Finally confronted H on affair...Now what????

[keep_going]

Harrier - no worries about hijacking. We are all here to help each other and I most definitely welcome anyone's comments or input. So thanks for asking 25. I learned a lot myself as well.

I don't know if you read a bit of my latest posts, but I can tell you that in my case, our (H and I) desire to have it all and me believing I could be superwoman definitely played a huge role in the demise of our marriage. We both accumulated a lot of resentment about the sacrifices and things we lost along the way (which as 25 mentions, tend to be related to the M) and when kids came along, it all came crashing down.

Unfortunately, I am still in that tough age for my children (and will be for a while) and now I have to face it as a single mother. Now I feel so much pain and guilt for not being able to give my children what I always most desired - a family, not money or parents with successful careers. But such is life and I am trying to forgive myself and move on.

My children are my inspiration to keep going and to hopefully someday have another chance to build a new R with my H and be able to give my kids the family and life I always dreamed of for them.

Material things - they mean NOTHING to me right now, when I see that I lost the most important thing in my life - my H whom I adore. BUT, I also realize I have a responsibility to my children and I need $ to survive, obviously. But all those ambitions H and I had - the house with a nice backyard in a nice suburban neighborhood, private school, trips, nice cars, trendy clothes, nice gym, fancy dinners, all the things that come with money - are just not important. And we have lost all of that now anyways...

What matters to me is when I hug my kids at night and I can comfort them when they have nightmares or we can cuddle in my bed on a Sunday morning - that is what matters, and money or a successful career cannot buy those. Of course it would be nicer if my H could be with us to share those moments as well, but I am focusing on being grateful that I can get to enjoy them.

I will check out your thread as well. thanks again!

[keep_going]

25 -

i have read coach's and antlers' stories from beginning to end - also took a while, but I learned a lot from both of them as well. BTW, I didn't realize until recently that coach's wife was ALSO posting. I learned so much from her POV as well!

I have also read what Sandi2 and Bridgestone contributed in antler's threads... Great women as well! They brought soooo much good info for me in terms of understanding the hurt my H went thru...

I will definitely look in to brandNewDay's threads - thanks for recommending it.

[25yearsmlc]

a note about resentment...

it DOES accumulate. Even when there's a "good reason" for a spouse neglecting you, your needs are still not met.

After enough time passes, the tank gets super emtpy and if you meet OP...then yeah, things can get hairy.

But it's foolish and a tad self serving to act as if your choices about career and 3 kids were unilateral choices you made.

They were clearly joint choices and the marriage was put on the back burner for too long.

But YOU did have 3 children including a recent one and OMG....I just want to shake our society up as a whole and say,

"NO WONDER there are divorces so often! -
THINK about spacing the kids or earning less or having a smaller house," etc...

Live and learn.

Seriously, that's literally the best you can do.

Being grateful for comforting the kids at night IS huge...good thinking on your end to focus on the positive.

A lot of what's coming is going to require you to spin it about some, so you can see the silver lining or make the best of what you have. There will be curve balls that hurt but if you learn from them, it's a good thing. I have friends who say rehab was the hardest best most beautiful horrible thing they ever did...
Know what I mean?

Seeing the upside, generates more positives in your life than anything else I know. Cliched but true. And it's great for your kids.

Worse case scenario so you and your h don't end up together but you model for them a healthy r with someone else.

yes there's a certain appeal to starting fresh (which your h is clearly into right now. He's losing sight of what it'll be like on your d's wedding days and graduation and the tough nights when there's trouble b/c ONLY YOU are the other parent....

the "fresh start" lacks history and family ties. That counts and only surfaces with time.

When he says things about your personality or your anger, you are allowed NOT to keep apologizing.

You COULD say "I thought I was superwoman but I was wrong. IF I had it to do over again, I'd do a lot of things differently."

That shows change but reality and it's not escalation...

if he revises things so much you don't even know what he is talking about (I once almost called h a liar but turns out I just totally blocked it or forgot but the event happened according to my kids....so be careful about total denial)

but if it's just NOT what happened, you can say "Wow I don't recall it that way but I"m sorry you were hurt."

That also does not escalate and it validates but it doesn't force you to lie or keep apologizing for ALL conflict.

Does he honestly think his expecations of your were 100% reasonable, in hindsight?

Surely someone in his family has pointed out that leaving a woman with a 3 month old is what a CAD does...

he could stick it out while your son is this young. I know this is about the work YOU must do on you...

I certainly know that. It does not help to have our spouses flaws pointed out although God knows a lot of LBSers like it b/c they get to be "right"....

but we only get angry or stuck.

But you have "owned" almost all of this and that's not right.

I'm not okay with a man leaving a w with a newborn...let alone 2 other toddlers!
Frankly I don't think I've seen it here before. Not a newborn and 2 toddlers...

So while you may have been a whack job hormonally "OFF" woman while pregnant, he participated in the pregnancy too...


Okay now, back to YOU...you are doing SO WELL!

((( )))

[25yearsmlc]

ps re the legal matters

at the start of this HE told your realtor that he wanted to wait for you to go back to work so he could THEN file & have a better negotiating leverage?

To me that means what I thought it meant; he'd pay less. It's a strategy, not a doubt about his decision. Period. Yes it could buy you time but that also means lowered assets and your financial problems are a drag...

So, I'm hoping you have seen a L to discuss protecting yourself and the kids.

OW has a lot to lose by divorcing her h, I assume. Is she well paid in her field? Let's hope so b/c if she is, YOU can get more money if they live together as her income can count...AND if she's not, then your h can stare at her and wonder why that is...

I have seen families broken up b/c of affairs and often there's a need for them to feel they have proved that they did the right thing. They deny ANY problems.

Don't ask him how it's going for them, ever. It's just not going to be a true answer, even if he thinks it is. And if it's ever going bad AND if he'd be in the mood to tell YOU that (not likely there) But if so, he will.

No need to ask.

btw I'd be astonished if OW and your h make it long term, and have no regrets.

Of course I have no idea what her h was REALLY like, but her kids are going to be troubled by all this, especially if they are older.

Among other things, It's just a logistical drag to have done what they seem to be doing.

My uncle, or former uncle??, left my aunt decades ago for OW, whom he married.

2 things I Know happened. 1) OW called my aunt years later to see if uncle was at my aunt's house, MEANING uncle was cheating on his "new" wife, the original OW...and she had to ask the first wife if he was with her! Has to have been a tough call to make!

2) the uncle told his mother 'If I'd known how much pain I'd be causing, I never would have left."

My aunt was a great wife, btw. Yes it happens to the good ones. He's just a cheater and so was OW. THE OW/w has to live with the doubts that come with marrying an adulterer...(my aunt remarried and is quite happy in her life now. Took a few years, but she put herself out there and refused to be bitter and it paid off well. She's a loving and well loved woman).

I have to wonder how your h will react when the inevitable fight occurs and OW loses her temper & lashes out as we ALL do at some points...
maybe she's a crier or will whine...your h lacks conflict resolution skills in the heat of the moment, correct? That should be interesting.

Don't assume all is perfect with them. It's not possible. And they are hurting a lot of people with their choices.

Yes-he'll have second thoughts. He will resent missing out on his children's lives and she will resent his time with his kids...if she has her own kids with them, that's a whole other ballgame. Hassles galore. They just don't know it yet.

He may say to himself "If this fighting stuff is going to happen anyhow, I may as well have stayed where my kids live"

or if you keep up your personal work, he'll say "Wow, while my x w has become calm and centered, the "perfect OW' has become cranky...oops"

Your goal is to Look and be your moral/behavioral emotional spiritual happiest best self

when that day comes, and it will.

Yes yes of course, this is not about him-it's about you living your life well.


But I just know he'll wonder as you continue to grow into a happier woman and it shows...

(( ))

[In_Shock]

Just wanted to give you my support. We DO have some similarities. Listen to 25. She is a WONDER!!!! She makes me smile every time. Wisdom wisdom wisdom. Just wish i could pick up the phone and call her some days!!

Hang in there!! We are here for you!!!

[keep_going]

I am back to post about this rollercoaster ride...

Had a couple of bad weeks.

My daughters' BD was on Halloween. H and both sets of grandparents came over. Had a great time, cake, trick or treating. BUT, H started texting OW - he had promised not to do it. I let it slide. Before leaving he said he had gotten some passes for Disneyland from a "friend of a friend" I just replied "I am not even going to go there..." he seemed shocked and asked what was wrong. I told him - we both know who this friend is and I don't know why you feel the need to give me this info, when I don't ask. It's rude and disrespectful - specially in my house...

Next day - we take the girls to Disneyland to celebrate birthday. As soon as he arrives he says "I heard that the princess beauty parlor is great." I don't know I am just learning about these things, but it sounds great, shouldn't we do it?"

I know OW has two daughters and that they went to Disn. (thru facebook pictures). I just lost it. I asked him why he came and try to suggest that we celebrate OUR daughter's birthday the way OW is suggesting to him. I was sooo hurt. I told him how cruel and insensitive he was being and that he had started the night before with his texts and commments about discounts. I told him he had ruined both Halloween and now daughter's birthday for me. We had a huge fight - he denied any wrong-doing... I was exagerating and I was out of control and I was the one ruining the day.

Luckily MIL also went with us, so H drove with her. I cried all the drive down there and then some. It took me a good two hours to cheer up and start enjoying my time with my daugthers.

And yesterday, I found another major lie. We had agreed (or so I thought) that he would not expose our kids to OW. And I found out from my 4-year old daughter, that OW was with them the day before and even brought her a present for her birthday.

I confronted him and he did not feel any remorse. He said he never agreed to anything and he wants OW to get to know our kids and develop a R with them. He is very confident that she will be great with them cause she is a great mother and loves kids.

Every time I find out something like this, it's like finding out about his betrayal all over again. Same horrible physical and emotional pain and I lose it and cannot control myself when I am with him. He just acts so clueless, like he is not doing anything wrong. And I feel so humiliated and rejected. This OW is literally replacing me - she is taking over my life - my husband, our friends, my place as his wife, and now she wants to have a R with my children.


That conversation happened on the phone yesterday on his way to pick up OW to drive to a work convention they have this week.

He actually said he needed to go and could talk 20 minutes later. And when I called back, OW was in the car with him! He wanted to continue talking to me in front of her! I could not believe it. I was so mad, I even asked him if I could talk to her. Of course he denied (thank goodness, or I don't know what I would even have said to her). I was not even thinking when I asked him to put her on the phone. I could just hear her telling him "tell her you'll call back later"

He actually hung up on me. I then sent him a bad text message asking how they could both continue lying. I told him I had no respect for OW since she cheated on her H and lied to her kids and that he could show her my text. I said that I was being judgemental about her because I am very protective of who hangs out with my children and she is not someone I want around them. I told him I felt so bad for our kids and that I could not understand how they could be so selfish and hurt so many people.

I know... none of this was good detachment or DB work.

The constant lies, insensitivity, retracting from statements and promises made, etc. - all of those continue triggering me. I know I need to get a hold of my emotions now and be stronger for when things happen.

I was making so much progress with him and everything came crumbling down with the discovery of how serious he was with OW at the end of June. Now, we constantly argue and when we do, I call him a liar, a cheater, etc, ask about OW, how could he do this, etc. and just get in this vicious circle.

Now, not only does he not recognize any of the changes I was making, but he says I have never tried to change or ever loved him because I have always treated him badly. That is ultimately all he can remember about our R when I lose control and he is now more intent than ever in filing for D so he can start a life with OW.

Detachment - that is what I need to focus on this week while he parties with OW at the convention.

[keep_going]

H wants to be friends...

This is the part that I am struggling with. He currently is in love with OW. He says he wants to be friends - he cares about me and for the kids as well. We used to be best friends and he misses his friend. But, since he is with OW, wouldn't that be eating cake???

Regardless of that, I am struggling because this man has adopted her personality. He has completely forgotten who he is and what he is about and ever since he is with her, he completely mirrors her. He dresses as she likes, he now likes things, music and activities he never showed interest in and everything he talks about is related to either something she likes or that she has done.

That is what I cannot deal with when I am with him. It boils my blood. There are reminders of OW in EVERY interaction I have with him. Not that he does it on purpose, but he is so transparent...He is also trying to legitimize his R with her (present her as a recent girlfriend, rather than someone he has been cheating with for months) and he is slowly introducing her to our friends and having her do things I used to do with him.

But if I want to rebuild my M, shouldn't I be happy to start as a friend? Shouldn't I accept him as such and build from there? I was under the impression that that is the DB way... If so, how do I get past all these triggers? And why would he change anything - he would have OW as his girlfriend and me as a friend and co-parent of his three kids and he would also quiet his conscience and guilt.

i'd really appreciate someone's input on this - I am desperate and I feel I keep making things worse for myself...

thanks!

[keep_going]

I just came back from H's place. (He still lives in our previous home and I live with kids in the house we bought just a month before he left...)

I went there to get the kids' health ins. cards for a dr's appointment and birth certificates for passports.

In the file box I found several love letters from OW... I am in so much pain. I know I should have not read them, but I did. Their bond is so strong... they are so integrated emotionally and physically. In the most recent one from a few days ago she tells my H that she will jump thru fire to be with him.

She is so positive, affectionate and upbeat in her letters. And so appreciative of everything he does for her and how happy he makes her.

They are "pappa tiger" and "mama tiger." H and I used to be "papa bear" and "mama bear"
There were cards she sent him when our baby boy was born in July.

There were also toys and clothes she gave him for our kids. Embroidered bibs with our 3-month old son's name and a baby tiger and his date of birth.

And when he brought the kids home on Sunday, I found a pink t-shirt she gave my 4-year old among the kids' clothes to wash... How could he be so insensitive and not make sure he didn't send stuff she gave them?


It's so painful. She is replacing me in EVERY way possible. How can I ever make any inroads - they are so connected and seem so happy. I cannot help but compare it to the R we had in the last few years. I don't blame him - ours was empty, routine, sad, we both had stopped giving.

And now I need to wipe the tears, go to the grocery store, pick up girls from pre-school and go to a playdate this afternoon.
Where do I find the strength to smile and continue raising 3 kids under the age of 4 while he is having a great time with her and being a part-time dad?

I feel so rejected - like an object that is now thrown to the trash because it's no longer pretty and fun and useful.

I don't want to give up. I want to win my H back. But how can I ever COMPETE with this situation?

[keep_going]

Help!

I got two text messages from H today (he is at a work convention with OW). These came after our phone blow-up from Sunday...

text 1:
"I'm struggling with how to proceed. I'm not trying to hurt you. That's not my goal. I am trying to separate myself in as painless a way as possible. I don't know what that is, and I'm sorry I haven't always made the right choices in the process."

I responded:
"I am sorry, you are so vague that I honestly do not understand what you are trying to tell me." Are you trying to apologize, justify your actions or what? And what "choices" are you talking about."

Text #2:
"I wanted to talk about how we move forward. It's a painful situation and my attempts to neither hurt you nor be hurt by you seem pointless now. I've failed to do either. I want the least amount of pain possible. You don't want to be divorced and I do. I want to talk about that."


So he's basically asking for the D BY TEXT while he is with OW...

My question now is HOW SHOULD I RESPOND? SHOULD I BE COOPERATIVE THRUOUT???

What is the best approach, since it looks inevitable now. Please help me. I am devastated. I have been dreading this moment for almost a year. All my efforts (and mostly failures to DB) have been in vain and I really blew my chances. I had 10 months to convince him and I didn't...

What do I do???

[25yearsmlc]

Help!

I got two text messages from H today (he is at a work convention with OW). These came after our phone blow-up from Sunday...

text 1:
"I'm struggling with how to proceed. I'm not trying to hurt you. That's not my goal. I am trying to separate myself in as painless a way as possible. I don't know what that is, and I'm sorry I haven't always made the right choices in the process."

I responded:
"I am sorry, you are so vague that I honestly do not understand what you are trying to tell me." Are you trying to apologize, justify your actions or what? And what "choices" are you talking about."

Text #2:
"I wanted to talk about how we move forward. It's a painful situation and my attempts to neither hurt you nor be hurt by you seem pointless now. I've failed to do either. I want the least amount of pain possible. You don't want to be divorced and I do. I want to talk about that."


So he's basically asking for the D BY TEXT while he is with OW...

how about

"I cannot discuss this by text message. It deserves an in person one on one talk. We can discuss it later when you have time."

This buys you time. Let him FEEL free to discover the real color of the grass on the other side of the fence...

the intensity of their R is imo, telling. She and he love being in love...and it's way easier when you are not dealing with 3 kids under 5 all together but can steal time away, just as a couple.

He needs reality therapy and only time with OW and away from your "power" are going to give him that...AND you CONTRASTING YOUR BEHAVIORS with his images...

lose that anger...at least in front of him. AND do not tell him you read the letters and for God's sake STOP SNOOPING...

applaud loudly for the 1% of positives he does

(SHE is, you may as well too)
and read the DR book again and again...I honestly believe you both bought into the Superwoman image too much.

All i can say to her is, "good luck" with that...



My question now is HOW SHOULD I RESPOND? SHOULD I BE COOPERATIVE THRUOUT???

What is the best approach, since it looks inevitable now. Please help me. I am devastated. I have been dreading this moment for almost a year. All my efforts (and mostly failures to DB) have been in vain and I really blew my chances. I had 10 months to convince him and I didn't...

What do I do???

You begin again, "from this day forward." And you do better.

it's not over. Seriously...he needs TIME and YOU need to DETACH...