I didn't see it coming...but now I see everything

[Denver_2010]

Take some time and think about that. What is it that this guy is giving her that she has not been receiving from you? - He made her feel like an attractive, fun to be around woman and desired her and openly flirted with her.

For me, it will mean being more creative with my compliments on how she looks, making her feel confident, sexy and wanted. Being there to listen to her thoughts, feelings and events and reacting to her in a positive way.

Initiating more physical contact & flirting - being more spontaneous, being more affectionate in public.

standing my ground on what I believe in - and ideally working with my wife to compromise how we resolve our differences & always make up affectionately.




Have you read the chapter in DR about the Last Resort Technique (LRT)? Yes, I've read That thanks Denver and a lot of it is hard to put in place living under the same roof - hence yesterday's episode. But I'm continuing to work on myself & trying to listen more & more to what my W wants.

I know that you are disappointed that your W does not want to go on the family vacation. But do you really want to go with this person as things stand now? I'd suggest telling her that she is right, that she shouldn't go. But that you are going to go. - I 100% want her there for the kids - they are only 6 and 8 - 2 weeks without their mum on a holiday of a lifetime is just plain wrong. Even if we fake it, the kids come first - on that holiday & in general.

You're going to need to detach big time now.

As for her asking for divorce goes? Well, I guess it depends on what you decide about waiting things out. If you want to save your marriage, then, IMO, you need to buy as much time as possible. So, don't bring this back up. If and when she does, I'd suggest telling her something like what I told my W when she brought up the D word: To be fair, she isn't ready for that & we discussed that last night - I think she does just need space & if she still wants a separation, come the 8th of May - I will move out for a trial separation - and we can just keep an open dialogue on how we both feel if things change. I can't move out at the moment - not working & too much stress with UNI - couldn't deal with the kids reaction on top of all that as well right now.

"W, I've told you before that I still love u and still think that we can have a great life together as both a couple and a family. I have not changed my mind on that. But I understand that you are not happy, that u don't feel happy or complete inside. U need to do what will make u happy. By my side, we can be partners and will share everything and we would do anything to help one another. But that's only if we continue as a team. but I won't stand in your way, but also won't help u leave this marriage or our family. I hope that u do find happiness u r looking for. go do what u need to do. You know where I will be." - Good Advice & well said

As for what I mean when I say "lovingly detach"? When I asked what this meant, the best definition that I got came from Jack3Beans. He said (I fixed his spelling errors - You're welcome Jack!):

"Lovingly detach...Pretty word that 'lovingly'. Beats angsty I suppose. To me detach means to not get drawn into their drama, not allow yourself to react to their bad actions either directly toward or in directly. Lovingly, I suppose means... If you child was throwing a tantrum for no reason, you'd ignore them (possibly), but be around and comfort them later when their tantrum was over." - totally get the definition of lovingly detach now - Thanks Denver / Jack

I feel like I'm all over the board with what I'm telling you Bill and not being as clear as I'd like. Part of the problem is that you are still in the same home as your W, and I was not. It was easier for me to detach (not saying that it was easy or that I was all that successful). And it was easier for me to go dark on my W when I needed to. I would suggest that as well, but it is not going to be easy with her in the same home as you. So mainly, you need to stop engaging her in conversation, and when she engages, be polite, but don't get drawn in. I actually think that not asking her about her doctor's appointment was good (unless it was a life threatening thing of course). Stay away from R talk at all costs right now. Be a good dad, GAL as much as you can, especially away from home if you can. Detach, detach, detach... try to have a positive mental attitude... and if you can't, fake it til you make it. She needs to see that you are a positive thinking person and that you are upbeat, even if things are cr*ppy for you right now. No one wants to be around a depressed person. If you need to cry or be upset, go for a drive, or go for a walk. Don't do it in front of her. No more temper tantrums in front of her. (totally agree) you are right, they are damaging, and definitely not what you want to be doing.

Go read the chapter on LRT and come up with a plan as to how you are going to implement it. Set a time frame on which you are going to stick with your plan, say 2 weeks, and then reassess.

You need a plan, a strategy, and then you need to stick to it.

- My plan is to just keep focusing on making me a better person, being supportive & receptive of when my W needs me - being there for her & being the best dad I can be. Those are vague - and I will get some specific ones written down though that I'm thinking of in relation to 180's for me & my sitch.
Denver

Thanks Denver, your advice means a lot to me.

Bill

I get what you are saying Bill, but until she is shown what she stands to lose if she continues with her actions, she has no reason to reflect on her choices or change her behavior.

I would strongly advise that you NOT move out of your home. She is the one choosing this. NOT YOU.

Again, lovingly detach. You state that you are going to continue to be there for her. If you are, why would she choose to change her behavior?? She has the best of both worlds. This has been something that I have struggled balancing as well. You want to be the "lighthouse", but you also have to show some tough love. She has to see that she stands to lose her husband if she stays on the current path... but not only that, she needs to also see what she will be missing when she loses you.

I fear that she is not going to come anywhere close to seeing her life without you as long as you continue to be there for her.

You have to find a way to detach from her and show her that you are capable and willing to move on with your life happily. Otherwise, you will be spinning your wheels for a very long time.

Yes, your kids come first, but I do not see any reason why you can't take them on this vacation without your W. SHE is choosing this path Bill! Not you. There has to be consequences for that choice. One of those consequences will be that she does not get to go on nice "family" vacations. Will you continue to go on vacation with her if she Ds you? Will you continue to go on vacation if she continues on with OM?

I've lived much of this Bill. Some things I have done right, others I have not. One thing that I wish that I had done much earlier was show my W that I would not be a part of her life as long as OM was. I did not set and enforce that boundary until I was a good 8 months into my situation. I could have knocked months off of my misery had I done so. I truly believe that.

Be a good person, a good dad, take care of your duties around the house. But this person is not your W right now.

Denver