Most Likely Youngster Goes His Way (& W Goes Hers)

[2thepoint]

Hey WCF - sorry to have to say this but your text about the $10 comes across as nothing more than PURE PURSUIT! Are you really in that desperate need of the $10? Maybe you are and I should just zip it. But in the event you aren't don't you see how this comes across?

If I was your WAW I'd be thinking, REALLY!?! In the grand scheme of things this is what my H is worried about, $10 friggin dollars! Good grief!

"We'll see what happens. I feel apprehensive and dread any kind of attempt she might make at using this to play her power games. If it turns out that way, to heck with it. It's just ten bucks."

I think your words above ^^^^ speak for themselves just reverse the roles.

Stop the Pursuit, WCF. It's not attractive!

[25yearsmlc]

I too sometimes get to a point where I've just GOT to read a regular book. As cool as Kindles are, they will never kill the book, period. (I do admit that it sure helps when I read thick, heavy tomes like "Infinite Jest" or "Under the Dome.")

OMG had to comment here...LOVE my books...absolutely. But I love my Nook (don't know the differences between all of the e-readers but supposedly and surprisingly heard that Barnes/Noble has MORE books than Amazon???)

but thing is, aside from not having to carry around tomes like "Under the Dome", (which I read & loved btw),

I hate admitting this...but now that I'm officially "middle aged"...

I find that my eyesight sukks after reading an hour or two.

So, sadly, I HAVE TO enlarge the letters after awhile and only an e-reader can do that.

We have a decent sized library in our home (h has two medical degrees and I am a L, so we have tons of heavy books we'll probably read again, maybe 3 times in the next 50 years??)

Still I cling to law books with puny print that I cannot seem to sell or let go of. Why? IDK...it's not like others see our library and get impressed. It's in an out of the way room. So it's not even vanity. Or maybe it gives me some sense of achievment knowing "I read THAT AND THAT"...??

So the eyesight thing stinks and yes I have 3 different eye glasses prescriptions...At this rate when I'm 80

I'll read one word at a time on an index card...geez...

(there' a joke in there somewhere, hmm, I better remember)

actually may look into lasik surgery next time I have an extra $5k.




I'm glad that you noticed that interactions with my W have been somewhat more positive than they once were -- I've noticed, too. It's hard to know if it means anything. Maybe she's getting the idea that I'm going dark and that's going to stick, or perhaps she realizes that ranting and raving will only push me away further. Who knows.


She's playing some sort of game. I wondered about her weight comments. She either likes her men big, (??)

or she's hoping you are depressed and losing weight the "DB grief induced way". That bugs me. Why can't she just say you look good?

You could tell her "actually w, a lot of folks have commented on my weight loss AND NOTICED HOW MUCH I'VE WORKED OUT, but the downside is that I have to buy more clothes..." and change the topic;.

This way she knows that you are putting a positive spin on her comment and that you were oblivious to her intent, whatever it was...and maybe you'll be giving her the benefit of the doubt.


Yesterday, I got an e-mail from my W. It was a forward of a message from the local "bunny spa," which is basically a great service for rabbits in the area to clean them up and give them a check-up for only a $10 "suggested donation." W wrote, "I keep getting these emails. But I thought I'd forward this one to you in case you're interested in taking [the rabbit]." I replied and said, "Thanks, I appreciate it."

Again, the tone just feels different. She may just genuinely want the best for the rabbit, but at least she's being nice in giving me the info.

what is the deal with the rabbit, west? Is this an excuse for more contact or a symbol of the marriage or what?


And what's with the comment about "too bad we couldn't divorce by now"...

sounded like a probing comment on her end, to me.

I'm liking your GAL and interactions with her though, big time.

Good job! You've come a long way my man...a long way. Good for you.

Oh and I LOVE your t. Humor is mandatory and if a c or mc or t lacks one, i can't go back. I do stand up comedy and I'm not saying they have to love my jokes but my sense of humor IS a coping tool I use

so yeah, they have to get that part of me or they won't be helping me much.
Yours sounds great.

I missed out on the post about sex with OM...where's that? WTH? If I find it I'll let you know my take on it b/c there has to be a reason for it.

Worst case is she wants you to know it's over. But even with that goal, seems needlessly cruel.

Best case, for lack of better terms, is that she is testing you, teaching you somethihng she wanted you to know about her sexually, or probing or trying to make you jealous...wth?

there have to be better ways to achieve those goals...Jesus...

[25yearsmlc]

Hey WCF - sorry to have to say this but your text about the $10 comes across as nothing more than PURE PURSUIT! Are you really in that desperate need of the $10? Maybe you are and I should just zip it. But in the event you aren't don't you see how this comes across?

If I was your WAW I'd be thinking, REALLY!?! In the grand scheme of things this is what my H is worried about, $10 friggin dollars! Good grief!

"We'll see what happens. I feel apprehensive and dread any kind of attempt she might make at using this to play her power games. If it turns out that way, to heck with it. It's just ten bucks."

I think your words above ^^^^ speak for themselves just reverse the roles.

Stop the Pursuit, WCF. It's not attractive!

READ THIS ^^^^AGAIN WEST...

Wow....there are only 2 ways your w can see that email

Either you are using 10$ as an excuse for more contact (b/c who on earth would contact a divorcing spouse about such a small amount of money??)

OR WORSE, that your OCD is back, you have not changed AND OR

you come off being as uber cheap. Yikes...I almost hope she sees it as pursuit.

IMO, the best thing you can do now is either act as if you were joking

b/c like I said, who would make an issue of this small amount?

OR

that you wanted to make sure her math wasn't thrown off by the error

AND OR so that she knows you took care of accounting issues at work, they screwed up, and you wanted to make sure she understood the error

AND b/c you know how meticulous she is.

West this is a backslide imo.


It looks as if you don't realize how most people see this. Frankly, I don't know ANY ADULT who'd make an issue of this amount with anyone else and least of all, their soon to be former spouse...

unless they were furious and punitive, thinking she "ripped you off!!"???

But you're not furious...or are you, and just not aware of it?

If I were HER, AND IF I EVEN NOTICED THIS in my bank account,
I would not make an issue of it.

It's just Too small to comment upon and I'd be concerned that I'd look OCD or pursuing if I brought it up to you...yes, that's how I'd feel if I were in HER shoes.

In YOUR shoes, I'd say not one word...

Even an impoverished man would look cheap commenting about this amount of money and FYI-- being impoverished isn't attractive.

See if there's a way you can un-do this. Val, 2, anyone else have a suggestion here?

It's just my take on it.

[westcoastfella]

To both 2 and 25: Thanks for helping me realize my error. You're right, $10 is nothing. I went ahead and wrote my W another e-mail before she could do anything -- she hasn't yet replied to my last one or made any transfers.

...now that I think about it, don't even worry about the $10. If I'm going to be contributing my part of the filing fee in March, you might as well hang onto it. Disregard the last e-mail -- much obliged.

Unfortunately, I don't think that I can get out of looking like a miser from my last e-mail, but at least I've resolved the problem.

Here are several responses to 25's comments.

Re. e-books: B&N has more books than Amazon now? That's wild! Of course, given that B&N deals primarily with books while Amazon offers a huge assortment of everything, it makes sense. Hope Lasik surgery goes well for you if ever you're ever able to do that -- it seems like people are happy once they have it done.

Re. my weight: Actually, my W has always preferred her men to be tall and slender -- as I am now. When she met me, I was also thin because I ate very little and worked out a lot (I was coping with mild depression my first few months of college). She thought that I was incredibly attractive at the time. I believe, as you do, that she's playing a game and secretly hopes that I'm starving myself out of grief. I'm very thin, but not enough to look dangerously so. I also eat healthy, but I'm by no means fasting.

I like your idea of putting a positive spin on it. Positive is an awesome way to go!

Re. the rabbit: In my opinion, my W uses the rabbit as an excuse for more contact. She originally gave me custody of him because he "prefers" me -- I'm the one who has primarily taken care of him over the years. However, she has told me that she intends to take him back once she moves back to this area in August of this year. I love the little guy a lot, but if it means one less way she can try and control me, the better.

Re. the sex comments: Instead of forcing either one of us to dig back through lots of comments, I'll just re-hash them here. Basically, when my W first started seeing OM and told me that she wanted to be separated, she told me lots of explicit details about their sex life as though I were one of her GFs -- the size of his penis (he's bigger than I am), how long he can "go" for, the semi-S&M style "roughness" that he enjoys, etc. I called her close to the "anniversary" of the day that she was raped (typically, a very difficult day for her), and she said, "Oh, yeah, OM knows about that. I told him, 'No handcuffs on that day!')

She also told me multiple times that he "knows what he's doing" and that I should spend this time working on "being comfortable with that side" of myself with other women. What's odd is that she never complained about my "technique" in the years before. Either way, this whole thing has put my sexual self esteem in the toilet.

Needlessly cruel? Yes indeed. I still have no idea why she told me those things. I can't help but feel that her sexual trauma is shaping her erractic and unwarranted behavior. At the time, I chose to listen to all this because I was in shock and felt like I needed to get answers as to why it was happening. Now I look back and often feel angry at her for saying those things. It only makes the "mind movies" that much more vivid to me.

[25yearsmlc]

RE the 10$ - yeah you lost points with that. Let's hope she doesn't notice.
Do not credit something for it or act as if it matters AT ALL...or go with the idea you were trying to help HER with the math of it and assuring her that you had not erred but the department did...blah blah blah and drop it!


RE sex with OM-

well JESUS CHRIST I cannot believe she told you all that...crap....

I've known enough men and have been m long enough AND I have 3 sisters and many gf's who share a lot of things with me about sex...here's the deal.

Size matters more in photos than anything else.

I KNOW

if a man loves a woman, he usually figures out what it takes to satisfy her sexually, unless she's too quiet to tell him or she wants a mind reader OR

if she's afraid to admit what it is that turns her on. That's pretty much it.

BTW Most women cannot climax from intercourse alone-
so technically, how much can size matter?


So the real question is, why did she tell you?


If he's into S & M, then it's just weird that she's turned on by his behavior.

Unless her "rape" secretly appealed to a part of her - for which she feels confusion or shame -

or something else- too wacky for me to figure out

AND NOT ABOUT YOU ANYHOW...

when you begin "really" dating again, and want to get intimate

just let your new woman know that your ex w told you some things that hurt your ego.

& All you ask for is that your lover communicate HER needs and preferences to you

b/c you "aim to please!"

and never ever apologize for your size. First off, You may be normal size and the OM is large. So what?

From what I hear SOME men with big ones tend to assume that their size alone is sufficient for the woman's satisfaction - and if she has not fully "enjoyed" herself with intercourse alone..well that's her problem.

look ...if you date a woman w/small breasts, will you insist she get augmentation? I thought not...

Your w's comments were so much more about HER than you, that's all I can say and reiterate.

So Carry on!

[Oneeleven]

Either way, this whole thing has put my sexual self esteem in the toilet.

. At the time, I chose to listen to all this because I was in shock and felt like I needed to get answers as to why it was happening. Now I look back and often feel angry at her for saying those things. It only makes the "mind movies" that much more vivid to me.

Oh I hear you about the 'mind movies'. When my FI and I first got together and the subject came of of likes and dislikes for sex he foolishly used his EXW in most of the examples and told me way TMI. I couldn't erase those movies from my mind and it damaged my sexual self esteem for quite a while too. It certainly bit him in the ass.
I feel for you

[westcoastfella]

Size matters more in photos than anything else.

I figured this as much. What was weird was that my W did not make it sound as though the dude's size influenced her in any way. Technically, she said, "He's pretty well-endowed -- he's bigger than you, but not by a whole lot." It was as though she was just mentioning it as something that interested her. And also as though she was trying to hurt me. Does that make sense, that I got those two intertwined tones from her? Gah, it's been so confusing.

Also, now that I mentioned it, she said that OM could go "for hours," but she made a comment about how average the sex was, like "ehhhh...it's okay." Now that you mention it, I must not have been that terrible because almost every time my W and I had sex, she O'd. I don't mean to be explicit, but she wasn't faking with me -- I could physically feel it happening. (She also told me that, at the time, she had not yet O'd with OM. So chalk one up for me.)

If he's into S & M, then it's just weird that she's turned on by his behavior.

This is the primary reason why I believe that her experience w/rape is the driving reason behind her A -- like she's trying to exorcize her demons or something. When I first met her, she was extremely sexual. I like to say that sex constituted about half of our R at first. Then, after we became serious, she started to hate sex. Mostly only did it because she felt that she had a "duty" to do it with me, and also because she liked feeling close to me.

Then, in the last year, she started to became really sexual again but complained that I was "hesitant" about what I was doing. That she sometimes wished that she could just be "taken." I understand that there were things that I could have differently, maybe worked on my self-confidence more. It doesn't excuse her A, but I get it. Still, after all those years of treating her so gingerly, I wasn't used to being so aggressive in that department.

when you begin "really" dating again, and want to get intimate, just let your new woman know that your ex w told you some things that hurt your ego. All you ask for is that your lover communicate HER needs and preferences to you b/c you "aim to please!"

Thanks so much for the reassuring comments and advice. I realize quite readily that because my W has been my only sexual partner, and because of the things that have occurred, my sexuality has not been very well-developed. I'm sure that whoever else may come along will be much more supportive and much less condemning of my efforts.

Oneeleven: Thanks for the supportive words. Mind-movies really ain't fun.

[kml]

"He's pretty well-endowed -- he's bigger than you, but not by a whole lot."

Haha - you realize, in a back-handed way, she said YOU were well endowed too!

[Valeska19]

West,
25 made alot of good points about your wife. I don't think there is much you could do to "fix" that email.....

..... I'm not sure if your 2nd email made it any better. I still don't understand why you are sharing in the filing cost.. but that's just me.

It might not be a bad idea to set up some "waiting periods". For example.. I will wait at least one hour to respond to text, I will wait at least 24 hrs to compose an email or respond to an email.

This allows me to look at what I'm saying and make sure I'm not backsliding.. or being stupid.

I guess it also could make w think I'm out GALing.. but I try not to focus on what she thinks too much.

Anyway...

Might be worth a try... especially that your dynamic with your w has recently changed.

Otherwise don't beat yourself up too much. I definitely agree with 25 that you have come a LONG way.. so I think you will learn from this and change.

Keep on Keeping On.

[westcoastfella]

kml: I did catch that, thanks. Got to think of the positive in a negative sitch, I suppose.

Val: I really appreciate your ideas on "waiting periods." I believe that was my mistake -- I just barreled into that first e-mail only a few hours after learning about the bank error. It also teaches me that I might want to run my ideas on this site before I do anything, too. Had I done that, I imagine that you guys would have talked me out of it. Oh, well. Live & learn.

I don't like that I'm sharing the filing cost, either, but I already agreed to it, and I don't feel like getting in a big argument with my W over the matter, especially if it's only an amount close to the $10.93. If it was a substantial amount, I would probably say no and damn the consequences.

I checked my e-mail today and no reply, so either she is really disregarding my e-mails, or she just REALLY takes her time in checking her inbox. We'll see.

I also wanted to add that, yesterday morning, I overheard my boss telling another co-worker about how great MeetUp.com was. She said that her sister, who had recently gone through a D, was now using the site, and she was doing a lot of fun things! That helped me make up my mind: I'm going to finally use that site. Might as well. I want to get out and meet people.