What do I do next? Part 2

[luvhurts49]

I know I can't make my W come back and I can't make her leave OM. I also know that anything that I change in myself, I can't make her see it--she has to want to see it. So I guess what I was trying to say was that I need to become the best that I can be for myself and my kids and hopefully my W with see it too.

TM, I'd rather have you be harsh than to sugarcoat things. Sometimes you need to be direct and not nice to get your point across.

In the back of my mind, I still keep hoping that OM gets tired of my W and let's her go. I read somewhere that people coming out of or are S have like a 10% chance of finding a solid, long-term R on the first try (this includes A). God I hate stats.

[luvhurts49]

Just wanted to share this as it really ticked me off. W has the kids. I talk to my oldest son and he tells me that my W said to him that leaving me was the best decision she ever made. That she was so tired of arguing with me all the time.

What ticks me off about that (other than it being the "best decision") is that she admitted to me when she left was that SHE began starting arguments with me near the end just because she could. So now she's blaming me for always arguing when she starts it and now that she's left, it's the best decision she made? Arrrrgggg!!!!!

[Accuray]

Yeah, sharing that with your S was inappropriate, particularly after she accused you of talking poorly about her to your youngest.

You might want to tell her that for the sake of the kids, you will not discuss how you feel about each other or your separation in their presence. Tell her you think it's important that they think well of their mother and you will do what you can to support that. (The implication is that she should do the same, but you can't demand that)

Remember that she's trying to convince herself that what she's doing is right, so she'll make statements like that more for herself than for anyone else. Know that she is struggling with this and feels badly about it. She won't show that to you or the kids, but she is.

Despite your dislike for statistics, I did read that marriages arising from affairs have about an 80% failure rate -- they are grounded in fantasy and that's not a solid foundation.

Another statistic is that the "in love" feeling that your W is enjoying will end with 100% certainty for both her and OM. This takes weeks to months depending on the situation. I believe it will wear off *faster* the more they get to spend time together, because they have each other on a pedestal and ignore each others' flaws. If you only see the other person an hour a day socially, it's easy to keep that idealistic love going. If you're with the other person 4 hours a day and on weekends, those flaws are going to get less and less easy to ignore.

I read that coming out of a marriage, your W will either choose another guy like you, because she was initially attracted to your personality traits, or she will choose the exact opposite. If she chooses "like you", the same issues she had with you will surface again, because they are really her issues. If she chooses opposite, all the things she *needed* from your personality type will be missing, and that will blow up even harder.

Therefore, *usually* it's a waiting game with OM, but not always, there are no guarantees (per Telemark). Know, though, that whatever bothered you about your wife will bother OM, and in many ways they are on a ticking clock that will eventually blow.

When OM DOES go away though, that does not mean she comes looking to you to take her back. Instead she will go through grieving, will feel badly, and will be looking to feel better. The guilt associated with what she's done to you, as well as her negative memories of your relationship will not make you an attractive place to feel better.

That's why you need to "pave the road back" by not making her feel guilty, not arguing with her, not being depressed around her etc. You want her to feel (when the time comes) that the reset button has been pushed and she can come back to you without first having to fill in the giant hole that she dug. Part of this is being "good with yourself" and appearing to not care if she comes back or not. If she does, great, and if not, you're OK with that too.

This board is usually light on levity because everyone's generally in a pretty bad place, but I always enjoyed this dialog from "Fast Times at Ridgemont High":

Mike Damone: That's the idea, Rat. That's the attitude.

Mark Ratner: The attitude?

Mike Damone: Yeah! The attitude dictates that you don't care whether she comes, stays, lays, or prays. I mean whatever happens, your toes are still tappin'. Now when you got that, then you have the attitude.

See if you can find "the attitude" for yourself, to me it's the combination of 180 and GAL. Whatever happens, your toes are still tappin'

Don't mean to make light, but we can all use a smile right?

Accuray

[2thepoint]

That's why you need to "pave the road back" by not making her feel guilty, not arguing with her, not being depressed around her etc. You want her to feel (when the time comes) that the reset button has been pushed and she can come back to you without first having to fill in the giant hole that she dug. Part of this is being "good with yourself" and appearing to not care if she comes back or not. If she does, great, and if not, you're OK with that too.

This is so key! What Accuray says is spot on!

[Autumn Leaves]

Accuray, I love the reference to Fast Times at Ridgemont High Very well done!

[luvhurts49]

Unfortunately, with an ongoing D looming over our heads, there is going to be friction between us and I'm sure it will lead to "discussions" at some point.

You see, when I got served my D papers, I was shocked to read some of the statements in there because it was the direct opposite from what my W has been telling me. Now I didn't say anything or contact her because I was upset and didn't want to say anything I would regret. However, she did call me and wondered how my day went knowing full well that I got served at my job. Although I was upset, I simply asked "how do think it went".

I understand that lawyers are initially going to shoot for the moon and once the smoke clears, they will take aim a little closer to reality. Once my papers are signed and filed (today), I'm sure she isn't going to be very happy with some of the statements in the response.

Now I don't really care how she reacts to the paperwork because I already know she's gonna be ticked, but what the heck am I supposed to do about it? So, paving the road is gonna be a little bumpy unfortunately.

So on top of the D paperwork and what her reaction is gonna be, now I also have to sit on my hands and hopefully wait for OM to let my W go just so I can wait some more to pave the road and hopefully have some chance with her again. All the while I make myself the best that I can be. Oh, and let's not forget the kids, too.

If I take the battery out of my clock, will that make time slow down? Today is gonna be one of those days.

[Accuray]

Just remember Luvhurts that you don't HAVE to do anything. You can decide to walk away today. You can get nasty and try to make the D as painful as possible, you can badmouth your W to your kids and try to make them hate their mother. You can decide not to see your kids anymore to get a "fresh start" for yourself. You can go on Match.com and start looking for someone to date. Your W made her choices, you get to make yours.

The point is that while you are in some ways a victim in terms of how you got here, you are not a victim going forward, you are charting your own course and *deciding* what to do, the choice is yours.

Each interaction with your W is a decision in terms of how you want to be. Each day is a decision to continue to DB or not -- to let your wife's behavior hurt you or not. To be "the better man" or not.

That's another realization -- when you figure out that you're doing this because you WANT to, versus being forced into it, or doing it "for the kids" or doing it "because your W doesn't know what's good for her", you have fewer reasons to be angry about your situation and it makes it easier! You're doing this for yourself, because it's what you want.

You need to realize you are not trapped here, you are making choices, and so far they have been good ones in my opinion, but the ball is in your hands.

That doesn't mean you shouldn't complain about it, complain away if that makes it easier. The situation you are in is awful, it's the hardest thing to bear. Your W took "the easy way out" and you are digging in for the long haul, with an unselfish act of love. You will get through it, and you will do it for you.

--Accuray

[luvhurts49]

You're right, I don't have to do anything, but I choose to do what's right by myself, my kids, my family, and my W (even if she doesn't know it). I love my W and kids unconditionally. My belief that my W and I can make this a better, happier M and a more rewarding family is what keeps me going. Yes, my W made her choices, but my choice is my W and kids.

If I have to, I can survive by myself--I just choose to not want to. My kids are my #1 focus, myself is #2, my W is #3, and our M is #4. I put my W before our M because even without M, her happiness is important to me and my kids.

Bottom line here, my W isn't acting like herself--she has gotten progressively worse since the bomb, but I still have hope for her, for us. I'm not angry with my W, just disappointed. Disappointed that she didn't feel like she could find what she is looking for in me--that she decided to not talk about her problems and feelings with me.

I may complain (heck, I do that anyway), but in no way does that mean that I want to give up because I don't. I can fail at everything else, but I refuse to give up or fail when it comes to my kids, my family, and my M.

[luvhurts49]

Talked to my oldest son today and he mentioned something that was kinda interesting. He is of the mindset that he wants to live with me. He told my W that he doesn't want to live with her because he is always bored there and he wants to be in his own room, in his own bed and be able to play with his friends (that live near my house). My W's response (according to my son), at your dad's, you sleep in a cheap $100 bed and the bed I bought for you here cost at least twice that much. OMG, now where putting a price tag on where my W thinks our son should be.

One other thing my W said was that she is tired of doing "this" every 5 years. I asked my son what she meant by "this" and his response was that I yell too much and that we argue too much.

Let's see here, the only time I yell is when I'm trying to be heard--for example, my W won't stop talking and I want to get a word in or everyone is making so much noise and I raise my voice to tell everyone to be quite. I don't necessarily consider that yelling, but that's my opinion.

Now, we have always bickered a little bit, but it wasn't until this last year that we started to argue so much. My W admitted to me that over the past year or so, she would start an argument on purpose just to upset me, but she wasn't really sure why she would do that.

So I don't understand how she can complain about something that she herself started. I know I can't believe anything she says, but she said it to our son, not to me.

[sandi2]

But man, I'd just love to knock on his door and see the look on his face because as far as my W and OM are concerned, they don't think that I know or that I know where OM lives or when they see each other.

First you wanted to confront your W so you could see the look on her face when you tell her you know. Now, you want to see the look on OM's face. What's the deal? What do you really think would happen? As for seeing OM's face.....PLEASE! Do you think he's scared? I mean, have you even thought past that? So, you see her face, or OM's face! It won't be what you expected! I guess, based on how many men say this, it must be a guy thing! But I could understand you wanting to punch his face in, better than lecturing him (an adulterer) in lessons of morality! That would be a good way to have him laugh in your face and tell you things you really, really don't want to hear. I can't see a man who has an A with a M woman (even if he doesn't want her) showing much respect toward the H she left. I mean, he's already shown the ultimate disrespect.

You wanted me to give you some examples of what she'd say? I don't think you really do. But ok, I think she'd start with the part of you being such a grand man in all of this. At least, you think so, right? She'd tell you where you could stick your forgiveness and that she never asked for it. What do you expect to happen when you confront her? Do you think your W will break down and start sobbing her heart out and begging you to let her go back home? She's not ready to go home. She feels free and happy. She's going to start living for herself for a change. She doesn't want anything from you. She could care less if you forgive her or love her. So you can lay off how you can love her unconditionally (b/c you don't)and being so forgiving (b/c you aren't). You want to see her punished. You want her to hurt the way she's made you & the kids hurt. There should be a law, right? And, don't even waste your time trying to convince yourself she's feeling guilty for having an A. The woman left you! She doesn't feel guilty! If she felt very bad over her A, she'd stop it. And of all the things you don't want her to know you've said, this is it: "I still keep hoping that OM gets tired of my W and let's her go". What?? You think just b/c OM got tired of her and dumped her that she'd want you back? Now that will really tick her off!

So.....it hurts to have me talk this way, doesn't it?
That's nothing compared to what your WAW can do. She could take the breath right out of you, just by coldness alone.

Please think it over carefully before doing anything this weekend. If you don't have a back-up plan, it won't do much good to confront them.

(hugs)