Beatrice, I agree with 100 percent of what you said. I filed because my ex was spending like crazy. I would have been left with nothing and I had to protect the children. If I had not filed, I don't believe I still would have remained married to ex. He had been consulting with attorneys for months. He had OW in an apartment and was ready to start his new life. I don't believe in divorce either, nor did I want one, but I felt I had no other choice. The ML'er is unpredictable and many don't come out of it.
Me: 46 H:44 Together: 25 years Married: 20 years Separated: 11-30-06 Divorced 12-21-07 OW: EA began 2005 PA began end of 2006 3 children,20, 16, 6 ex asked for forgiveness 01/16/11
And while its true that sometimes, you may win some, you might lose some too.
Everything is a risk. YOu want to make sure of your money? You might lose your husband....on the other hand, you waited for your husband, but ended up losing him plus your money too. Oh well... who ever said life is easy....
So I guess in the end it all depends upon what you value most. And what you are willing to lose. If Wendy feels that it was a single statement that was only a passing thought, does she really have to move? Did her husband show signs of fiscal irresponsibility aside from that comment?
We all view the world from our own experience so that is why for me, even when my H was spending more than usual during his MLC, I did notice that he was very sensitive about me doubting him in that aspect and even once told me that he would never put us in a financial bind.... so although i kept my eyes and ears open, I was careful not to let my doubts show.
Me:49 H:45 D:12 M:14 T:18 Bomb: 6/26/10 EA: 9/3/10, fizzled out slowly, now ??? 11/5/11 Retrouvaille Finally piecing.... Its peaceful at last, but we got a looong way to go
Thanks for your thoughts. I will say that sometimes I can read him like a book, other times, muddy water.
To his credit, when he presented the plan he said he knew half the money was mine, he planned to give me more out of the proceeds from the sale of the house.
And I am pretty well protected, as he is retired military, and due to the length of our marriage I would have half of his retirement, survivors benefit plan and life insurance that would most likey stay in place.
If it were about money I would have already been divorced! I still love the guy and do know the nice guy must still be in there somewhere!
He has made several moves in the past few days to show me he is willing to stay together and work it out. Besides talking about it, that is!
He changed his radio station, because the one he listens to reminds him of her. (Applauding the 1%)
He asked me to speak to OW's STBX at yoga, to get him to check in on her, or have someone check on her, as the suicide threats continue. She also has lost over 30 pounds in the past 6 weeks.
No matter how mad I am at her and my H, I don't wish harm to her. Of course I believe part of it is her pulling everyones strings. But not eating and being that depressed is just scary.
An added bonus of talking to OW's STBX was hearing his view of what is going on. He said he offered to pack her up and bring her to our house. I said to him: "Thanks." He smiled.... He said she claimed to not want to leave him.
He told me he is deploying soon. She told my H he was being kicked out of the service.
By my H asking me to speak to OW's STBX he was also sending her the message that he is sharing decisions and information with me. Again, may not seem big to you all.
But in the past she got mad when he and I talked about anything personal to her that maybe she had shared with him and he shared with me. Part of how I figured out there was something going on between them. So apparently he doesn't care if she gets mad. Or wants her to get mad?
Today I was going to go to the beach by myself. Then I had a wild idea, call H and asked did he want to go for a picnic dinner to the beach. He said yes. So I came home after my workout, did some chores, packed up a nice picnic and we went when he got home from work. He even came home from work early!
I told him what I heard at yoga, and he has not brought it up again. I suspect he is thinking about it all. He is being nice to me, seems to be trying. I am giving him space and time.
I wanted the beach time, because he seems to enjoy activities together. But I'm not pushing it too hard.
Aloha,
Wendy
Me 57 XH 58 Sons age 32 & 27 M:32 D final 9/12 Bought 10 Acres and Living the Dream!
Good to hear that your h is being more reasonable. But if He is in a full on MLC - and these do not resolve quickly and in a matter of months, then he will say one thing one day and something completely different, even within the space of an hour or so. And not just about emotional stuff. For them money is part of the deal.
Of course it is not simply about money, but money is one of the dimensions, sadly, we have to think about. Am I said, I am glad I waited and even though I ended up worse off. But like you, because of protected pension rights being penniless was never an option. I totally understand those with children who have to act in order to protect themselves and their children. Some MLCers are very very mean and will abandon their financial responsibilities if they can, even to very young and dependent children.
It is ugly is you are on your own and poor, and older . . . . and alone!! Let us not lose our sense of humour and sense of self worth in all this! We matter, as well as our Marriage and our MLC spouse.
What I am trying to get across is that we can do our best, and they still leave us to go on with their journey. It isn't simply down to what we do and say, or don't do and say,and not helpful imho to add that burden of responsibility to everything else.
He told me he is deploying soon. She told my H he was being kicked out of the service.
Oh, she's a lying piece of work, isn't she???
There's a certain type of manipulative OW who is particularly good at playing the damsel in distress, at trying to usurp the life of someone they envy - she sounds like one of those. Stick to the high road, stay FAR away from her nuttiness, and your H will likely come to the realization eventually that she's a whack job. Just be prepared for a couple go rounds on the rollercoaster still - H's like yours do get a little addicted to the drama.
Regarding the OM or OW the probability is that this is a very needy person with lots of issues. Once the OM or OW start to make emotional demands the MLCer will run hard and fast from them too. They will be almost as nasty to them as to you.
The MLCer cannot stand needy, or emotional people. They want to be happy every minute of every hour of every day of their lives and they expect the OP to make this happen.
In my case W's OM thought he was her rescuer and very soon became her victim.
If one or other is a bit passive aggressive you can guarantee the whole relationship is built on a total pack of lies by one or both of them. Your H will have fabricated the history of your marriage to appear the victim, the OP is probably gullible, or co-dependent or at least very low self-esteem.
My wife's OM, got needy and made emotional requests/demands and had his life (in the short term anyway) destroyed by my W. His last words to my W 'Why did you do this to me?'. At the time I felt a bit sorry for him he had been in the wrong place at the wrong time.
Many MLCers appear to thrive on drama though - and the needy OP is often very good at whipping up a dramatic storm which conceals the underlying neediness for quite a while. They appear demanding in a way that appeals to the MLCer as they can gallop in as the rescuer.
An example: about a year into the affair my now xh was at a concert [with OW] organised by an old friend of mine. OW confronted this friend and attempted to create a very public scene, because my friend had criticised her behaviour regarding marred men [and my xh was by no means the first]. Now my xh loathed scenes as a rule, but he clearly thought that OW was defending herself as a victim, rather than causing an inappropriate public exhibition. This OW quarrelled with everyone, and threatened suicide and was generally a menace to herself and those around her, but it fascinated by xh for ages.
So it depends on the type of emotional demand that the OP makes . . .
Great discussions here! This may have been stated elsewhere above, but I really think that for at least some of the MLCers, this drama reminds them of a familiar family of origin dynamic (i.e. XH's mother was a recovering alcoholic) and may also release happy brain chemicals (e.g. dopamine) in the same way that scary movies, gambling, and adventure sports do. (My apologies to the literary folks out there for that long, run-on sentence above. :-P )
After the bomb, one of my wise neighbors (older woman) told me that she had observed in life that people from alcoholic families, who don't choose to change this dynamic, seem to seek chaos. 3 1/2 years post-bomb I see this pattern more clearly for XH. His 1st W had OCD and was anorexic. She was in and out of treatment for the last 5 years of their M. When I met H/XH I thought that was an indication of his level of commitment to M, but in retrospect I'm not so sure........XH's BMF has 2 illegitimate children and is a serial dater (lots of drama there). Once H/XH and I neared the end of our home remodeling project (this lasted 3 years) and life settled down, H/XH started getting really antsy. I WAS working too much but I didn't realize what a dangerous period this was for our M. H/XH has a need to socialize all the time that I think for him is a mood elevator. At that point in time I wasn't supplying his drug of choice so he made our R exciting again by dropping the bomb.
I totally agree with the premise that mclers have some underlying issues and I believe they're often rooted in childhood. The older I get theore I appreciate the truth in old sayings. These people were "damaged goods" when we met them and that's not saying we aren't too.
My X has to have something major going on in her life. I can look back and every summer of our M and every summer since has been marked with something major:
our marriage/opened business/became pregnant first child born relocated our business second child born daughter raped moved residence trial begins bookeeper takes all, disappears trial ends move residence again paternal figure death/mlc trigger separation
All that in 8 years (I left out the "minor" stuff)
Her father was a civil servant and she has said she lived in over 50 residences growing up, one outside the continental US. She was physically and sexually abused as a child, her mother divorced him (at the exact same age as when she divorced me and our D was the exact same age she was when her parents divorced). Her mother remarried a man who also sexually abused her.
Many of the mlc behaviors that have manifested themselves post-bomb I saw glimpses of during our marriage (mood swings, anger outbursts, physical violence, narcissism, spending sprees). There were changes in her at first trigger (maternal figure death) and they went into overdrive at paternal figure death. She also had a potentially life threatening medical diagnosis at the same time as paternal figure death which turned out to be a mis-diagnosis.
My C believes she has a borderline personality. I agree as she shows sign of multiple personality disorder, hypochondria, and bipolar disorder. She readily admits to having hypochondria and has described herself as being a bit "controlling".
As for me, I saw red flags along the way but never saw this mlc thing coming.
OMH got very nervously angry at X when she became jealous of my dating and was spewing at me. He said to her, "This is a major red flag".
He and will have to compare notes someday.
Sorry for tge hijack but I believe it's beneficial for us all to look back at our mlcers behaviors and history and then look at our own.
"Fear is the mind-killer" Muad'Dib Me 53, XW 44, DD 14, DS 12 Bomb and OM 12/15/06 Separated 01/02/07 Divorced 05/13/08 X married OM(OMH) 08/2009 Married 06/09/13
It is so funny to have people out there on the internet able to clearly see the future.......
My H didn't make it through Saturday without a complete back to her back to me swing. I spent another couple hours talking with him....... It is killing me.
I had remarked on what I was going to make for Superbowl food. It is just us, I made no plans due to his level of distress this week. I also had said I wanted to rearrange the master bedroom.
Suddenly he is back to geting himself (And the OW) a little house. I said, wow, that isn't what you said 2 days ago. He said some blah, blah, blah stuff. To which I went back over the whole conversation, including the parts where I made him clarify what our plan was.
He then said she wanted him to come over and watch the Superbowl with her. And then he started worrying about giving her equal time to talk to him, as there are three people involved,
I told him pretty plainly that if he decides to go back to her I won't take him back. I told him this is getting beyond silly. I told him he is really hurting me.
I then read him a few choice paragraphs out of Men in Midlife Crisis and The Sex Starved Marriage. Then sat him down and had him read Chapter 17 in the Conway book. The Marriage Knot.
Believe it of not, he was getting it. He sent her a text telling her he couldn't watch the game with her. Then asked me to go to a movie with him and he left his phone at home.
He told me he knows his best decision is to stay with me. He just doesn't know how to deal with the guilt over hurting her, and the fact that he still feels like he loves he.
I told him to cut communications, and to stop thinking about her. He is sad, but trying. He is on a new plan, to sell this house, go rent an RV this summer and go explore the west coast to find the perfect town to live in. Finally, a concrete plan! He want to bring our granddaughters along! (Me too, he wants me in this plan!)
But like someone said above, the OP will start making more emotional demands and the MLC'er will run away. She wants him to rescue her. She makes her situation out to be so horrible. I think she is either putting on a good act or she needs to go back to the Psych Ward for a longer visit.
Pretty much my H feels like he caused some of her problems but not all of them. She feels like everything is all his fault. So right now I am just watching what many here predicted come to be.
Sure hope I can keep up my detachment.
Sure hope he remembers the plan tomorrow!
Me 57 XH 58 Sons age 32 & 27 M:32 D final 9/12 Bought 10 Acres and Living the Dream!
