Another WAW

[anclost]

Hello,

I have been reading these forum threads for the last 4 months since my wife asked for a divorce. I'm hesitant to post because it seemed I could glean many answers to my situation and didn't want to repeat a lot of what has already been said. However, there are some significant issues which I can't find that similar on this board. So here goes....

My sitch is married for 20 years, and have S16 and S19. S19 is a freshman in college and S16 is sophomore at a college prep boarding school. I feel our relationship changed about 6 years ago when my wife went back to work. a year later she was diagnosed with breast cancer. She is 5 years cancer free this past fall, her treatment was a mastectomy initially with a preventive mastectomy a in Sept of 2010. This was not a reoccurrence but a preventative decision. Wife is an RN and I am a pilot for a major airline.

W complaints have been I work too much, put my career ahead of the family, don't pay attention to her, wasn't there during the cancer treatments(radiation) because I was had to work. Talked about living like roommates for the past couple of years and why didn't I want to do something about it. I was too hard on our oldest S, wasn't a very good father and role model for our sons.

In summary, I've made every mistake you could make in a relationship it seems. Also, 15 years ago, I had a couple of incidents with drinking too much which led to inappropriate behavior of kissing and fondling. I did walk away from the situations before they went too far. Three years after these incidents, I told my wife about them so she knows everything. We worked through it and it seemed she forgave me, but she has always been extremely distrustful of me, which is understandable. I've never come close to anything since, made sure I was never in any type of situation that could be questioned. However she feels like I didn't do enough to help her with the trust issue and now says she should have left me back then and has never forgiven me for it.

Like many here, I've read every relationship book I can get my hands on; DB, 5 LL, 5 L of apology, If he only Knew, Tough Love, Hold me tight, etc. I've come to realize how insensitive I really was. I have made all the mistakes these books discuss. When my wife wanted to talk I withdrew because it felt like I was being criticized again. I'm to logical and stoic which meant I didn't communicate very well.

Of course I felt things we not great but I certainly didn't think we were headed for divorce. Last spring my wife took up skeet shooting and she felt it made realize how other couple interacted and we were not the same. Thing is, we got intimate a lot last spring, then in July we had an argument and from then there hasn't been any physical contact between us. She would get violently angry with me at everything, the F word is used all the time. It was directed at me mostly but even our sons got it sometimes. After the boys returned to school in August the relationship continued to deteriorate rapidly to asking for a divorce on Sept 20th.

That same day I felt the best thing to do is give her some space so I stayed with some friends for the next thirty days. I wouldn't contact her, but she would always contact me. The anger was and is always right there. Mid October I came back to the house even though she said she didn't want me to. While I was out of the house i would still come by when W was working to let the dogs out, do the laundry etc. I would also leave dinner of some type for her since she worked long hours.

Since I have returned I have been cautiously trying the DB techniques. The trouble is, if I wasn't attentive enough to her before then ignoring her wasn't the thing to do it seemed. She would invite me to met her for lunch occasionally on her day off. When I have tried to get a life it really makes her angry. For example, I wanted to go see the play "Grapes of Wrath". I invited her to go and bought a ticket for her. She said maybe, then said yes, then got extremely mad about me doing this without asking her first. She then refused to go so I went anyway. She got very angry that I went, accusing me of secretly meeting someone there. Her habit is to call me, say F You and hang up. This all occurred in November.

I've tried to do other different things such as go to a coffee shop to do some work on the computer. Even the made her very mad, the same verbal F bombs. I usually do all the cooking in our house, my wife has seemed to withdraw from any type of domestic endeavors. I do most of the laundry, the cleaning etc. Hasn't always been this way, but every since she went to work I have slowly taken on more and more of the chores. The two years my son was here in jr high, I went to all the school functions, teacher meetings etc while W went to very few because of her work schedule. Lately I have made an effort to learn how to cook better so I made some nice dinners when W got home from work. She was complimentary(very) yet made it clear a couple of nice dinners weren't going to change her mind.

I even made a big deal out of decorating the Xmas tree. I made a xmas music CD and some cider then spent a Saturday trimming the tree and listening to the music with her. A few weeks before Christmas she started to let me come in her bedroom were we talk some, occasionlly I would scratch her back or rub her feet if she wanted. We have watched several movies together within the last month as well. We went to lunch two weeks ago and then went shopping together. She texted me later that evening with"Are we ok?". I asked her what she meant and she said she had fun that day and hoped things would work out but that I shouldn't read anything into it.

She always makes it clear that she is going to divorce me and she is moving to Dallas. We currently live in Alaska and she has aged living here and can't wait to leave - I am in management and this was a corporate move with the promise of moving us out this summer or next. She blames me for moving here as well. I ad just started with the company and they asked me to move here within the first year with the company. I actually wasn't crazy about it but she felt like it would be an adventure. In fact I wanted to keep our house and commute up here to AK but she didn't like the idea. Now she blames me because she didn't want to sell the house and I should have commuted like she states was her idea. She never misses an opportunity to let me know she is leaving for Dallas, she just hasn't set a date.

My W has yet to file for divorce. She has retained a lawyer but wants to do this as cheaply as possible. We use her income to pay for college tuition and boarding school tuition. We make a very good combined income. Her intent is that I will pay for the boys tuition once the divorce is complete since I make 4 times her income and she will be "destitute". Of course this isn't the reality, if we divorce I can't pay the tuition on my income alone. She hasn't even given the documents to the lawyer yet to determine the financial division. AK is a no fault state, and it would be a fairly straight forward division of assets. W has actually stated that if I ever want to get back together wit her that this divorce better go smoothly.

Other facts about us, wife is 49 this Feb and I'm 46. She is going through menopause for about the last year or so. The anger and F bombs started last spring. She was sexually abused by her brother as a child. Brother claims it isn't true and her parents dismissed it as well. I know it is true because of how she told me(before we were married). I certainly didn't realize the implications of how this would have affected my wife as far as trust issues.

I have been talking to a DB counsoler since Sept. I'm working with Jody who is great. I have learned to have compassion for my wife and how she FEELS. And it has seemed that things were slowly getting better. We had a ski trip planned for a week after christmas with a family from Dallas that is my W best friend from college. W said they were uncomfortable with having me come so I stayed home. Leading up to the trip we told our two S about the her decision to divorce me. Although she wanted me to tell them that it was a mutual decision. I made it clear it wasn't what I wanted.

I asked my counsoler if I should get her a xmas gift and she felt it was a good idea. I got her a pearl bracelet. This was to replace a pearl bracelet I had given her in 2000 since the pearls where very worn. I told her in the card this was much like our relationship, can't fix it so lets start new. Well when I gave it to her she said it was beautiful and she kissed me on the cheek. That night they left for Utah and she gave me a hug(first hug since July). I thought things were again slowly getting better.

This is where it gets beyond my ability to comprehend. One of the DB techniques is to get into shape which I had already started last April. So the day my wife left for Utah with my two S it was Xmas Eve and she sent me a picture of her and the boys that said Merry Christmas. So I decided to learn how to use the timer on my SLR and took a picture of me and our two dogs in front of our Christmas tree. Thought it would be nice. Since I've started working out I've lost 45 lbs while gaining a lot of muscle. It has been a great stress relief of course. But this is where it gets crazy. Sending that picture to my wife really mad her angry. She texted me continually Xmas eve and the Xmas day with the some pretty hurtful comments. Here is an example : "who did you send that photo to besides me? F you, you have this bracelet and shove it up you a**". "You are and always will be a liar, a cheat and a poor example of a man!' etc. They went on like that all night. Of course I didn't respond. She assumed I had sent that picture out to my friends (or girls) with the intent of showing off how I looked. None of it was true but she wasn't going to believe me.

My question is this. How do I deal with this level of vitriol? Even my counselor was pretty shocked when I read her the texts. I have spent the last 6 months learning how much I have been a part of my failed relationship. I know I need to make changes. For the last week my wife has texted me every day with pictures but hasn't called. I know I can't expect anything, but I haven't even heard from my sons.

There is a lot more, but that is enough for this post. Would appreciate any help. I know Sandi2 was a WAW, is this level of anger normal. Both DB counselors I have talked to and my good friend all seem to think my wife really doesn't want a divorce. I don't know what to think after this last week.

Thanks,
Lost in Alaska

[dbmod]

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[2thepoint]

Paging 25, paging 25, please pick up the white courtesy phone...

Sorry, Anclost just a little inside Forum humor. Sounds like you've got a lot going on in your sitch. My best advice for you right now is to try to distance yourself emotionally as much as possible. This will help to keep you sane while you work on the other things in your M, (i.e. 180's, getting a life, etc.).

There is a ton of amazing reference material contained within the nooks and crannies of the various DB forums. So poke around some, post often and folks will begin to chime in with their perspective and advice.

FYI - the little joke about paging 25 is in reference to one of the forum regulars, 25yearsmlc who successfully busted her D after several years and actually spent some time living in Alaska. If she surfaces, I think you will find that she has a tremendous amount of wisdom and advice to offer.

So like I said, post often and 25 will eventually pop in.

Good luck!

[anclost]

Thanks 2thepoint, I knew exactly who you were referencing. I have read many posts by 25. Extremely helpful her advice is. Her list of all the things she did in GAL was impressive.

This is the issue for me. The more I try and distance myself and get a life, the more angry my wife gets. For example, 2 months ago I was tired of cooking so I said I was going out to get something to eat. I asked the W if she would like to come, she said no and left the house. I made a call and asked a friend/co-worker(male) to meet for dinner, which was fine. When she came home and found out I was going to meet my friend, she lost it. The F bombs came in streams, plus she kept saying "Who are you", and it is different for me to go out with friends.

So anything of that nature, going to a play, coffee house, or meeting friends for dinner etc escalates to her over the top anger. Buying new clothes, that didn't work either. I wear business causal at work, my waist has gone from a 40 to 34, so out of necessity I had to buy a few pairs of new work pants. When she saw that I had purchased the clothes she called me and asked if I was cheating on her. I said absolutely not, she then said F You and hung up.

I discussed this with Jody and she felt that my wife was really looking for my attention and at times it seems my wife does like the attention. But then she gets cold toward me. Like I said, she was in Utah on the ski trip with our sons and called once but texted everyday. When she got home she was fairly cool toward me but then opened up as she went to bed last night and talked about the trip with a lot of detail.

We just got done watching the movie "Warrior" together as a family, liked the underlying theme of forgiveness and redemption. Really gets to you. She seemed to enjoy the movie and being with me and the boys, just like old times. Then its off to her bedroom with the cold shoulder.

Anyway, I really would like to GAL. I have said for the last few years I wanted to go back to school and get my masters in mathematics. She always has had a negative view of this. She doesn't see the point and I think she has felt it would be something else to take time away from her. Any class would be fun, Latin, Literature, etc appeals to me. She would just take a negative view of it.

One of 25's suggestions was a seminar "Essential Experience". That sounds intriguing. Would 25 recommend that for me?

Another point about the ski trip is it was with her college roommate and her husband and kids. Of course my wife has been talking to her all along and naturally they tell she should leave me and move to Dallas. I thought I was friends with this couple, should I not find this surprising?

I read the book "If He Only Knew". I've read many of Sandi2 and 25's posts. You start to realize what a bad husband you have been. I mean you really start to get it. Is there a point where you feel like you don't deserve forgiveness and a second chance? Its asking too much. Like my wife has said, she has lived it for years, I've had my chances.

There are some things that I will never be able to make up to her. I know I have to make changes for me. I never want to make any of these mistakes again. My wife has even stated that I will be a great husband in my next relationship. She even said a few weeks ago that she never been treated so well in our relationship but it is too late.

What about statements she makes about the future? That maybe we could be together again in a few years? Or that she doesn't want to be married to someone else; so I ask "would you remarry me?". She said absolutely, maybe on a beach in Hawaii. How much stock do you put in that. I know you believe nothing they say and 50 percent of what you see.

That is all for now. Of course there is more to be posted later.

Thanks for the help,

Lost in Alaska

[sandi2]

Sorry for your problems, but glad you found your way to our community.

I feel our relationship changed about 6 years ago when my wife went back to work.

So up until that time six years ago, your MR was good? How about her complaints against you, were there many before she went back to work?

It's great to hear she has remained cancer-free for five years! How was the R during the time she was taking treatments and had her surgery? Was the mastectomy pretty hard on her, or was she able to see the logic and make the best choice of the options? Some women handle things like that much better than others.

W complaints have been I work too much, put my career ahead of the family, don't pay attention to her, wasn't there during the cancer treatments(radiation) because I was had to work. Talked about living like roommates for the past couple of years and why didn't I want to do something about it. I was too hard on our oldest S, wasn't a very good father and role model for our sons.

Any of that true? Was this before or after her surgery?

In summary, I've made every mistake you could make in a relationship it seems.

Is this how she sees it or how you see it? I'm just trying to get it straight in my mind.

Also, 15 years ago, I had a couple of incidents with drinking too much which led to inappropriate behavior of kissing and fondling. I did walk away from the situations before they went too far. Three years after these incidents, I told my wife about them so she knows everything. We worked through it and it seemed she forgave me, but she has always been extremely distrustful of me, which is understandable.

Was this behavior with the same female or different ones? Why did you wait until three years later to confess?

When did her mistrust of you begin?

However she feels like I didn't do enough to help her with the trust issue and now says she should have left me back then and has never forgiven me for it.

Was there any professional MC? What did she mean that you didn't do enough to help?

Let me go back to this statement:

Talked about living like roommates for the past couple of years and why didn't I want to do something about it.

Whose idea was it to live like roommates? Did this sort of revolved around the surgery or her treatments? What happen to turn things around last spring? I know I'm asking lots of questions, but try to bear with me while I get it sorted.

Was your W distrustful of you before she found out about the inappropriate behavior? A pilot can turn the heads of some women just b/c he's wearing a uniform. Did you have women hitting on you a lot? Must have made time away from home rather tough.

Thing is, we got intimate a lot last spring, then in July we had an argument and from then there hasn't been any physical contact between us.

That argument must have been a doozy! Did she go back to the stuff 15 yrs ago? During the the time after the fight in July, did you ever try to initiate intimacy?

It seems that she needs the help of a good therapist (who is pro-marriage). If she's been through all this other with her cancer, etc., there is something she can't turn loose about the inappropriate behavior. There's either more than you've told us, or she refuses to forgive anyone that she sees as betrayal.

[anclost]

Sorry for your problems, but glad you found your way to our community.

I feel our relationship changed about 6 years ago when my wife went back to work.

So up until that time six years ago, your MR was good? How about her complaints against you, were there many before she went back to work?
Yes, I thought so. I had only one girlfriend prior to meeting my wife and that wasn't very serious. So in some respects I wonder if I know what a good relationship really is. I do love my wife and want to spend the rest of my life with her. But going back through my relationship to even before we were married, she would get angry at me. I recall once after we had just begun dating when she found an old card from my previous girlfriend(which was over with for a couple of years), she got mad and locked herself in the bathroom for a while. I know that I have felt that I wasn't ever good enough for her. I know they are just words but when your wife tells you on your honeymoon that we will be divorced within 6 months it tends to make you insecure. From 1991 when we where married until 1996, I thought things were good but I think I felt unappreciated somewhat. Plus we had our two sons in that time as well. And I can say that I probably took her for granted as well.

It's great to hear she has remained cancer-free for five years! How was the R during the time she was taking treatments and had her surgery? Was the mastectomy pretty hard on her, or was she able to see the logic and make the best choice of the options? Some women handle things like that much better than others.

She had the initial mastectomy in 2006 with 8 weeks of radiation for treatment. Her mom was there with us for the surgery and recovery. When the radiation treatments started she seemed to handle it well. As an RN she knows the medical world very well. When she said she was fine going to the appointments on her own I thought everything was okay. I never should have done that. Thats where lack of communication and insensitivity on my part was lacking sorely. I should have been there by her side making her feel special and beautiful. The second (elective) mastectomy was in the fall of 2010. I was the only one there for her and made sure she was okay. I took care of her like I should have before. She was very pragmatic about both, she didn't care about losing her breasts, she just wanted to live. She has reconstructive surgery so she looks great. Again I could have done a much better job making sure I thought cancer is an ugly disease but she is more beautiful than ever.

W complaints have been I work too much, put my career ahead of the family, don't pay attention to her, wasn't there during the cancer treatments(radiation) because I was had to work. Talked about living like roommates for the past couple of years and why didn't I want to do something about it. I was too hard on our oldest S, wasn't a very good father and role model for our sons.

Any of that true? Was this before or after her surgery?

Yes these are true in the way that she feels, so that is all that really matters. These complaints really didn't manifest until after the initial surgery. I do work on the management side now and the first surgery was right after I had started a new job so I was all eager to prove myself at work. Not trying to make excuses but looking back I can see what I did and where my priorities were.

In summary, I've made every mistake you could make in a relationship it seems.

Is this how she sees it or how you see it? I'm just trying to get it straight in my mind.

This is how my wife has seen it for a while, don't know how long exactly, she can't say definitively. After reading these forums and all the books I've mentioned like 5 LL and "If He Only Knew", I felt like "Wow" have I been a complete fool. You read the situations of the couples in the book and you're like, "That's me, I did exactly that". When my wife tried to talk to me about our relationship and how she felt like we were just roommates, I of course felt attacked and then would stonewall or withdrew. The more I read the more I start to get it. I love my wife but I certainly didn't show her love in a way that she appreciated. Her Love Tank was and certainly is empty.

Also, 15 years ago, I had a couple of incidents with drinking too much which led to inappropriate behavior of kissing and fondling. I did walk away from the situations before they went too far. Three years after these incidents, I told my wife about them so she knows everything. We worked through it and it seemed she forgave me, but she has always been extremely distrustful of me, which is understandable.

Was this behavior with the same female or different ones? Why did you wait until three years later to confess?

These were different ones, I didn't even know them other than that night. I'm no saint but my wife is the only women I've ever been intimate with. I have never had any type of PA or EA. I couldn't be involved with someone else, not something I could do. What I did was egregious enough, it was cheating. I was scared to tell her. With the way she reacted on other things, I knew she would really be angry on this. What a fool I was..

When did her mistrust of you begin?

Well, I think once I told her of those indiscretions she lost her trust in me although from how she reacted my old girlfriend, maybe she always was somewhat insecure. Maybe I just wasn't aware enough to realize how being sexually molested by her brother would affect her trust and security issues.

However she feels like I didn't do enough to help her with the trust issue and now says she should have left me back then and has never forgiven me for it.

Was there any professional MC? What did she mean that you didn't do enough to help?

We have never had MC. Look, I'm guilty of being the classic stoic pilot that can handle it. I'm not sure back then I would have been reseptive to MC. I don't think she feels that I was transparent enough. I don't have a separate email account, she has access to all the finances and does all the banking. I couldn't spend a dollar without her knowing about it. She has the cellphone account and could always see any phone call or text I made. But she would ask "what is your work number?" and I said "I'm never at my desk, just call my cellphone" and she took it as being evasive. One complaint she has been relentless with is why were there no pictures of our family on my desk. I'm just never at my desk, it isn't that kind of office, I don't even use the computer at my desk. Almost no one at work has a picture of their family. She never had an issue with this when I was in the Air Force or at a previous airline. When I'm at work I'm in the simulator or briefing a crew. My cellphone is always with me and I would always answer when she calls. I am never unavailable to her. I finally got around to putting together some pictures last some and she got mad and said it was too late to put pictures on my desk. "Don't pretend now" she said. So she feels that I'm not or haven't been actively trying to allay her trust with me. Again I am late to the party in understanding it is about how she feels, not what I think, and if she wasn't comfortable then I should have made a better effort to comply with her requests.

Let me go back to this statement:

Talked about living like roommates for the past couple of years and why didn't I want to do something about it.

Whose idea was it to live like roommates? She would make the comment, maybe three times in the last 2.5 years. She works 5 days a week, many times she be gone when I would get up in the morning, then she would be in bed by 8-9 o'clock. I couldn't go to bed that early. I worked on projects at home a lot the past few years. My boss allowed me to work at home as much as I wanted as long as things got done. When I had a big project I would stay up until 1 or 2 in the morning working on it. But like I said, I've been home more much more than my wife since she went back to work. She is tired all the time from her job. From sixth grade on I've been the one there helping my sons with their homework, projects etc. Football practice, riding practice, lacrosse, it was me primarily. My oldest has been difficult at times, doesn't always follow the rules and can be a little disruptive at times. I was probably too hard on him. My youngest is a outstanding student, is one of the top cadets in his class. Overall my sons are doing very well. Anyway, there just never seemed to be a lot of time for us. My schedule is never set, I could work early one day, late the next. Sometimes weekends. Occasionally fly a trip every other month.

Did this sort of revolved around the surgery or her treatments? What happen to turn things around last spring? I know I'm asking lots of questions, but try to bear with me while I get it sorted.
I think the initial surgery is when this really started to gain momentum.

Was your W distrustful of you before she found out about the inappropriate behavior? A pilot can turn the heads of some women just b/c he's wearing a uniform. Did you have women hitting on you a lot? Must have made time away from home rather tough.
Made me chuckle. No, I have never been someone who has had to worry about women hitting on me. Like I said earlier, maybe my wife was insecure before the inappropriate behavior, but certainly distrustful after. One decision I made back in 2000 was to work in the airline flight training department as an instructor. I was home almost every night when my kids were young, my wife didn't have to worry about me being gone, and it gave me the experience to move to my current job in management at a much more financially stable Cargo airline.

I also was aware of the airline pilot issues of being gone, laying over with flight attendants etc. I knew I never wanted to be in a bad situation like what had happened before, so the entire 9 years I worked for a major passenger airline, on layovers I never went out to eat or did any activity with the flight attendants. Just did my own thing, usually worked out, sight-seeing and never drank. Again there was no way I would be in a bad situation again.

Thing is, we got intimate a lot last spring, then in July we had an argument and from then there hasn't been any physical contact between us.

That argument must have been a doozy! Did she go back to the stuff 15 yrs ago? During the the time after the fight in July, did you ever try to initiate intimacy?
How does that quote go, "My wife doesn't get hysterical, she gets historical". At the point my wife is at, I think she sees everything in our marriage as bad. She compares me against other men and their relationships with their wife's, especially her friend in Dallas. How well she is treated by her husband, why can't I be more like him. That is what she wants from a relationship, not a loveless marriage like ours.

Let me explain this past spring and summer. She started to shoot skeet last spring, I thought it was great she found something she really liked. She shot in a league very Thursday night, it was almost all male except for her and one other female. She was doing well and started to receive a lot of attention(male). She really likes it and wants to get better.

She starts to practice with a coach and shoot in some tournaments. Coach tells her how good she is and with practice she could really be good. I think it is great. But then I find her under the covers texting this coach at all hours of the night. i just happened to walk in on her and she tried to hide her phone. She says it is no big deal, but I get pretty upset, why hide it like that. She says it is fun to talk about shooting with him.

Well after this argument, that is when she initiated being intimate with me after maybe a year of not being intimate. We doing well in this area for about two months up until July 11th(at least I tight so). Although the anger with the F bombs was never far from the surface.

However, she spent a lot of time shooting, she was either at work or shooting, didn't spend much time with me and the boys. I saw her at night of course, I was going to bed with her more often and just trying to be available to her. The texting incident made me a little uneasy. I have always trusted my wife implicitly. This was something new with texting a male friend all the time.

July 11th was the AK state skeet shoot, my wife shot all day for three days straight. The last night she called and said she was going to stop and have a drink with her coach and other guys to celebrate. I said it was fine but I felt a little hurt she didn't want to come and celebrate with me or invite me to join them. I was insecure about it looking back. She got try angry that I had any sort of problem with her going to a bar and having a couple of drinks. But again with the texting incident, I just felt a little uneasy.

Well that was it for her. No more kisses, holding hands. no more ILY's. She said that was the last straw. Two days later she had bought her own cell phone. A week later I was in Shanghai and happened to see a hotel charge on the credit card and wondered what that was. My wife was at work supposedly so I called the hotel and they said she had just checked in. They transferred me to the room and my wife answered which I completely caught her of guard. She came clean and said she had set up this with some doctor at work and it got carried away. Said the doc was probably never going to show any way, she was totally embarrassed and didn't know how I could have ever done what I did to her. So nothing happened, but I will never know what could have happened had I not called.

So now I go into the full panic, clingy, what is going on mode. She says she doesn't know how she feels about our relationship etc.

Again for the whole summer she was either working or shooting. The boys and I were on our own. She never took time to be with us. The F bombs got more and more, even directed at my boys somewhat. She never used to swear like that.
Took my sons back to college and prep school end of August with my wife. After dropping my last son off(his first year of college), my W and I went out to dinner, had a great time. She had some drinks but seemed fine, when we got back to hotel room she initiated sex with me. The next morning she said she didn't remember any of it and it didn't change anything between us.

Things seemed to level out, she took a shooting clinic on Sept 11 with a national shooting coach(he lives in TX). He of course told her ow good she could be, how fun she was etc. She started talking to him on the phone that next week every night for 2 to 3 hours. I got the "we need to talk" the next week and she said she wanted a divorce on Sept 20th.




It seems that she needs the help of a good therapist (who is pro-marriage). If she's been through all this other with her cancer, etc., there is something she can't turn loose about the inappropriate behavior. There's either more than you've told us, or she refuses to forgive anyone that she sees as betrayal.

I stopped pursuing my wife in Sept. She still takes to the man in TX a lot but also has made friends with the mans girlfriend, so I don't know if there is anything going on there. She no longer talks with her shooting coach from this past summer, she said she was talking to him too much and has let that go. She has her own cell phone, but I rally no longer care who she is talking to. I've learned I can't control what she does!

So now what, I feel like I've been run over by a truck.

Lost in Alaska

[anclost]

By the way Sandi2, thanks for responding and the excellent questions!

Lost in Alaska

[25yearsmlc]

Dear Anch,

Wow what a situation and history...only a few things at a time b/c that will be long enough of a post. There will be SOME 2 x 4s for you but mostly they deal with the past. I only say them so you can see your w's point of view and imo, why some of what "Normally works" won't likely in your case.

Many WAWs want divorces to get away from men they have come to dislike b/c of the way the h's have treated them...they were critical, depressivel, controlling,etc. THOSE men need to back off.

I do NOT get that from your w. On the contrary I think you've done a good job at, best case, benign neglect. B/c of the cancer your level of neglect and working too much is worse.

So you have to wake up. Plus you DO have a past of what she views as cheating (and most people here in the position of LBSers feel the same. That making out is as bad as...or so they say...in any event, she felt betrayed and clearly SHE did NOT work it through. YOU HAD but she had not. There's kind of a Big ass difference.

Plus you live in Alaska...dear God I have mixed feelings. Jack3beans loves it there and so did my h. But I did not and for two unrelated reasons.

First, and foremost, my h went native on me and we had LESS time than ever together. After years of him being an MD and residency and all that training I figured he'd FINALLY have family time but all that meant for HIM was more time for HIS hobbies and IF WE joined him...great...IF NOT...so what...I had a newborn and in the interior of Alaska, you don't do a lot outdoors and inside activities are limited there, to say the least.

If you were gone a lot as I suspect, you put her in a crappy place to spend a lot of time alone. When I saw that you wrote, "SHE AGED HERE"...all I could do was slap my forehead and say "OMG get her out of there!"

Finally, she had breast cancer. That's the most intimate of the cancers that show...and it's crucial that a man show his wife MORE attraction than ever.

If I were THEN in a roomie situation I would directly relate it to my h NOT being attracted to me now that I've had breast cancer. Did she get reconstructive surgery?

Even so, most of my friends tell me that only helps them look good in clothes but naked their scars are THEIR scars and they loathe them and fear them.

I saw a film with this issue in it and the h could no longer make love to his w, even though he loved her. But her bf could.

Her OM saw her scars as the "the marks of victory, that she had beaten cancer and that she was all the more beautiful for it, and that he found the scars to be turn ons"....suddenly her affair made sense to me, in the film. Food for thought.

I believe you have grossly underestimated her feelings of undesirability and the "roomate" situation she commented upon, which "you did nothing about" only confirmed that to her. Then instead of seeing you act like a sex starved man, you are looking good and working out and dressing better.

Though WE here KNOW it's GAL - it's also exactly what men/women do when they plan to leave their spouse.

Hello,

I have been reading these forum threads for the last 4 months since my wife asked for a divorce. I'm hesitant to post because it seemed I could glean many answers to my situation and didn't want to repeat a lot of what has already been said. However, there are some significant issues which I can't find that similar on this board. So here goes....

for some reason this struck me as too passive....why wait if you are hurting?



My sitch is married for 20 years, and have S16 and S19. S19 is a freshman in college and S16 is sophomore at a college prep boarding school.

do you live in a remote area so the younger son has to go away to school? Why isn't he at home?

I ask b/c that means she is alone at home that much more...and you are gone...dang,what a place to put someone and then have no one at home with them you cannot put a woman there and leave her alone so much...it's called a "hardship assignment" in the military for a reason.


I feel our relationship changed about 6 years ago when my wife went back to work. a year later she was diagnosed with breast cancer. She is 5 years cancer free this past fall, her treatment was a mastectomy initially with a preventive mastectomy a in Sept of 2010. This was not a reoccurrence but a preventative decision. Wife is an RN and I am a pilot for a major airline.


so did she have the reconstructive surgery for her breast removals? ANY menopausal symptoms? Such as?




W complaints have been I work too much, put my career ahead of the family, don't pay attention to her, wasn't there during the cancer treatments(radiation) because I was had to work.


were you there or not? Regardless of work issues, were you there for her or not? How much of it did you miss? If you were not there for her, who was?



Talked about living like roommates for the past couple of years and why didn't I want to do something about it.

ALARM BELLS ALARM BELLS.....DING DING

SHE FEELS VERY UNATTRACTIVE OR WORSE...AND YOU ARE LIVING "LIKE ROOMATES"....AND SHE TOLD YOU THIS....(that's her sending a red flare into the universe)

and what did you DO then, differently?


I was too hard on our oldest S, wasn't a very good father and role model for our sons.


what does that^^^ mean? Is it true? So, What's new NOW?


In summary, I've made every mistake you could make in a relationship it seems.

is this accurate, or mostly, or partly or only b/c you are wearing a hairshirt now and being a martyr??


Also, 15 years ago, I had a couple of incidents with drinking too much which led to inappropriate behavior of kissing and fondling. I did walk away from the situations before they went too far.


blah blah blah way too wordy!!! As far as SHE is concerned, you cheated. And I doubt she believes you didn't complete the act

and if she does, she isn't giving you a hero's award for "restraining yourself"...

the reason I said "blah blah too wordy" is b/c it's a bunch of long winded ways of saying a dirty secret you are ashamed of and you are making excuses (drank too much) and using euphemisms as you go along "Inappropriate behavior of kissing and fondling"...come on anch, you fooled around but caught yourself as the last lap was around the corner.

It's not the worst thing in the world but don't gloss over it or babble about it. Okay?



Three years after these incidents, I told my wife about them so she knows everything.


WHAT? Why did you tell her this? .... If it meant nothing then the only possible reason was b/c you wanted to unburden yourself of the guilt YOU felt. What a terrible reason...what a huge mistake.

If it DID mean something to you, then you mislead us in your previous description.

And the only other possible reason for telling her was b/c you thought it was going to come out anyway, so you can't get points for confessing b/c you wanted to put your spin on it.

There is no scenario in which you should have burdened her with this. None...

sorry but now I have to ask,

did you "fool around" WHILE she was getting radiation treatments or having her breasts removed,

or did you tell her all about it later on, DURING that?

See there's no good way to dance around all this. IT wounded her deeply and more deeply than you seem to realize.



We worked through it and it seemed she forgave me, but she has always been extremely distrustful of me, which is understandable.

Did you get counselling for it? See a minister or a priest or mc or someone to show your remorse and desire for change in the marriage? A way to regain her trust?

Did you just assume time not cheating, would make it alright? You would not be the first man to assume that but then again, there are a lot of divorces too...



I've never come close to anything since, made sure I was never in any type of situation that could be questioned. However she feels like I didn't do enough to help her with the trust issue and now says she should have left me back then and has never forgiven me for it.


is she right? I mean, other than "not doing it again" what did you do differently or to show her your regret? And one last time, I promise, why did you tell her about fooling around AND then expect your version to be believed?


Like many here, I've read every relationship book I can get my hands on; DB, 5 LL, 5 L of apology, If he only Knew, Tough Love, Hold me tight, etc. I've come to realize how insensitive I really was. I have made all the mistakes these books discuss. When my wife wanted to talk I withdrew because it felt like I was being criticized again. I'm to logical and stoic which meant I didn't communicate very well.


Maybe you were being criticized but maybe you needed to hear it. OR maybe she just felt her needs were not being met and you decided to react defensively which made you ignore the actual content of her words....a tragic mistake made all too often. The walls go up and the words are not heard...the sad hurt words...

I know when my h raises his voice I can no longer hear WHAT he says, and I don't. I leave the room or tune him out completely b/c I cannot be yelled at the way my mother was by my father. So my h has to use a careful tone with me. Plus it helps him to stay respectful of me. Which is KEY...



Of course I felt things we not great but I certainly didn't think we were headed for divorce. Last spring my wife took up skeet shooting and she felt it made realize how other couple interacted and we were not the same. Thing is, we got intimate a lot last spring, then in July we had an argument and from then there hasn't been any physical contact between us.


what was the argument about? I think It's important that you left it out.
How was the physical contact when you were having it? Was SHE happy with it?



She would get violently angry with me at everything, the F word is used all the time. It was directed at me mostly but even our sons got it sometimes. After the boys returned to school in August the relationship continued to deteriorate rapidly to asking for a divorce on Sept 20th.


sounds strange but I feel like sandi...we're missing a piece of the picture here...she got "violent"...about what? And how was she "violent" with the boys?

That same day I felt the best thing to do is give her some space so I stayed with some friends for the next thirty days. I wouldn't contact her, but she would always contact me.


interesting. Do you see that you chose the easiest path FOR YOU?

I'm not saying you are necessarily wrong but I hope you notice... it sure is convenient to you, that you "felt the best thing to do" was effectively ignore her....

this woman does NOT feel loved by you and hasn't for a long time.




The anger was and is always right there. Mid October I came back to the house even though she said she didn't want me to. While I was out of the house i would still come by when W was working to let the dogs out, do the laundry etc. I would also leave dinner of some type for her since she worked long hours.


Is her love language act of service and

OR IS IT QUALITY TIME TOGETHER???? The one thing you don't seem able or willing to give?



Since I have returned I have been cautiously trying the DB techniques.


such as? And with what results?

The trouble is, if I wasn't attentive enough to her before then ignoring her wasn't the thing to do it seemed. She would invite me to met her for lunch occasionally on her day off.


Did you go or not? How'd that go?


When I have tried to get a life it really makes her angry. For example, I wanted to go see the play "Grapes of Wrath". I invited her to go and bought a ticket for her. She said maybe, then said yes, then got extremely mad about me doing this without asking her first. She then refused to go so I went anyway. She got very angry that I went, accusing me of secretly meeting someone there. Her habit is to call me, say F You and hang up. This all occurred in November.


I've tried to do other different things such as go to a coffee shop to do some work on the computer.

why are you doing that?^^ Is that a GAL or work thing? What's the goal?


Even the made her very mad, the same verbal F bombs. I usually do all the cooking in our house, my wife has seemed to withdraw from any type of domestic endeavors. I do most of the laundry, the cleaning etc. Hasn't always been this way, but every since she went to work I have slowly taken on more and more of the chores.

b/c she is working and you are at home - which I assume means you are NOT working, correct??? Makes sense.....


The two years my son was here in jr high, I went to all the school functions, teacher meetings etc while W went to very few because of her work schedule.

when was her cancer? Did you miss things when you were physically absent from the home area? I am guessing yes.

I only point this out so that when you look at your scorecard (which I urge you to LOSE b/c you definitely have one)

know that SHE has her own scorecard and on hers, she is way ahead of you...just FYI

Lately I have made an effort to learn how to cook better so I made some nice dinners when W got home from work. She was complimentary(very) yet made it clear a couple of nice dinners weren't going to change her mind.


make light of those comments. All you were hoping for, after all, was changing her mind about your cooking...

(Have no expectations that gestures like this will consciously make her change her mind or heart, AND even if they did, she'd show you LAST...)



I even made a big deal out of decorating the Xmas tree. I made a xmas music CD and some cider then spent a Saturday trimming the tree and listening to the music with her. A few weeks before Christmas she started to let me come in her bedroom were we talk some, occasionlly I would scratch her back or rub her feet if she wanted. We have watched several movies together within the last month as well. We went to lunch two weeks ago and then went shopping together. She texted me later that evening with"Are we ok?". I asked her what she meant


next time say "I sure hope so" or 'I had fun with you today" so you are saying things that are upbeat and NOT showing any expectations...but don't ask her for more info. She's then being pressured.


and she said she had fun that day and hoped things would work out but that I shouldn't read anything into it.


accept that at face value and btw, it's positive...very...


She always makes it clear that she is going to divorce me and she is moving to Dallas. We currently live in Alaska and she has aged living here and can't wait to leave -


MOVE!...ALASKA'S NOT AN EASY PLACE TO LIVE... YOUR SON IS NOT LIVING WITH YOU EITHER...WHAT A SACRIFICE...AND SHE LIKES THE SUN...look at where she talks of living.




I am in management and this was a corporate move with the promise of moving us out this summer or next. She blames me for moving here as well. I ad just started with the company and they asked me to move here within the first year with the company. I actually wasn't crazy about it but she felt like it would be an adventure.


BOY OH BOY... DID YOU JUST HIT A NERVE WITH ME!!...

okay my h wanted out of his miserable job in Texas, which the rest of us LOVED...he loved Texas but not his job.

HE WANTED to move to Alaska (didn't YOU?)

and I was pregnant with our last baby and quitting my job anyhow. I felt sorry for h b/c of his job and felt like this would be good FOR HIM

but I had strong misgivings about Alaska as I love sunny weather, am affected by it, had a ton of friends and support in Texas as did the kids. WE knew no one in Alaska but h would meet people at his job.

It was FOR HIM that we moved and at the time, I thought it was the most loving thing I had ever done for him.

When we got there, he was very VERY busy, it got very dark and insanely cold, I was alone A LOT with a newborn....(Your w had it worse b/c at least a baby gives you purpose and our last baby was easy and happy)

but the folks off post were NOT friendy (I have lived in 9 states and by far the least friendly place was the interior of Alaska....they were almost rude and very cold to us, pardon the pun). We got NO invitations over like every other place we've lived.

No "welcome to the neighborhood" until we moved on post (finally) and met other military families. For a pregnant woman who had left all her friends to have a new baby, with her kids in school who missed their old home and a h who went AWOL on us soon after moving there, it was miserable.

You say she blames you for the move. Of course she does. Why else did you there? You say She "Consented" to it b/c you coerced her into it and didn't drag her onto the plane by the hair...

Do you honestly belive you put HER needs or the kids, first, when the move idea came up?

And Oh btw, I also said "it'll be an adventure"...b/c WHAT ELSE COULD I SAY??


In fact I wanted to keep our house and commute up here to AK but she didn't like the idea. Now she blames me because she didn't want to sell the house and I should have commuted like she states was her idea. She never misses an opportunity to let me know she is leaving for Dallas, she just hasn't set a date

just move already. A chunk of your problems will be solved if she get some damn sunlight her way and can learn to forgive you for putting her there in the first place and dumping the "inappropriate" stuff on her 3 years after the fact.

I apologize to my Alaskan friends who love it there. I love parts of it too but I so relatte to this woman who is in a place she does not feel is home but an alien land that she went to for her h,

only to have him deny that and mistreat her. Anc, it MIGHT go a long way with your w if you said "this is a hard place to live for ANY woman, esp in the winter so I know it was loving of you to agree to coming here for my career."

Anch, did it help your job or not? If so, let her know and thank her for that help!


My W has yet to file for divorce. She has retained a lawyer but wants to do this as cheaply as possible. We use her income to pay for college tuition and boarding school tuition. We make a very good combined income. Her intent is that I will pay for the boys tuition once the divorce is complete since I make 4 times her income and she will be "destitute". Of course this isn't the reality, if we divorce I can't pay the tuition on my income alone. She hasn't even given the documents to the lawyer yet to determine the financial division. AK is a no fault state, and it would be a fairly straight forward division of assets. W has actually stated that if I ever want to get back together wit her that this divorce better go smoothly.


well don't help her with it!

Tell her she's the love of your life and you want to stay married to her and you are trying your best.

But what would make her believe that marriage to you today

and from this day forward, would be better or different than before?

if you cannot answer that with some specifics, she won't return.

Demonstrate your changes to her...WHAT ARE THEY ANYHOW??

You need to be able to say "W, if I had it all to do over again, there are a lot of things I'd do differently" and leave it at that.

That shows insight and the desire to change and does not escalate.

but be ready to say HOW you'd do something differently like really only moving where SHE would be happy.

What flaws did she say you had that you are now working on?

I didn't see that in your posts.

Other facts about us, wife is 49 this Feb and I'm 46. She is going through menopause for about the last year or so. The anger and F bombs started last spring. She was sexually abused by her brother as a child. Brother claims it isn't true and her parents dismissed it as well. I know it is true because of how she told me(before we were married). I certainly didn't realize the implications of how this would have affected my wife as far as trust issues.


irrelevant to YOU now. That's for a shrink or an analyst to work on.

This site is solution based so focus on what YOU CAN CHANGE and do b/c all you control is you

too often abuse is used by the victim to stay stuck and by a mate to avoid being responsible for their own stuff. So don't even go there. She's working on it and that's enough. NOT YOUR job.



I have been talking to a DB counsoler since Sept. I'm working with Jody who is great. I have learned to have compassion for my wife and how she FEELS.

the DB coaches are great and specific.


And it has seemed that things were slowly getting better. We had a ski trip planned for a week after christmas with a family from Dallas that is my W best friend from college. W said they were uncomfortable with having me come so I stayed home. Leading up to the trip we told our two S about the her decision to divorce me. Although she wanted me to tell them that it was a mutual decision. I made it clear it wasn't what I wanted.

I asked my counsoler if I should get her a xmas gift and she felt it was a good idea. I got her a pearl bracelet. This was to replace a pearl bracelet I had given her in 2000 since the pearls where very worn. I told her in the card this was much like our relationship, can't fix it so lets start new. Well when I gave it to her she said it was beautiful and she kissed me on the cheek. That night they left for Utah and she gave me a hug(first hug since July). I thought things were again slowly getting better.


good stuff



This is where it gets beyond my ability to comprehend. One of the DB techniques is to get into shape which I had already started last April. So the day my wife left for Utah with my two S it was Xmas Eve and she sent me a picture of her and the boys that said Merry Christmas. So I decided to learn how to use the timer on my SLR and took a picture of me and our two dogs in front of our Christmas tree. Thought it would be nice. Since I've started working out I've lost 45 lbs while gaining a lot of muscle. It has been a great stress relief of course. But this is where it gets crazy. Sending that picture to my wife really mad her angry. She texted me continually Xmas eve and the Xmas day with the some pretty hurtful comments. Here is an example : "who did you send that photo to besides me? F you, you have this bracelet and shove it up you a**". "You are and always will be a liar, a cheat and a poor example of a man!' etc.


when she's feeling lonely - as she has for much of the marriage, her fears get to her and your confession fed into them. So she's getting wacky and we can hope that her c or t helps her with that.

she sure is not indifferent to you which, odd as it seems, is a good sign.







They went on like that all night. Of course I didn't respond. She assumed I had sent that picture out to my friends (or girls) with the intent of showing off how I looked. None of it was true but she wasn't going to believe me.

My question is this. How do I deal with this level of vitriol? Even my counselor was pretty shocked when I read her the texts.


what's the c say to do? Or the DB coach? And your sons?


I have spent the last 6 months learning how much I have been a part of my failed relationship. I know I need to make changes.


like what???



For the last week my wife has texted me every day with pictures but hasn't called. I know I can't expect anything, but I haven't even heard from my sons.

There is a lot more, but that is enough for this post. Would appreciate any help. I know Sandi2 was a WAW, is this level of anger normal. Both DB counselors I have talked to and my good friend all seem to think my wife really doesn't want a divorce. I don't know what to think after this last week.

Thanks,
Lost in Alaska

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well I think I've given you plenty to read for now.

There IS hope in your sitch.

Get her out of Alaska or get a realistic timeframe for a move and get her input into where you relocate EVEN IF YOU ARE DIVORCING

b/c maybe you'll want to sweep her off her feet later and you'd like to know where she'll be (ask the DB coach on that one)

((( )))

[25yearsmlc]

sorry of that sounded too abrupt but I had some teeth pulled today, literally...what a pain...literally


okay on another note, yes Essential Experience is a great workshop I'd recommend to anyone looking for clarity in their life and how to dump baggage and relate better to others. Who would NOT benefit? Someone who wants to keep blaming others

or hold the past as an excuse for where they are now. Someone who does NOT want to be in charge of their life would not enjoy EE.

Your wife would get a lot out of it but do NOT GO TOGETHER at this point unless it's the only way to go at all. One at a time, then if you both get a lot out of it and are together then go together.

I did it first for reasons UNrelated to our marriage and then h saw the changes in me and went himself. Years later we went together.

For couples specifically, there is Retrovaille. It's for couples in crisis but the problem is getting a spouse to go at all. At least with EE you can go on your own.

The cost? I think it's about 800$ which only sounds pricey when you skip over the fact that it's 4 days, (and DB coaching costs more per hour, by a long shot but I recommend that too)

so EE is also about 55 hours of therapy in there, and you will have housing provided if you want, so from my point of view it was a steal.

And worth 100 times that, literally. I do NOT recommend all things to all people. A lot of mc's rehash the past and I often believe that makes the client relive the trauma and helps NO ONE and even

when it's clear the mc isn't helping the mc plods on the same path. Not all lawyers or doctors OR MCs are good or effective for all people...

Yes EE is in Philadelphia so I've driven there OR flown there a number of times. When i went back there for my 3rd time (as a "team member") I brought 2 friends from Fairbanks Alaska who went and loved it. That was far but we did it.

BTW, Essential Experience is NOT EST or Landmark or Imago, and it's not a cult or a wacky thing...no recruiting, (despite my "Salespitch" here...I don't get paid for this)

But like Retrovaille and DBing, when something really changes your life, you want others to get it too.

EE was the most profound 4 day experience I've ever had.

If you go, and I think getting there will be hard - it'll take guts just to overcome inertia -- but that's half the reason you are HERE, the power inertia has in keeping you from becoming the man you were meant to become...

then, be ready to have your world rocked...

check out their website


((( )))

[anclost]

Thank you 25 for the excellent response. I will try and make my posts shorter and address one or two issues at a time. I don't know if you read my replies to Sandi2's response, I think it answers some of your questions. I will address some of your questions further as I go along.

First, I am new at this forum format, I'm not into FB, twitter, blogging etc. So if my formatting isn't correct I apologize, I'm still learning.

In regards to living in Alaska, NO I do not like living here and I did not want to move here. I was asked to take this assignment and since I was brand new to the company, I was reluctant to say no. I offered the idea of not moving and just commuting up here to work. She didn't want to do that because she didn't like the idea of me being in AK for a week or two at a time. However, now my W says that I wanted to move here and she didn't and blames me for making her move here. She said just yesterday that if we still had our house in KY, we wouldn't be getting divorced.

This assignment did nothing for me as far as career etc. Its expensive to live in AK, we get no COLA and now have to hope they will make good on the promise to move us out in 4-5 years. It was not a good decision to move here.

It is a corporate move, which means they will buy the house for the move back. If we sell the house on our own we would lose a large amount versus if the company buys it through relocation. To emphasize, my W doesn't want to sell on our own and lose money. I did talk about that but she doesn't want to do it.
When they relocate me, it will be back to KY. At least that is where my job will be. It is possible for me to commute from Dallas, but she has no interest in me moving to Dallas with her.

My son goes to a college prep boarding school. It is always hard to convey why we do this. It is a great academic school, teaches leadership etc. It is an opportunity that both our sons wanted to do. I would not have know about this prep school if it wasn't for my wife. Her family has been associated with the school's summer camp program for years. Our sons went to summer camp there from ages 9 - 15. They loved it and wanted to go to the winter school for high school. This was also what my W wanted to do when she was in high school but her parents couldn't afford it. So she really wants this for our sons.
She would not consider removing our son from school. The school is located in Indiana, which I would be close to when I'm relocated back to KY.

I have recognized the academic valve of the school and our son has excelled in every way possible. I hopefully will get relocated this summer. There are quite a few of us here that want out of AK ASAP. However there will only be one or two (maybe)who get out this year. Ironically, because of the amount of work I've put in I'm the first one in line to get moved out. I just never thought it would be alone!

I agree with you 25 that living here is not good for her. If you read my reply to Sandi2 you will see that even though I'm a pilot, most of what I do takes place in a simulator or developing training programs. I am not gone much at all. In fact I've never been home more than when we have lived here in AK. However, even though I was physically here, I was working to much and prioritized work over her too much.

I will continue to give more detail in further posts. There is a lot to express, so if it seems that I'm lacking detail in previous posts, it wasn't because I'm hiding something. It was just too much info too type.

Now my question back. And I mean this sincerely. If my wife won't come back unless she sees the possibility of the relationship being different, what do I change? How do I change myself. I want to spend time with her. I have made her the priority with my time and effort(Since last spring). But she doesn't want any part of it. Too little, too late as they all say. I had my chance, it is only because she is leaving that I'm doing anything about it she says. It seems insincere to her.

All the GAL activities seem to have the wrong effect with my W. She didn't have my time and attention, and the GAL idea would be more of the same.

How do I change myself? I've changed since we first were together she has said. I read a lot now, dress like she wants me to etc. Her comment; "your Mr. academic now, you never used to be that way". What does that mean? She has made the comment "I've made you who you are, you wouldn't be here if it wasn't for me. I've taught you how to dress, act. You were a classless hick when I met you. You made all the relationship mistakes with me, you can go off now and have a great marriage with some bimbo!".

I'm struggling for the solution approach for my situation. How do I honor, appreciate, care for, and make her feel beautiful when she is leaving and doesn't want anything to do with me? That would be my 180 right?

I said it would be short, but I'm rambling again.

Lost in Alaska

Thanks again for the great response!