Is There Hope?

[Oneeleven]

Wow. Thank you for the response, I think You are repeating what any member of my family or the one friend I've told the entirety of this sitch to. I will answer some questions below

Thanks a lot for looking over my situation.

- I do not have any of this kind of proof. NOR would I do this to him DESPITE what a jerk he is being
- The bills and housing stress - we have had A PLENTY! lol!! And I am taking care of it all. But one great thing is I am good with money and I have got him out of the hole in every bill and debt he has. Something nice to come home to I am sure.

If you are this good with money then why do you need his home to live in? I mean no offense but what's with needing his house if you were on your own just last year?

[color:#CC33CC] I don't need his house persay, but obviously I love my home and hate to have to leave. And about having to stay until May 1st. It's because I don't want to go into debt by moving earlier. Our agreement was I pay the wedding and he pay all the mortgage. If I have to pay first and last months rent, pay a mover, set up all new utilies, etc, now I will go into debt. Staying at his house a few more months, rectifies this

Also, are you paying his bills? You mean with his money, right? You are not lending him money, correct? If you are, then you get it back with that POA the day before he comes home so it's "all squared away and he doesn't even have to worry about it".
Hell no! In Canada your pay almost doubles while you're in theatre. I have access to all his money and have been paying down his debts and moving around his money to reestablish his finances. he is not very good with that sort of stuff. He can build a finished basement but don't ask him to balance a cheque book

And please if we've learned one thing here in DB land, is to have NO expectations of gratitude from him at all....maybe never...but surely not a lot if he's not even talking to you now.So don't think he'll say "that was nice to come home to." Sorry one, but that would shock me.[/color]

I have zero expectations, and truth be told a "thank you so much" means nothing to me at this point. But he *will* most likely thank me profusely. He even has since the Dec 27th blow up. (when I made his car shelter payment go on my visa) But his thank yous fall on deaf ears right now (so obviously... I'm not doing it for a thank you, I'm doing it because I want to complete my end of the 'bargin' and so I can feel good about MYSELF)

I will take your opinion at face value that he only proposed to me to keep me to take care of his house, but I don't think that's entirely true.


I did not say it was the only reason.

I suggested it as a possibility, and moreover, based on the track record, the short time you were dating, then you threatened to break it off or had a dramatic fight about a possible OW,

THEN He proposed and got deployed. Sure the timing of the engagement is convenient only for him...it sukks for you b/c you could not date while he was gone but clearly he had no such obligation....

but I don't doubt he had feelings for you.

He also had a prior wife AND presumably prior feelings for her. What did you learn about him from her in a 3 hour talk?...

The time between possible OW and him deploying wasn't quite as short as it seems here, but it was yes. I won't agree that he proposed to keep me around to take care of his stuff, when he had it in his mind to dump me the moment he got home, I will agree that he proposed to keep me happy. I really wanted to be engaged and we talked about marriage and babies pretty much every day. I got wedding fever. Thats more why he did it. And he knew I really wanted to be at least engaged before I got pregnant. I am not delusional on that sitch


He wouldn't have signed his entire life over to me if this had been the case. I have EVERYTHING. His house, life insurance, POA, the works.

But I def agree that because we don't have any legal ties besides whats listed above, and because this relationship is in its first two years,(FIRST YEAR, right? Didn't you only date 5 months and then move in and then fight and then get engaged and deployed and...well it's not biggie, but I got confused about the length of this. I thought your time together was a matter of months but no it does not make a difference in your analysis. You are being brutally honest but better HERE on this board than when he returns and again, have LOW or zero expecations about a loving reunion. )

We have been together since August

that it is probably a good idea to let it go. I am not the type to take advantage of my position with the POA and stuff (which lots of women have/do - I've heard horror stories of guys coming back from tour to an empty house and bank account )

shocking their military has not remedied this. Most of my relatives are French Canadians. I'll have to remind them.

[color:#FF99FF] It's digusting. So are the women who cheat with other guys. It happens a lot when the women are left on the bases. My EX and I do not live on base.

OTOH there were stories of men who refused to give ANY POA to their wives b/c of control issues or paranoia and when they were in Vietnam, they left too little money or zero allotments to their families for the food and rent,and there were kids living on welfare in squalor.

Certain ranks are like that here. It's pretty gross. But going overseas gives the younger guys/lower ranks to get a leg up for 6-9 months

NOW, when you get deployed those things are handled by, among other peeps, legal officers so no one gets screwed at either end. It's not fool proof of course.
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I totally agree with you that I need to back off. This may sound like a small feat, but yesterday was day one! That I need to basically act as if it's over. And you know what? I DON'T want to be in the relationship the way it is now. So I guess I will lean on this to help me detach.


it's not a small feat but it's mandatory. So you have day 1, done. GOOD!!

BTW it was crappy of him to blow off your birthday.

[color:#CC66CC] I F-ing agree. Now that the sadness of the whole thing has worn off, I am pretty disgusted by him for it and that is good! I am taking that feeling and holding on!

What really concerned me was how you excused it and said your family wasn't big on b-days...so what?

I didnt excuse it, or I sure didn't mean to. It was really heartbreaking.


YOU had been big on HIS birthday only a short time earlier...that's the standard to go by and he blew it and when you told him (ahhh backslide of neediness and attempted guilt inducing nearly always backfires) and he still blew it off....ouch.

I did SO much for his BD to make him feel special. I have made him killer care packages since he's been there. (one was a complete Christmas set up for his room) And I wish you could see the video he made of himself opening his BD gift. It is just ..headshaking

One, This man is bad news for you on all counts, sorry.
I don't want to believe that but unless things change drastically, I fear it's the truth

I don't care how great he was in bed or how poetic he can wax, he's not been kind to you since a month after he got there AND

before that he messed around...yeah he did.
Not physically, but emotionally.

Thats what I really have to remember to help detach. He HAS NOT BEEN NICE TO ME (aside from the odd occassion) SINCE SEPTEMBER!!!

And as for "proof" of an affair taking place 3000 miiles away, seriously...what could you possibly get that would be "proof"??

I have proof of EA, but not PA, and I don't need proof for myself. But I wondered if technically I had to HAVE proof to be justified in feeling like it was ... a deal breaker.

if not the contacts and messages you have seen repeatedly, are you sayng only a film crew can prove it? You can't put a camera in his quarters and beam back the info so I'm not clear on how you expected proof. Oh him telling you and admitting it?

Did he ever voluntarily do that before? Didn't think so....And the ONE reason he'd be a fool to admit an affair now, if no other reason is exactly what you said

He did admit to the trust violation from way back. On his own as well. It took him a few days, but he did. And that is when he presented me with some free counseling that the military would provide us

you have access to all his property and his home.

A lot of women don't handle adultery well and might go nuts and he things you are too snoopy so maybe he fears your reaction to the truth....Who knows?


Does it matter now? Think of Thailand and how he treated you AND then blamed you? He sounds like a borderline personality disorder narcissist...or just a cruel selfish guy. I'm no shrink.

Nor am I. Hence why I am not going to put a label on this. Even perhaps say .... MLC. His wife told me he started going off the rails from who he used to be since they posted to this city. We compared notes of the breakdown he's been suffering since she knew him, from the beginning of my R with him, till now. He is deteriorating. We both see clearly he needs to talk to someone, but it doesn't matter what we say. It's him who needs to realise it for it to happen

(though you say on one hand you are not married or engaged but you assumed all the responsibilities of that commitment...you just did not get the benefits...do you get free health care? Anything other than rent?

I have all my own benefits. And I was paying half of everything until we made the agreement regarding me paying off the wedding instead.

Backing off BIG TIME and in an upbeat warm way as if you are the lucky one (and you are)

it's the only realistic way I can see, based on his "feedback" to you, his Classic OW behavior of treating YOU badly so you'll "leave him" and free him to date openly

and his irritation at you for reminding him that he's taking advantage of you AND your neediness was a turn off. And OW is....there...physically. You are not.

He's the type of guy who has to have what he wants when he wants it...

Do you believe that makes great dad material?

He needs to get emotional help before he's ready to be a dad. You can't do 7 tours in his position and NOT need to talk some stuff out after

The bar room scene suggests little chance of him being a monogamous type --but for the right woman who makes him work for it, MAYBE..maybe not..[/color]

See, here I agree. And THAT is the woman who I was after. When I found out. I was calm, cool and collected. There were no threats of leaving, and he STILL freaked out right away. That is really who the woman I am. You just can't get all that in my internet chat I guess.


As much as I love him. As much as I hope we can be in each others' lives, things need to change drastically for both of us in order for it to survive.

Thank you very much again for taking the time to give me some insight. And for backing up that I have a right to 'back off'. I kind of felt... guilty.. backing off before because he is in a crappy sitch over there. But he doesn't deserve (or want) different right now.

Today is another day~

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God help me for saying this but If he has skype and private quarters he's not front line. I don't say that to minimize but please don't let his present sitch excuse his behavior. If anything most men are KINDER and MORE loving when they feel their time is short or they want to shore up a r they hope to rekindle. For a guy coming home in a month, he's NOT acting like he wants back IN....when my h and I are apart we are MORE romantic and expressive. I can't explain why but many friends report the same.....

As I am sure that you can understand - I can't devulge what he does but he is most certainly front lines. His position is a unique one. He is a guy with a beard, if that holds any meaning for you yanks (it's code here in Canada lol) And YES I KNOW! He was so kind and so gentle and so appreciative. Then things changed. He might have fallen out of love. Maybe he just met someone. Whatever the reason, but I did see these qualities you speak of. I remember shortly after the Thailand trip, he wrote me the strangest letter. I guess they had rocket attacks on his 'area' and he was affected. He wrote me about feeling alone in the universe and wanting to be a better man. He asked me for patience and said he was trying, he knew he was difficult, but he was trying. That he hoped I wouldn't give up faith on him. That he appreciated me and hoped we could start anew when he returned from A-Stan.... It really threw me for a loop.

Yes I understand marital stress - After over a decade of post grad schooling for law and medicine, We were both active duty, in a war, had 2 small kids at the time, were apart long periods and as far as I know neither of us cheated.

Been m over 30 years now, been through some crisis internally and externally and 3 deaths in 14 months, a 4th death 6 months earlier (over there) and have a lot invested in our marriage, and raised 3 kids.

I'm so sorry for your losses that sounds pretty overwhelming. You sound like a fantastic, strong and admirable person

I say Please, cut your losses.

I have never said that to any married or cohabitating woman with kids or even to someone in a LONG term r

but to me this isn't even a year together, is it?


[color:#CC66CC] A year and a half, but he's been deployed for part of that. But I don't consider the relationship any less because he's not physically here.
I guess what i am trying to say, however feebly I am wording it,

is you are LUCKY to know this all now. It's a blessing in disguise. I know it's a dang well disguised blessing b/c it feels like heartbreak but it is still so much better to deal with this now, cleanly, than later.
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Is there some part of you that thinks you are so "Old" that you have to settle for this if you really want a child that badly? Please don't be offended by that question, I am just a bit confused by what you are tolerating from this non relationship and what you are getting out of it.

Gosh no! Quite the opposite. I have always been pretty anti-kid. I never wanted one and the older I got, the more that was clear. Then when I met P, quite shortly into our R, it was like... Ding ding ding... I want to make babies with this man! Very strange. No one could believe it. And my making babies urge goes away if it is not with him (not to say it couldn't happen with another, but I think given that it took me 40 years to find P to make that reaction happen in me, the chances are pretty unlikely! lol)

I am getting sweet F-All from this R lately. And it's been that way since ... Sept, Oct. Since then .... I've just wanted him to come home so I could see with my own two eyes, if we were still a couple. To see if things fell back into place. Now it's pretty clear they will not!

If something NEW happens with us, great. But reviving what we once had is not something I want. NOR does he.



It was "so good" for so short...

Do you want THIS man's child? What do you love about him? Not how he acted with you good or bad but what are his qualities you admired or loved?

And now?


- He was so amazingly sweet. I remember I used to tease him about being a tough infantry man. Hard on the outside but so soft on the inside. His romantic gestures were beautiful (and actually didn't make me wanna barf! LOL) and his kindness towards animals won me over
-He was such a protector and provider. I knew that if were were trapped on a desert island I would have a roof over my head within half a day. He was my McGyver. Or when he found out he was deployed, since I don't drive he bought a freezer and filled it with meat and bought a six months supply of everything heavy so I wouldn't be too burdened.
-He always put me first. We were always joke-arguing about who's need would come first
-He loved who I was, warts and all. He showed this on several occassions.
-He told me if I couldn't end up having a child, we would adopt. Keeping me was more important than having a natural child (he told me this again in thailand)
-He's SO smart. Scary smart. His mind facinates me
-He's brave but also not afraid to admit when he's scared
I could go on but I'm kind of making myself feel a little blue remembering all the things that made me fall for him.

(oh and he is a MEAN cook!!)




As for my h's deployment, I am not thrilled for obvious reasons. Been there, done that. Thought the war was over too btw....and he's taking a HUGE PAY CUT to go so we're going to maybe lose our home.

IOW we were active duty but now he's in the reserves. H Does Army stuff one weekend a month but works in private practice the rest of the time.

Now when he's deployed and they do NOT match his civilian pay all I can do legally is keep the home from being foreclosed....WHILE HE'S GONE , BUT the month he returns we lose it.

Nice touch huh?

I don't F-ing get that!!! excuse my language but I am so mad for you. That is horrible. I don't know to much about how the US army standards work but that really seems unfair.

but you know how I cope with that and having 2 kids at home and working? And not letting free floating angst about him being bombed hit me in the face every hour?

By realizing that in the grand scheme of things, if the only thing we lose by my h going off to a war zone is a house,

then we'll start over and build again, and we'll be luckier than thousands of soldiers who did NOT come home
OR
who came home missing limbs.

My h treats those soliders now in the wounded warriors project.

I believe in supporting the military and detest spouses who cheat or fool around with money while their partners are in war zones or just overseas serving their nations for that matter.

b/c it's really a dastardly thing to do. It's like cheating on a pregnant woman. You just don't do it. It is what a "CAD" would do...


I agree. And this is a lot of the source of my guilt in this sitch. I always felt bad making a stink about anything because he was in a war zone. And he blames me and has horrible resentment towards me for thailand being so ... volatile. I know its not all my fault but he certainly tries to make it that way to ease his ... regret most likely. I give kudos to your H and I love your outlook on life. I pray for your H safe return. I can't wait until we stop sending our loved ones to that place but I guess if not that place, there will always be another
But he's been a cad to you and you are NOT doing anything wrong by simply arranging to move out and be on your own AS HE HAS REQUESTED...

I didn't see a retraction from him. How can you feel guilty about anything here? I'm a little worried that you need to talk to a t if you think you've done anything wrong or are you leaving something out?

Was there a retraction? Did he ask you to stay in the home?


Yes i thought I put in it there. Immediately after his mean email re: me finding the Skype invite, he wrote me another saying it would be better for all involved if I just stayed and then he would help me move once he got home. As well, our short convo on Sun nite said the same thing. "I will give you till May 1 then I will even help you move"


Even so, why depend on him for anything? it's such a set up for being a doormat b/c you'll feel so trapped.

And that's exactly the oppposite of what you need to be if you want to attract him.

As I stated to him, it's not so much depend, but I said basically..."I'm doing you a favor by staying, can you please repay by letting me stay till it's convenient for ME to leave" He agreed

I'd move out and GAL big time, and MAYBE if you can, take the dog or some item that means he'll have to contact you. The dog is best but can't be a hassle to rent a place with.

Then he'll see you looKing GOOD and being upbeat and NOT taking him to the cleaners but being independent and attractive, and expecting NOTHING FROM HIM AT ALL...

and being mysterious and busy acting as if you "get" his choice and you accept it with resignation and regret FOR HIS SAKE,

b/c YOU know YOU will be fine without him as you were before AND you are an improved version of yourself now, so great things are happening in your life now and right around the corner too...

You know this b/c YOU have become a woman only a fool would leave

and if you become your best self and he still chooses OW or to move on

then he is a fool and it's a BLESSING to learn this now.

a bientot!