Another crisis.....but H opening up now

[Lotus]

How exciting! In less than 24 hours you will be at Retrouvaille and your eyes will be opened.

Everyone worries. Everyone walks in scared. Just do it! It is the best thing you will ever do for yourself.

I don't know what your directions say. Our group said bring a snack. Bring something you like. You can't count on what others will bring. Goodness! We had a dinner of pretzels and fruit and cheese. Dinner that first night was not the most memorable part. So bring yourself a sandwich or something wholesome, and then the snack "to share".

They will take care of everything. Retrouvaille was a warm, safe place. I would go back in a minute. In fact, I think we will. It's been 3 years and we've forgotten some of the things we learned. A refresher weekend would be wonderful.

[angel61]

Its a beautiful day.....

Thank you my friends. I prayed before going to sleep that we will be able to face this day and the next two with serenity.

God spoke to my heart, telling me that its not the destination, but the journey. This is part of the journey, I feel like we are going to pass through a place we have never gone before...and don't know what it will be like..... but nonetheless, it will be beautiful....and when we leave the memory of it will be imprinted in our hearts and minds.

After all, we are after the same rainbow's end.....

[InAPickle]

I will keep you in my prayers this weekend Angel61.

I'm so proud of you !

Pic.

[angel61]

Back from Retrouvaille!!!

Thank you everyone for your prayers. God gave my marriage a miracle over the weekend. It turned out better than I imagined it to be. I hope it will be the start of a new life....

I am so emotionally exhausted that I don't think I can write that much. And also, the Retrouvaille method should not be divulged, but suffice it to say that over the weekend, there were any changes, not only in my H's heart, but in mine as well.

He now wants to work on our M. He came in not sure of why he was there, only knowing that it must mean something that he was going. But he did bring with him an open heart and mind.

It started easy, and we were telling ourselves that we were in this to just make our life more smooth sailing, nothing deep. He felt we were learning a new trick, even said there ws no need to go back for the post sessions as we were likely to learn what we needed in the first day. Then it became harder. We were forced to face our feelings, our issues.

There was a point he almost quit. I almost also ruined it by being indignant that he was not doing his best. Then we recovered. We said it was not a time to solve problems, only to learn. We pushed on.

At the end of Saturday we were feeling hopeful.

On Sunday, we were put into deeper waters.

I was afraid that H woud cave in under the pressure, would withdraw into himslef. But he did not. Hard as it was, he faced it and came through.

And so did I! I felt like my chest was going to explode with the emotions I felt. We cried together. We smiled and talked and laughed like we have not in a long time.

We both realized he has a long, long way to go. He said to me his inner issues are not solved yet, but tired as he is, he will persevere and will continue to work on them. He let me know that he valued my being there for him, and that the most important thing about me to him was my loving him in spite of it all. He told me that he saw all of my changes, and that he wanted me to help him understand how love could be a decision, and not a feeling.

We both agreed that God should be in the center of our relationship.

In the end, he even said that we should go to the post sessions, we will find a way inspite of his anxiety that we may rock the boat.

We went home both exhausted and quiet. I brought him to the airport, he will be away for a week. I was relieved that we have time to reflect away from each other. Time to pray as well and be thankful. Time to think back and see with the heart what we had divulged to each other. Time to offer it to God and listen on what the next step will be.

Those of you who have been debating whether to go or not, I urge you to do so.

There is nothing to lose, except for the expenses, which are voluntary, and everything to gain.

Again, thank you for your prayers, and for helping me settle my minds and my doubts before going! I love you all!

[Lotus]

So good to hear your news! Your experience sounds a lot like mine. The Post sessions are worth it. We had to drive over an hour each way to get there, but we never missed one.

This is a difficult time that you are in now. After our Retrouvaille weekend, I was so happy with all that was said at the weekend, but I found it hard to hold on to when I was home alone during the day. Doubts crept in, and I had to work hard to shake them off and cling to the progress we had made. The Post sessions helped us to continue to make progress. And I read and re-read our notebooks to reassure myself that his thinking, and feelings had really changed.

It's a long way to climb back out of the holes that we had sunk into. Progress is slow, but I felt like Hansel and Gretel, holding hands and making our way through the forest by following the trail of breadcrumbs that the couples from Retrouvaille had strewn on the path to guide us.

Good luck! Our prayers are still with you.

[angel61]

We will try to do the post session, but in that, I will let H lead. I am afraid to let him get emotionally overloaded and overwhelmed, such that he will again retreat into his shell (or the tunnel). Already, the weekend was too much even for me, and I still feel shaky even now. I am actually glad he is out of town for a week, so we can regroup, and I too can process what I have learned. I feel that the greatest thing I learned this weekend is to allow my heart to see and hear my H.

My H, who grew up in a very Catholic environment, and who always has had his prayers answered, his needs met, has finally met a situation that he cannot resolve. Either he makes himself happy and goes against his core values, or he stays within the straight and narrow path but condemn himself to a life of misery. Both options had an equally strong pull on him. He prayed to God to resolve it for him, but to naught. This led him to feeling that God has abandoned him, and for a while, he was angry with the Lord.

This all led to all sorts of justifications, as at first he was more inclined to leaving us, and pursing OW, but truly, a person values and beliefs are actually what would take over in times like this!

While writing this I had a sudden thought, I would say a message from God, so let me write it while I could, detour a bit from writing about my H and go back to myself.

I realize now that I have to be thankful. As a spouse, I am far from perfect. As they say in Retrouvaille, an A is not the cause of the destruction of an M but a symptom. And I may very well have been the reason for all this - my controlling ways, my dominance, my contentiousness. Etc.

When I first met my H, a voice in my head told me that this person was going to be important to me. I have always wondered why. Suddenly today I realized why. Because if it were some other person, who did not have the values my H has, that person might have walked away by now. Because my H is the one who will make me close to God and develop a personal relationship with Him again.

Ooops, got to go now. Have to get to my doctors appointment! Until later.

[angel61]

Lotus,

Yesterday I did feel the doubts creep in. I reread the notebooks and felt reassured.

I do remind myself that since my H has MLC, it will really be a long and rocky road still. Although I am hoping that what happened has served to give my H reason to work on our M and not just stay, I feel that I need to be very careful not to push and become precisely what I have avoided so far in this sitch, which is to seem like the "mommy" again.

Hey 25, I haven't heard from you yet.

Oh by the way, another thing:

I did find out that in the end, my H wrote:

" I realize that God has not abandoned me. I have found hope".

And so have I..... So have I!

[25yearsmlc]

I'm SO pleased you got a lot out of it.

I urge you to reflect more on the post sessions and your reluctance to keep going.

Seems to me that when you pushed further, you gained more--so why not keep at it?

But when I say "you pushed more"

I do NOT mean YOU pushing HIM...i mean the two of you going deeper and getting past the surface assessments.

I did not think we really "needed" the extra time at the post session workshops...but I was wrong.

And in the spirit of not divulging more, that's all I can say. And

"Trust the process". There is a reason for the post sessions...they're no fools.

If you cannot get your h to go OR rather, if he feels he does not want to,

you CAN go on your own.

Also, I don't get the choice you say he has about being happy OR going against his Catholic values.


God does not want us to be miserable. But frankly, it may seem like slogging through a hard M is "work without reward" --

that's just us talking ourselves out of a hardworking but GOOD solid marriage.

We can and should do the work it takes. I hope your h will agree. There is nothing "non-Catholic" about staying married AND being happy.

Take care and once again I urge you to "Trust the process."

So glad you went and here are some

Big hugs (((( )))

[angel61]

25,

I myself am not reluctant about the posts, but I think you cannot go by yourself. I will check with the coordinators.

In my dealing with H though, I have learned that one of his biggest things (just as in many here) is the way he perceives me to control the situation. I have learned not to push, so I just let him know what I want and feel, and he can decide if he wants to come in for the ride. I did not push him for Retrouvaille; after I mentioned it once and he said he would go, I registered us, then afterwards never mentioned it again. he was the one whol asked me to arrange for childcare, and who thughtof the logistics on how we will get there (especially since he had to fly out right after the weekend).

Yes, I will continue practicing the tool that Retrouvaille provides, even without him. H does want to attend the post sessions but he already indicated that he will not be able to attend the first two (due to travel) plus inside, I know he has to process, as prior to Retro he had always said he had no inclination to work on the M, and felt as though it was hopeless, thus his feeling stuck. During the weekend was the first time that he has seen the light in a loong time. I do think we will start going to the next ones, then come round to finish the first one, and maybe even repeat some of the posts next year. I pray that he will keep an open mind and heart as we go along.

Ok, next thing: Let me explain to you what I meant by the options my H WAS facing, and why he feels so stuck:

In the beginning of our sitch, he fell for OW, hard. Thus started the EA, which I suspect was actually less involved than I originally thought. My H wanted to be free to pursue OW, thus all the justifying and blaming and the bad behaviour. Since me and my H did not exactly start with romance(friends and a mentor (me)- mentee (him) relationship with a strong sexual attraction we gave in to), I think in his "idealistic" mind he wanted to start right with OW by first of all, getting free of me, then pursuing his "happiness" with OW. My H, who never was romantic and affectionate, finally felt that type of love for OW, as evidenced by the texts and emails he had sent her. This was his selfish phase. During that time he rationalized that it was all my fault, that our D would be OK even if we parted, that D would understand that he made a mistake, that we were never truly in love before, etc. etc.

Then somehow, the values he grew up with, his Catholic faith, came in and made him stop and think about what is really right, how he needs to stand by his family, he saw what would happen to his daughter. This is what I meant by the other option: he realized that in the end, he would be miserable whatever road he took. If he pursued OW, he would be miserable because of the guilt, and the shame, and of course the fact that he was turning away from his values and beliefs. Many of the MLCer's and WAS in this boards actually had to experience this misery and that is why they came back in the end; my H knew before he even left.

With his decision to stay, on the other hand, he felt that he was condemning himself to a life of misery living with a woman (me) he no longer loved, with whom he had a miserable relatiship with. That is why he was feeling stuck.... But as we went along, he started seeing my changes and realized that maybe, he would not be as miserable as he once thought. I was keeping the road home paved and smooth, he knew I still loved him, he started feeling safe and forgiven. Nothing new to all of you here in the boards, right? But still, he did not feel anything for me. And this may be OUR difference here as a couple, because in many of your marriages, love and romance was something you could look back to. In ours, as my H sees it, it was never there (I don't buy it totally, but lets see what happens).

What our weekend experience did to him is to bring that hope to greater heights, make him realize that our life together has hope for love - this time, not the chemical love that he felt with OW, but a real, deep, Biblical, love.

He kept emphazising to me during the whole weekend not to expect a turnaround, or a solution right away.

I understand.... and I am willing to take the long way with him. I need it too.... there are many things to learn.

25, do I make more sense now?

I think I summarized in a way our situation, now looking at it from hindsight.

I don't know if some of you out there can relate, and can glean some pearls from my sitch.

All I can say at this point is that I feel we are on the way to a new beginning, and please continue praying for us, my friends.

[exquisitetobe]

Hi Angel!

I agree with you except on the love part.
In my situation, XH used the ILYBINILWY and many other " lies" to break free but his actions were totally opposite. This man loved me deeply. His words were cruel but his actions were confusing me.
Now, He tells me often that he loves me, always has, always will.
He doesn't tell me that he wants to come home anymore but his actions, again, are showing him coming forward SLOWLLLYYY!
Throughout our time appart, he wanted to come home MANY TIME.
I'm the one that said: " No, you are NOT ready! If you come home now, within 2 weeks, i'm the one that would leave you. You still have alot to work on. I'm always here for you. I am NOT looking for anyone else. My heart is still yours and i still see myself as your wife. As long as i feel this way, no other relationship would work."

After his rock buttom, he came to me and asked: " I want you!
Do you think that you can forgive me for all the pain i caused you? (yes) Do you think that if we treat eachother right, respect eachother and not expect anything from the other, that we could fix this? (yes)
He is so ashamed of his actions, while on his own, that everytime i hear of A thing he did, he runs. Not because he doesn't want to be with me but because he can't bear to see my pain. He steps back and gives me time to accept it and come forward. This back and forth as been going on since last X-MAS.
I feel he wants to come clean but he also knows that if everything came out all at once, it would be to much for me to deal with and HE, for sure, WOULD LOSE ME!
The way i see it, he is facing his demonds. He has so much to process!
He caused me and our family alot of grief and still, I AM SO PROUD OF HIM FOR THE WORK HE IS DOING. NOT EASY for anyone but way harder on MLCer.
We say MLCer lives in the past. I SAY GOOD. Their issues are in their past. If they're there, they will find what they have to fix. They will eventually come to therms with their pain.

I'm proud of XH! I hope, in the end, that he'll chose me to share the rest of his life with. If he doesn't, i will respect his decision. As of right now, i don't want to start over with anybody else. I'm good as a single mother.