Curve balls? Heck, I don't even play softball!!!

[In_Shock]

also, while I'm thinking of it--- is it 'script' for WAS to be nastier and more distant the nicer you are to them??? That's what seems to happen here a lot. I always try to remain kind, generous, caring....she seems to resent it.

I have that fear that so many others have expressed about detaching and having W and I just continue to grow apart and go our separate paths permanently. I know...it's counterintuitive but it works.....but does anyone have ANY tips for helping with this detachment thing while living with WAS??

I want us to start over. I want a NEW R with W. I know this is the only chance we have. But how to do it? I still do her laundry for example. I still buy all the groceries --even the things that are just for her (she pays some bills, I pay some, I buy groceries/toiletries,etc..) Some of my 180s are doing more around the house -- but really? Her laundry?? After she's been out with OW??? Seriously, do you think that should be a boundary???

[workinghardguy]

I have that fear that so many others have expressed about detaching and having W and I just continue to grow apart and go our separate paths permanently.

See... this is the Jedi mind-trick part of this that suxx. I think you have to at least be willing, internally, to go down your own path permanently before this even starts to work. I know I can't quite get there yet. I am getting there, but it's so hard. I do ok until I think about my W dating some other guy, some other getting the passionate hugs and caring touches and kisses I used to get. Then I don't do so well. But I know I have to get to a point where I have my own path and it doesn't involve or need her.

is it 'script' for WAS to be nastier and more distant the nicer you are to them???

Yes... at least for me it is. My general experience has been my W sees me being nicer as pursuing. If she asks me to do something then not so much, but if it's a bolt from the blue then yes. I ran to the store the other day to get Christmas lights. I texted her enroute and asked if she wanted a soda. I came home to a cold arctic front moving through the house. WTF? Then I realized... I overreached. Just force of habit, and it was only a soda for goodness sake.

Last night she asked me to grab something for her while I was coming through town. That was received with a thank you and everything was sort of our normal status quo when she got home. I guess the difference is in the first I initiated and obviously had to be thinking of her in order to ask. In the second it was for her own needs and didn't involve me having to think about her other than to answer my text message.

[MrBond]

They will be nasty no matter what. Doesn't mean you need to be. Remember, think of them as a person who is temporarily insane.

[Rick1963]

(((((((IS)))))) My WAW still cooks dinner and makes breakfast and we eat together. I still pay most of the bills. W used to buy wine for us but she stopped so I do and she thanks me. Believe it o r not you are starting to detach but can not see it yet neither can I. Give it time.

The fear about growing apart is a good one. I think if I
get this right it is what needs to happen. The R is dead already . I think she and u would. need to fall in love with 2different people but same body. Sounds weird. You should never have done her laundry and the little man should learn to do it by the time he is at least 10.

Once you stop really caring where they are things might change. W told me she was coming home late I did not ask why and really don't care. That is a 180 for me. It really feels better once it starts happening. Yes I may not want her if she ever wants to get back but she chose this and the consequences.

[Crimson]

IS, I have been excessively nice to my WAW and it has been met at best with indifference. I even bought her a bed when I found out she was sleeping at night in a sleeping bag in her new place (that image broke my heart). It took a few days before she even acknowledged it or said "thank you". Since then, she been right back to cold, distant and occasionally kind of mean. So I am beginning to see that nastiness is pattern in walk-aways, but I don't get the psychology of it. Maybe each case is unique and maybe there are common threads in all of them.

I have chosen to go as dark as I can given the fact that we have a 20 month old son together. It is hard and I, like you, sometimes wonder of pulling back this far will just greater increase the distance of someone wants to be free of you. At this point I am running on pure faith that it will work. Tonight I wanted to send a picture that I took of our dog standing over our son as he slept on the floor in a blanket. I know it would have touched her emotionally, but I dug deep and resisted. Soooooo hard.

Side note: before I found the books and this site, when I was über stressed, depressed and sad, I was putting the baby to sleep and completely blacked out and hit the floor, not unlike your W in the shower. Lack of sleep, not eating and an abundance of despair took a toll on my body. I am still down several pounds, but I am eating again and not passing out anymore. Your W was probably feeling the same.

Hope things get better.

Crimson

[25yearsmlc]

IS,

well, the good news is that you saw the L and all was not hell! I knew you
had some rights and like I said, knowledge is your friend.

You don't HAVE TO DO anything with it, yet...but now you know, or will soon. YEAH...

No I don't think they get meaner when you are kind IF you do it in a way that clearly shows you are NOT expecting anything in return but possibly courtesy. By NOT waiting for a response or by leaving the area, you make it clear you did not expect something from them. Then they are left with your gesture. IF it looks like pursuit, they'll resent it. If not, they'll take it. MAYBE they'll think "may as well since I'm here anyhow" but I do not happen to believe they ever say "Oh gee I sure will miss this, maybe I should not leave."

Later on, if you are a great chef and where they go, does not provide good food, THEN they will be free to examine their choices. As of now, they feel so trapped it is hard for them to see straight.

If they are rude to you in response, it's fair to stare at them like the nasty aliens they are becoming, but let them sulk alone.
They can embarrass themselves with such Contrasting behavior that THEY even notice it. But make sure you are Not over doing it.

The laundry is an odd thing to be doing for her now. I'd put it in a separate hamper and just do your own, but say nothing of it.

She probably won't mention it but she'll notice that you are not making such an effort

and that is a good thing for you to do now, while you can.

...she can figure out where her crap is for God's sake.

I would NOT trust son even at age 10 with laundry though. (Rick's d must be great at it b/c frankly, I don't trust my h with laundry of MINE b/c he doesn't seem to read labels...Towels and jeans are fine, but that's it.)

anyhow...

IS, I have been excessively nice to my WAW and it has been met at best with indifference. I even bought her a bed when I found out she was sleeping at night in a sleeping bag in her new place (that image broke my heart).

Crimson, this is way over board imo. It probably embarrassed her. It points out that she needs you, and if she felt dependent on you and now wants space, this was not the gesture to make, imo. Can you see my point?


It took a few days before she even acknowledged it or said "thank you". Since then, she been right back to cold, distant and occasionally kind of mean. So I am beginning to see that nastiness is pattern in walk-aways, but I don't get the psychology of it. Maybe each case is unique and maybe there are common threads in all of them.


There are certainly common threads. But it's far too easy for some people to get angry or hopeful based on someone else's experience. We are all just here trying to help those who come after us, or who are in it with us then. And

mostly we have learned what does NOT work...so we try to pass that on...


I have chosen to go as dark as I can given the fact that we have a 20 month old son together. It is hard and I, like you, sometimes wonder of pulling back this far will just greater increase the distance of someone wants to be free of you. At this point I am running on pure faith that it will work.


Crimson, what were HER reasons for wanting out? I mean that does matter and affects the approach you take. Where is your thread? I'm sorry if I missed that post.

Tonight I wanted to send a picture that I took of our dog standing over our son as he slept on the floor in a blanket. I know it would have touched her emotionally, but I dug deep and resisted. Soooooo hard.


IMO, the one thing or type of contact that seems to be appreciated and is safe IS that type of contact. Just an "fyi, thought you'd like this" and then say no more. ALL about the baby...

nothing about you as a couple or family, just the son in the picture is a nice gesture that usually is not seen as pursuit IF THE WORDS with it are not pursuing words...



Side note: before I found the books and this site, when I was über stressed, depressed and sad, I was putting the baby to sleep and completely blacked out and hit the floor, not unlike your W in the shower. Lack of sleep, not eating and an abundance of despair took a toll on my body. I am still down several pounds, but I am eating again and not passing out anymore. Your W was probably feeling the same.

Hope things get better.

Crimson

hope YOU are feeling better and eating better Crimson! Sure, the DB diet is effective but we like the idea of health - so remember, you gotta eat something decent every day, and sleep every day, and get SOME Peace, every day...everyone needs that.

[NLW]

Hi IS, I'm with Mr B on this one - they will be nasty no matter what.

My H has been going through a nasty cycle for 2-3 weeks now, and I think it's because he's seeing me start to detach.
Tonight for instance when he came over to cook dinner (arriving 45 mins later than he said he would), I stopped working on my computer at the kitchen table and went out to do gardening until S13 called me in to eat. I was pleasant and did a bit of small talk, but really just wanted to be outside, not in the kitchen talking to him the whole time.

S13 was out in the yard with me, and D15 was shut in her room, so H was here 'on his own' pretty much for the first time, as it were.

He left within an hour of arriving - and when I asked why he was going early, he exploded. So, be nice or be detached, when they are not getting their own way, they will lash out regardless.

[Crimson]

I think you are right about the bed, 25. She did, however, ask for the help even though it was most likely humbling. I did it with no true expectations at all. My heart just went out to her when I learned she was sleeping on the floor. As a human being I think it was the right thing to do. As someone looking to DB, I question it still.

I am eating once again, 25! And I am miles away from blacking out again. .
DR and these boards have really helped out.

Crimsom

[In_Shock]

WHG said: "I do ok until I think about my W dating some other guy, some other getting the passionate hugs and caring touches and kisses I used to get. Then I don't do so well. But I know I have to get to a point where I have my own path and it doesn't involve or need her."

I totally know what you mean. If W was leaving/decided to 'find herself' etc... that is one thing. I was ok until I found out that within a couple of weeks from the bomb, she was connecting with someone else, and it got physical within a few weeks...THEN i began to really feel it. I thought at first, well, this will be ok. W will work on herself. I will work on myself. We'll come through this. Turns out her working on herself was just a big old excuse to pursue this OW she'd been having EA with....

Can I do the Jedi mind trick thing? I'm trying. I have good days and bad days. It seems that when something new comes up -- like she goes somewhere with OW and blatantly wears the sweatshirt the next day, or gets a mailer from a jewelry store as a preferred customer, or blah blah blah...it's a constant reminder that I don't matter to her anymore and I need to definitely find my own path. I'm getting there.

Last night we were talking about practical things like S, his xmas play, money things, etc... W told me she is ambivalent about me -- but when pushed to think about it, says she just doesn't 'like' me and doesn't even want to be friends . Hmmm... 13 years and I'm tossed aside like some garbage. I validated. I listened. I agreed that -- yes, I know, I understand why you feel that way.

BUT I DON'T really for some of it. The ANGER - the dislike--- I'm being left. I'm ANGRY, SAD, HURT and losing my family with no choice. And SHE's angry/doesn't like me, etc..... WTH??

Just rambling myself. Got to go to class right now. Thought I'd check in for a minute. Feeling ok i guess....I keep thinking of the old, was it Ramones? song --- I wanna be sedated....!!! Until perhaps next June or July????

[In_Shock]

just to clarify --- (i can hear 25 reading this last message...) I did not 'push' W to think about it -- this was a quote from her. She said, " I am ambivalent about you, but if I'm pushed to think about it, I have to say I just don't like you or want to be your friend."

Didn't want a 2 X 4 -- I actually did a pretty decent job of validating and listening for once!!

She reminded me this am i need a new phone b/c mine is dead and I need off her 'family plan'. Guess I really have to get a new phone now. I dread christmas.....