXT issue b/c the first problem is already identified and being worked on...but some folks, well, they like staying stuck on the problem you USED to have...

Way to go Navy, way to go....

I then went back to telling her I am not willing to accept her current behavior.

Then she said she didn't know what it would "look like" if we split up and how we could make it work. I told her I hadn't really thought about it much, because I have always believed our marriage could be saved.

Ideally - you'd stress that YOU had given thought to how much BETTER life would be, without HER nasty carping and constant belittling...but hey, we aren't in an ideal world...

my point is, so, she wants YOU to show HER how to treat you? B/c she does not know how to be kind????

I'm not sure you can. But maybe??

So, how do you teach an angry "victim" wife, how to be decent to her partner and co=parent husband?

Personally, and hey, I could be way wrong,

but I think she needs a workshop or counselling that goes beyond a weekly session of how or why she got here,

and more about how her PAST affects HER & YOU today...enough already about the past!

She needs a major shift in her paradigm or she'll keep mistreating you...

and that shift won't happen without a dramatic form of intervention or a life changing event,

which is why I suggested the weekend workshop. (Check out "Essential Experience" on the east coast for a great example of DBing in real life)

Enough about what happened TO HER in the past, and time to start focussing on what SHE IS DOING NOW...


Then I speculated a bit on what it would be - we would have to have separate places to live (probably crummy apartments for awhile), she would have to get a job, and we would have to figure out some sort of custody arrangement with the kids. And I said it without fear. I acknowledged that it would be hard and painful, but that I think it would better than our current life.


it would be better!!! How can it not be?

I told her that I don't want to go down that road, but right now it is more appealing to me than continuing like this. I don't want to be a part-time dad, but I am not willing to subject myself and my kids to this life anymore.

The convo went on for awhile longer, but I stuck to my guns regarding her behavior and letting her know that I am no longer afraid of divorce.

I told her I don't need or expect a response right now, but just wanted to let her know where I am at. I ended the convo there, and went to bed.

I know this fell short of me telling her that I'm completely "done", but I think she got the message and knows that the clock's ticking...

yeah we know, maybe you coulda said this or that, and no one is perfect.

But I think you did frickn' GREAT!!!!!


((((( )))))

[Navyguy]

Bond, I was saying what a bad person I am in something of a facetious manner - maybe it didn't come across that way, I dunno.

So today there's more fun:

Ohio BFF is taking a vacation in North Carolina and decided she'd stop in DC for the night and stay at a friends' house and invited W to hang out with them.

This friend happens to be a guy who I don't know and I think W has only met once before a long time ago.

BFF first stopped at our house, so I saw her and her son. It was a bit awkward but I handled it pretty well. Then her and W left to go hang out at this guy's house. I figured W would be out late.

At midnight I get a text:

"Hey, I'm staying with BFF tonight. I'll be home before you have to leave from work."

I replied: Ok, is everything all right?

Her reply: Yeah, BFF wanted to hang out longer and I had a few glasses of wine and probably shouldn't drive. There is a futon in the basement I can use, so I'll have a sleepover with BFF and her son and come home in the morning.

I went to sleep.

W got home around 6 AM.

Ok, no big deal.

Then around 10:30 today, this guy posts on W's FB page:

"What's up? We are out to breakfast"

W replies: "wish I could have hung around for breakfast, sounds delightful! You guys have fun! I am watching cartoons and drawing some pictures."

Now W is obviously not trying to hide anything here...she knows I can see her FB page. I'd probably be more concerned if he had posted and she had quickly deleted it. But this seems pretty out of line to me...

I'm pretty sure W wouldn't appreciate me going out with a friend, spending the night at some random woman's house, and then her posting on my FB page the next morning and me replying in a very friendly/almost flirtacious manner.

So...do I talk to her about this? Tell her how this makes me feel? Or just wait and see if anything else happens? Or just tell myself F it and that I don't even care?

[MrBond]

I'm going to go out on a limb here.

Rather than being p@ssed off at her about it, how about being nice to her about it?

I'm not exactly sure where you feel insulted by what she did. She told you she was staying over with the friend and son and she told you when she'd be back. It's not like she stayed at the guy's house alone.

I think you're letting all the stress of the talk get to you. Right now she's looking at doing things that take her mind off of your sitch. Whether its drinking or hanging out with someone, it's what she's going to do. Confronting her about it isn't going to do any good.

[scaredsilly]

Just my opinion Navy but her reply didn't strike me as flirtatious. I know it's hard to read about her GAL but mr. Bond's advice seems right on.

[25yearsmlc]

yep both SS and Bond are spot on. Navy, I'm the last person who'll defend your w

but I didn't get any weirdness from her FB posts at all. Didn't sound flirtatious at all.

Watching cartoons/drawing pictures is NOT a sexual declaration, it's a mommy thing...if anything, she sounds domesticated in that post. I was a bit pleasantly surprised.

Plus, the guy (not the son, right?) posting on her page doesn't sound as if he had "been with" your wife physically. If he had been, there'd have been no curiousity about where she was or why she wasn't having breakfast with them, etc.

The whole issue of the sleep over might be a valid concern but you did say yes, and then
she covered it with the no drinking/driving story so that's not something you can really argue about if this is a once a year deal. (When I say "Covered it" I mean she covered her bases. From what you've said about her drinking, it's probably true that she had too much).

In sum, your wife has plenty of behaviors for you to object to, but Pick your battles wisely!

[Navyguy]

Yeah, that is what I was leaning toward and wanted to check sure here before I did anything stupid.

[kolja]

Probably a good call - I certainly know it's hard to separate things like this from the broader context of what's going on your in your marriage; I definitely had the same problem back in October when things were certainly not great in ours and my wife was in Las Vegas with a few girlfriends of hers. With the way things were it was hard not to feel like it was more salt in the wound and I definitely reacted poorly - and publicly, and now rather wish I hadn't; it certainly gave her more things not to like when she made the decision she did. Certainly doesn't seem like a 'hill to die on' for me, and a good instance for 'studied underreaction'

[Navyguy]

Lol 25 I wasn't worried about the cartoons and pictures...our entire house is covered with our kids' artwork. It was more that the guy who she just met felt the need to ask her "what's up". Just seems strange...but not her fault either.

And no, it's not the son...he's 9.

While I have drawn the line with the drinking, and it is very hard to understand why she seems to want to "end" our family, I do think that overall W is a good mother...and our kids love her very very much.