The hammer incident happened in 2008. And like most things, if there isn't a witness, hard to prove, hard to make a complaint stick.
T:22, M:20 H:55 Me:45 H-OW PA: N/07 OW Jan08 Bomb:Feb/08 S: Apr/08 Back together Ap1/09-Sept/11 Oct, 2011, uncertain future/H is a mess. Dec/11 - Doin'friend mode. Some days are better than others.
Help me understand: if DBing is about "do what works," then why would you NOT let OW know your husband is still ML to you, when you ADMIT that it would be effective?? Starsky
Ok, given it's unconventional, but I KNOW the only chance to get this thing done with, once and for all, is to basically let them self destruct together. I can't really do the full monty of that until this house is sold.
In a nut shell... this is a chess match. And for for us to have any chance to actually fix "us", H has to feel what it's like to be betrayed. And fully understand what he's done. Only then will someone like that be willing to do the work and make a full on effort to be the person he used to be again. And make amends to me. Will he? I don't know.
What I do know is: because I've lived part one of this back in 08 and 09, I know what I'm dealing with, with him and her. The big Dark Zone and LRT will only work if I let it go now, and then shove back hard later. (It's what I had to do then, and what I know I have to do now.) He will miss me like crazy. Especially when the WACKJOB begins to let her guard down and become verbally abusive, manipulative and issuing her threats. (which she's already doing btw).
He, btw, is already betraying her... with me. Again. *shrug* If I was to show those cards now, I've basically played my cards.
To be honest, I don't really know if I will want this man once we get to this point. That's where I'm at. As others have said about their spouses, the LBS begin seeing a very unflattering picture. Weak, lying, cheaters etc. Can those people actually become better people. Some do, some don't. My father wasn't the same man in the last 15 years of his life, vs what he was when he was married to my mother. People can make those changes, they have to want to. Will I ever trust him again? I don't know. Will I want to? I don't know. Is he actually capable of doing that work and leaving behind the scumbag personality traits? I don't know.
So.... This is survival, and I do know that you meant boundaries with H. I'm looking at this long term. He's going to get lots of them when I'm out of here. Where I was emotionally when this thing happened in 2008 and now, are very different. Thus my willingness to really just try to put up with the insanity is for the longer term goal. And I refuse to live in a war zone. If push comes to shove, I'll make him move out.
As is sits now, ...He's 2 weeks into wanting his "new" sitch to all just be a smooth happy bump free existence. Like that's going to last, right? He's emotionally upheaved. AND He's alien abducted, and as such not much else will get through. He wants everyone to dance to his tune. (As does she). The thing is, the more I put up with, with her trying to pull the strings, the more sloppy and her true colors will shine through. Time is on my side, both with having to sell the house... and her just losing her nut and starting to make all kinds of demands on him. It won't work. And guess what she'll do next? Threaten to limit any access to his daughter. What do you suppose happens then? Lots of fighting, threats and other nasties between them, no?
She has to burn him. And in order for that to happen, I have to go at this with a "new mind". I'm the mistress right now. It serves the longer term goal.
I walk away to the other end of the house when he talks to her. And make no mistake... if there was no child, he'd be GONE.
T:22, M:20 H:55 Me:45 H-OW PA: N/07 OW Jan08 Bomb:Feb/08 S: Apr/08 Back together Ap1/09-Sept/11 Oct, 2011, uncertain future/H is a mess. Dec/11 - Doin'friend mode. Some days are better than others.
Help me understand: if DBing is about "do what works," then why would you NOT let OW know your husband is still ML to you, when you ADMIT that it would be effective?? Starsky
Ok, given it's unconventional, but I KNOW the only chance to get this thing done with, once and for all, is to basically let them self destruct together. I can't really do the full monty of that until this house is sold.
In a nut shell... this is a chess match. And for for us to have any chance to actually fix "us", H has to feel what it's like to be betrayed. And fully understand what he's done. Only then will someone like that be willing to do the work and make a full on effort to be the person he used to be again. And make amends to me. Will he? I don't know.
What I do know is: because I've lived part one of this back in 08 and 09, I know what I'm dealing with, with him and her. The big Dark Zone and LRT will only work if I let it go now, and then shove back hard later. (It's what I had to do then, and what I know I have to do now.) He will miss me like crazy. Especially when the WACKJOB begins to let her guard down and become verbally abusive, manipulative and issuing her threats. (which she's already doing btw).
He, btw, is already betraying her... with me. Again. *shrug* If I was to show those cards now, I've basically played my cards.
To be honest, I don't really know if I will want this man once we get to this point. That's where I'm at. As others have said about their spouses, the LBS begin seeing a very unflattering picture. Weak, lying, cheaters etc. Can those people actually become better people. Some do, some don't. My father wasn't the same man in the last 15 years of his life, vs what he was when he was married to my mother. People can make those changes, they have to want to. Will I ever trust him again? I don't know. Will I want to? I don't know. Is he actually capable of doing that work and leaving behind the scumbag personality traits? I don't know.
So.... This is survival, and I do know that you meant boundaries with H. I'm looking at this long term. He's going to get lots of them when I'm out of here. Where I was emotionally when this thing happened in 2008 and now, are very different. Thus my willingness to really just try to put up with the insanity is for the longer term goal. And I refuse to live in a war zone. If push comes to shove, I'll make him move out.
As is sits now, ...He's 2 weeks into wanting his "new" sitch to all just be a smooth happy bump free existence. Like that's going to last, right? He's emotionally upheaved. AND He's alien abducted, and as such not much else will get through. He wants everyone to dance to his tune. (As does she). The thing is, the more I put up with, with her trying to pull the strings, the more sloppy and her true colors will shine through. Time is on my side, both with having to sell the house... and her just losing her nut and starting to make all kinds of demands on him. It won't work. And guess what she'll do next? Threaten to limit any access to his daughter. What do you suppose happens then? Lots of fighting, threats and other nasties between them, no?
She has to burn him. And in order for that to happen, I have to go at this with a "new mind". I'm the mistress right now. It serves the longer term goal.
I walk away to the other end of the house when he talks to her. And make no mistake... if there was no child, he'd be GONE.
Starsky said: OK, I'll bite, and I'll get straight to the point:
Why would your husband want to be with a wife that would allow him to say "I love you" to the woman with whom he is having an affair, in that wife's presence?
If you two were single, and just met, would this behavior be attractive to him, or repulsive?
Repulsive. So, I know what you're saying. And honestly... a man who's doing this doesn't view me as his wife right now, does he? You're going with the assumption that doing/saying something is going to be able to reach him. I'm telling you, it won't.
There is a cavalierness and a flippancy to your attitude toward your marriage and how precarious it is right now, and to your husband's infidelity, that I find disturbing and a bit odd. A defense mechanism of yours, perhaps? (which is UNDERSTANDABLE).
After all the hurt and damage he's done. I don't know if I want him back. There's nothing flippant or cavalier about my feelings about this at all. I rips my heart out. Right now... I'm buying time to sort out my feelings, and trust me... the anger I feel IS driving this. My sis in law and H's brother are ready to skin him alive. She hears the tears and the frustration and anger. She's told me to kick him out.
We still have a business that I can't just let die. That's MY future. That's MY ability to walk away from this without being broke and having to work until I'm 80. I'm trying to protect myself from what is a totally INSANE and extremely complicated sitch.
Sometimes you have to do things that on the surface look strange.... This IS about survival.
T:22, M:20 H:55 Me:45 H-OW PA: N/07 OW Jan08 Bomb:Feb/08 S: Apr/08 Back together Ap1/09-Sept/11 Oct, 2011, uncertain future/H is a mess. Dec/11 - Doin'friend mode. Some days are better than others.
BTW, instead of walking away this time. I went and closed the door to his office. Didn't slam it, didn't make noise, just closed it. He asked me... did you close it? I said yes. I don't need to be listening to that.
He nodded, hugged me.
He inched a progress to access with "her" to his daughter. He's all happy with himself at the moment. My question: Do you feel you're making progress? He said, yes... baby steps.
And then said to me: you are right about getting his daughter away from her and spend time alone with her. (I had made a comment about children who have separation issues because the parent holds on to the infant too protectively, let them sleep in their bed too long etc). It had to do with a completely different set of people, so he saw no threat in my comments.
Considering what we're dealing with, with the parasite... it's all part and parcel of her M.O. She is doing the same thing with her husband. She's a narcissistic nutjob. Expects my H and HER on again, off again H to jump when she says so. Only what SHE wants matters to her. H will put up with it only as long as it suits his purpose... access to his daughter. The fights will be explosive when he has to say no to her. (as they were before).
T:22, M:20 H:55 Me:45 H-OW PA: N/07 OW Jan08 Bomb:Feb/08 S: Apr/08 Back together Ap1/09-Sept/11 Oct, 2011, uncertain future/H is a mess. Dec/11 - Doin'friend mode. Some days are better than others.
From the alien abduction files. I caught my H lying to me about going over the the OW's house. I got mad enough to go over there, pounded on the door.
She was shocked when she opened it and I was there. I told her: He's yours darling, you've won, you can have him. You two deserve each other. I happily called her a whore.
She swore up and down they're not sleeping together, has the same mantra as he does: I work too many hours to have a relationship etc. Explains that she can't tell her husband about H and her being in contact again and that H is part of his daughters life, because it will put him in an insane asylum. (Talk about grandiose opinion of herself, to think someone she has deceived over and over still is so in love with her that her actions could put him in an insane asylum. *shakes head*
Anyway, H goes wacko because now he's got 2 women who have him cornered in lies... (because I'm sure he's told her, we are no longer acting as a married couple)...SHE looks him straight in the face and says: You have to decide once and for all what you want.
He comes home... loaded for bear. I just kept saying, You lied to me. I caught you, you can rant and rave all you want. You're just mad because you got CAUGHT.
Then he tries to justify his lying as of course... MY fault. He had to lie because of my reaction to him spending time with her. (All the while he's trying to figure out how to approach him being able to go over in the night time to play "house" with their daughter and her 4 other kids.) (Which I want btw... nice dose of reality is exactly what needs to happen.)
He then tries to pull: well if you had of left this alone, it was pretty certain it would be you and I who are together in the end. So I point my finger into his chest and say bull... you are either lying or if that's how you feel, then this wouldn't break how you feel about me and a future for us. I walk over to the door she kicked and pointed to the scuff mark (that I've left there all this time)... and said that women lied about you beating her up... and YOU seem able to forgive her. So stop the BS.
He blathers about me now making her so mad that she won't let him see his daughter. I just said, oh really, hiring a lawyer would have you full alone access in weeks, so quit lying. He keeps saying, I can't believe the damage you've done. (yeah to unraveling his lies) So I start to repeat saying: Look,... you're in love with 2 women...so buy me out, and I'll be out of your life once and for all. Kept repeating it. Then he starts to cry. Telling me I deserve better. And starts clinging to me. Tells me he can't make promises about what will happen in the future. I told him the truth... I don't know what I want either.
I wait a while, she phones, he then tells her everything is ok here. Tells her something about me saying, fine go and have dinner with all the kids etc. (Yeah, like she doesn't have the happily ever fantasy of him living with her and her 5 kids.)
I wait a while and then approach him and ask: Have you approached our mortgage broker friend and could you buy me out.
He looks at me with shock and says you really want to be rid of me that badly? Cripes, talk about loss of reality.
Of course I start to cry by this point and say, I need to let you go, and you need to let me go. He tells me he loves me. I tell him I love him too but neither one of us are in love with one another. (How can you be in love with someone who's this far lost?)
He tells me no more sex. That's it, it's not fair. I smile and say, yeah... ok.
Half an hour later after a long convo and a lot of tears from both of us, I said, I still don't know why we can't have sex. He says: I'll think about it. I look him straight in the eye and pinch my fingers together leaving a space of about half an inch apart and say,... I'm leaving the door open that much. Both about the sex, and if I even want a future with you. He says no sex. I said,... yeah...sure. He then smiles and says. Because I haven't forgiven you yet.
When we sit down to watch the news,...I sit at the other end of the couch (instead of my position of sitting beside him). He reaches out to me and says come here. Why are you so far away? He pulls me close. Starts joking with me. And claims he's hunger. (even though 10 minutes before, he thinks he's mad and doesn't want to eat any food.)
Oh and to top it all off, he's so far out of brain, he swears we're no longer married that we got divorced in 2008. We didn't.
Oh btw,... he comes to bed... and starts caressing me. Whispers in my ear, I'm so mad at you. I don't know what kind of damage you've done. I reach out to kiss him... we have sex.
Alien abduction.
T:22, M:20 H:55 Me:45 H-OW PA: N/07 OW Jan08 Bomb:Feb/08 S: Apr/08 Back together Ap1/09-Sept/11 Oct, 2011, uncertain future/H is a mess. Dec/11 - Doin'friend mode. Some days are better than others.
Thank you MZ, so much. I've come to the prayer party "later" in life. I'm still sorting my self out with how God fits in my life. Thank you for the kind words and thoughts. Prayers are always appreciated.
Abbey
T:22, M:20 H:55 Me:45 H-OW PA: N/07 OW Jan08 Bomb:Feb/08 S: Apr/08 Back together Ap1/09-Sept/11 Oct, 2011, uncertain future/H is a mess. Dec/11 - Doin'friend mode. Some days are better than others.
