My Sitch/any better ideas than going dark?

[25yearsmlc]

Broken,

you seem to be running out of options so I went over your earlier post. This may feel like a 2 x 4 but it's intended to shake up your perspective and viewpoint a lot.

You are still making this about how wrong she is for not giving you another chance and that won't get you anywhere. And for the record, what do you mean when you say you have accepted responsibility for your part of the problems?

The more you condemn her actions, the less you sound like someone working on himself to improve...

Hi folks,

First time post here, I have read many of your stories and my heart goes out to you. I have Divorce Busting and Divorce Remedy and am working my way through both of them. My drama has been going on since before August 2011, as with many I have been doing all the wrong things, especially during the holidays looking back, so I am going black today to try and get some type of different response from my wife.

So a little history. This is my second marriage, I met her the same month my first divorce was finalized which probably was an issue in and of itself. Beautiful, smart, caring, loving young woman. She also was bankrupt due to issues in her first marriage, and has three children by two different men, father of the first is incarcerated for shooting someone in the back during a robbery attempt. Her home life growing up was not stable at all. She is 30 and her children are 16, 11, and 7. I never got the details of the entire story but she said she was raped but decided to keep the first child. The second and third child were fathered by someone who was effectively a deadbeat dad and left her bankrupt. So she had one child at 14, a second child at 19, and the third at 23. She also had an abortion at some point, I think after the third child on the realization that they could not handle a fourth child and then had her tubes tied. In addition to this her mother has been married I think 6 times in total. So all in all, she has had much adversity in her life. She is very smart, beautiful, is very hardworking and very successful in her career, and is a salt of the earth woman which is why I married her.

I guess there is a valid reason for all this info ^^^ but ito me, it also smells a bit like you want an explanation of this event that places responsibility on her or her past. I am not sure how useful all this is b/c

DBing is a solution based approach, NOT focussed on the how and why you got here but how can you help your situation now.


Then there is me, 37, no kids, successful corporate guy with my own bag of issues. Some being my selfishness and infidelity in my first marriage, my cheating on my second wife while we were dating (I never even looked at another woman during our marriage however). I also have significant self esteem issues that led to a womanizing streak between the marriages that’s really a long story for another forum.


hmm ^^^ this is a rather summary explanation of some character flaws that would give any woman pause. IT also sounds like pretty selfish behavior. I DO NOT mean to bash you, but I want you to look at how you see YOUR flaws as more "easily remedied" or explained, than when the shoe is on the other foot.

IN short, you must learn empathy for HER point of view or you'll get nowhere. IT's a big quality to have and a huge one to lack
.

We met in February of 2009 and got married in May of 2010. I asked her to marry me because I obviously wanted her to be my wife, and to prove to her that I was done messing with any other women.


you married her to prove you were going to be faithful?

We got engaged in December 2009, I moved in with her at this time and our relationship was very good during this time in my opinion (probably mainly because I wasn’t going out at all and staying with her 100% of the time). She had self esteem issues with her body based on my prior actions and some things I had said, so I went to bat with 22k of plastic surgery for her just prior to our getting married in May.


Wow...ALARMS RINGING....!!!!

So you DID some things (but you won't say what) and you SAID some remarks (also vague on those) that affected her self esteem about her body image--and instead of stopping that destructive behavior (and finding out why you would say such cruel things and sabotage her self image)

YOUR SOLUTION was to get her plastic surgery?? That only confirms that she had a defect or problem that needed repair....it feeds right into a low self esteem.

I cannot imagine that helped HER self esteem or your r....

even now you seem to think you were kind or generous to do it. You skim over the actions you did and you don't tell us the type of remarks you made but you do tell us the cost/price of the surgery "you gave" her... All this, and quoting the actual cost/price strikes me as odd.


I also helped her work out selling her house to a family member which allowed her to climb out of bankruptcy, and bought us a house in April of 2010, to allow her to get sole custody of her kids as well as give them their own rooms for the first time. Bought her a new car for her birthday in August of 2010 which was also a first. Her love language was receiving gifts so I definitely have done my part in this regard.


So she was not working through all of this time^^^? Why do you think that her love language is gifts? And all this discussion of the THINGS you gave her ---is it helping you to understand the marriage problems?

Or is it more about making yourself feel better?

Up to this point I probably sound like a dream come true but that is certainly not the case.

wow...sorry but, not to me.

I had an alcohol problem, didn’t drink a lot but when I did I would get plowed and was verbally abusive toward her on a number of occasions. In all honesty I don’t know many of the things I said to her, but I feel that many of them were brought on by the financial pressures that existed since I was burdened by all our financial obligations.

Were you drinking when you made the comments about her body that caused her to get extensive plastic surgery? You are, again, letting yourself off the hook for your negative traits as if they are minor and excusable.

Sounds to me pretty simple--you gave her presents but You were also often mean to her. Your unkindness did serious damage to the marriage and your r's with the kids.

The financial obligations were your choice too....don't do favors if you're going to resent the person later and mistreat them, as it is sooo not worth it.


She was certainly contributing significantly to the household, but all of the credit was in my name and there was no support being provided for the children except she an I.

So you were financial partners and she earned money? Why continue on in there about her ex's not paying and how you were more or less a victim in the situation?

You are portraying yourself as a victim. Do you see how this point of view does NOT HELP YOU?


I also had a hard time with the transition to the role of stepfather. I was always nice to the kids and gave them plenty of things, but I was not as generous with my time and attention and affection toward them as I should have been and I very much regret that.

sounds like how you were to your w.

You gave them or her THINGS, but your behavior was not loving or kind and you did not give them time and attention, so to me it's the same treatment really. I would guess one of her love languages is quality time together b/c you stated that you got along well when you were together and engaged...

you seem to think you were with her too much but my guess is she wanted that (and you didn't??)




So there were a number of altercations

as a L, that^^ word conjures up some pretty dramatic images to me. IF you are using the word correctly

then the "altercations" were all traumatic for HER and her children. You need to See that.

we had in 2011, and I will take responsibility for most of those based on my verbal abuse after drinking. We ended up physically separating in September 2011 (I took on all the marital debt including the remainder of her surgical expenses)

I don't know about your debt issues, but seriously, the surgery? To still mention it as if it was a favor to her, and yet a burden to you, is off putting to me. Sorry.

Not to mention how you glossed over your mistreatment of her again.


at which point I stopped drinking and was making every effort to put 100% into trying to reconcile our situation.


so when you realized you were losing her, you chose to change? Not so unusual here.

The problem was, that my wife had already started an online relationship with another man, and coereced me into leaving the home that I built for us on the guise of “giving us some time”



What? now you were "coerced"? You were fighting and you say you were abusive...and drinking too much. Seriously man, you have to stop blaming her and letting yourself off the hook so much ---or YOU will not change ---and you'll be here again after your next r fails.

while she was talking to this other man for hours on end and planning weekend getaways with him. She lied about this when I presented the fact that she started talking a blocked number at all hours of the night the night that I left our marital home.


Given your history, how do you truly think you would have reacted to her confessing it?

Why would SHE expect anything but more anger from you? Do you see how she felt now? You don't have to agree, but you do have to understand another point of view...

This really becomes a hair splitting matter of timing I guess, because our last altercation was while she was on a business trip to Minnesota, at which point she says that was the breaking point of our marriage. This was never exactly clear to me.

the exact timing is not important...and I think you see that now.


We continued to see each other at times, I spent a number of nights over at the house, and on October 9th had two of my stepchildren and took them to a band competition that my stepson was in. That night I came back to my house and came in because I brought them dinner back, and found a gmail account with all of the communications, naked pictures back and forth etc proving her dealings with this other man. I contacted this man and told him to leave my wife alone and confronted her with this information. I told her we could get past this and that I forgave her and wanted to work on our marriage. In response she filed a 50B restraining order against me on the basis of she was fearful for her and her childrens safety when I had never laid a hand on nor threatened anyone. She put this order in place because I busted up her affair and her affair partner dumped her at this point supposedly.

so you don't think your temper or negative behavior had anything to do with the restraining order? AND You were perfectly calm throughout the communications with her

AND WITH OM? Why do you say the reason she asked for the order (Which the court granted) was b/c you "busted up her affair"? Did SHE SAY THAT?


Despite the 50B being in place we continued to communicate at times. She was no longer comfortable living in our house because it was in my name, so she persued another rental property. I provided her funds to get into this rental property and she swore she was no longer corresponding with the prior affair partner. Much to my surprise this was not the case, and when I saw a Mercedes in front of her new house one Sunday morning without thinking I just knocked and walked in because I wanted to meet the individual who was interfering with my attempts to reconcile my marriage. My wife called the cops and I spent the night in jail for violating the 50B restraining order. She swears up and down and I believe that she is not romantically involved with this other man.

...what changes were YOU making in yourself to help reconcile the marriage?

Ironically we continued to communicate, and ended up spending time together over Christmas and New Years even having sex a couple of times. I continued my gift giving trying to give her and the children the best Christmas possible, culminating in helping her get into a BMW that she had always wanted. She is paying for the car I just helped her with the financing.

how about the verbal abuse? Did that stop? And the drinking? And how were your interactions w/her kids other than you spending money on them?

To me it seems your love language is giving gifts, but that does not mean it's the recipients love language. And for sure as a parent, I can assure you the kids want time and attention more than anything else...fyi

After new years I finished the arrangements for renting the marital home and have moved about 30 minutes away from her. We really haven’t seen each other significantly since new years.

Her statements continue to be that “I can’t force the walls down to let you back in”. By all accounts from her the marriage is over and there is no chance of our reconciling.

In my heart I know that she still loves me. I take ownership of the things that I did to hurt her, but when you take a sum total of our relationship the good far outweighs the bad. I have stopped drinking, strengthened my relationship with God, and made many other changes but none of these things had helped our situation at all.


what are your 180s? And what SPECIFIC behaviors have you changed? The more specific you are, the more believable the changes...

also consistent change + sufficient time = change she can believe in.

IMO, I'd Stop the gifts and work on the behaviors.

Seems you have expectations that attach with the gift giving, so it smacks of "buying love" and that backfires.


Our last positive communication was January 3rd, she said “Just want to say thank you for everything you’ve done for me and the kids over the holidays. You always take good care of me and I appreciate it. I need some time alone though, I’m not seeing or talking to anybody. I’m just spending time alone. I need some time to get myself and life together. I want you to be happy though, so I encourage you to date other people.”

Then I sent her this “Love is a cycle. When you love, you get hurt, when you get hurt, you hate. When you hate, you try to forget, when you try to forget, you start missing. And when you start missing, you’ll eventually fall in love again”.

To which she responded: “You need to learn to let me miss you”.

So in short, I really screwed up during the holidays. I should have “went dark” during that time as I still met her wants and needs during that time while still being treated like a doormat.


are you saying YOU were treated like a doormat? How so? She's been very clear with you that you need to back off so she CAN miss you but you don't seem to hear that.

And how can you say you met her wants and needs? If you had, you would be together now. I really don't get your view of this.



So I am going dark as of today. The 50B order expires on 2/13. I had extravagant plans for Valentines day but am going to scrap all of those. My only hope is that that day with no contact from me will be a really significant shock to her system. By her own admission I have always made her dreams come true. I can’t figure out to make her realize that I have a changed heart and want to do nothing but be happy with her and our family.


I'll read the rest of your thread but seems to me you have been missing the boat on what she needs vs what you want to give.

And the idea that you were a perfect mate before, doesn't help your cause. It shows lack of insight.

Dig a lot deeper in you and you may get somewhere.

Any thoughts or better ideas than going dark at this point? I feel like the last resort technique is my only hope. Thanks in advance for any feedback you can provide, God Bless you all. :-)

I'd start behaving differently if given the chance-- (& frankly, even if you aren't given the chance. ) This is your 3rd m.