Compassion for a MLCer

[Jack_Three_Beans]

Tatoos are not as permanent as you'd think.

[broken5150]

Hi Jack,

Yeah, I agree that tattoos are not that permanent, but I would not of tuought she would go this far. I know, I know, in MLC, expect the unexpected.

When you read about MLC and all the crazy things they do, it doesn't really sink in until it happens to you.

[25yearsmlc]

Hi Jack,

Yeah, I agree that tattoos are not that permanent, but I would not of tuought she would go this far. I know, I know, in MLC, expect the unexpected.

When you read about MLC and all the crazy things they do, it doesn't really sink in until it happens to you.

Broken,

this is a long one but it's b/c you are sort of rehashing and repeating patterns here so I want to drive this home okay?

Get a little helmet on. Mostly I hear about how "crazy or evil" your w is. But what I want to hear is about YOUR CHANGES...here's what I mean.

I know you are in pain. A lot of it. But you sure do inflict a lot of it onto yourself.

Please stop it. Just stop all the crazy obsessing and the incessant asking of unanswerable questions about IF she's in MLC and if so, what it means and if not, then what? Hey, none of that matters. seriously...

all that matters is what YOU do with your time on this planet. Stay out of her sandbox and take care of your own.

My h had what apparently was an MLC....and you know what?

My biggest regret-BY FAR-was asking IF my h was having an MLC and if so, when it would end and what that might mean, and what HE was going to do/think/plan/feel....all about HIM/HIS choices/HIS Behaviors....all my analysis was wasted. All of it.

ALL of that energy ought to have been spent on MY LIFE and GAL....and creating a future for me and the kids. THE SOONER, THE BETTER...

That's where your energy needs to go, asap.

Please read up on DETACHMENT asap. IT's key to your getting through this with a shred of dignity OR hope of a recon in the future. Understand that detachment is a step towards reconciliation in this situation....

Also, not signing divorce papers does NOT prevent her from getting a divorce. The idea that a spouse has to "Consent" to a divorce is simply out of date (as a L I can say that with certainty).

You can argue about property division but you cannot force someone to be married to you in this country.

You can delay things going forward temporarily, with some motions filed, but you cannot force someone to stay m to you.

Other than saying "I'm not stopping you", what else is there to say? You are not arguing the divorce itself, but the property settlement. And you must see a L asap for that. Often you can get a free consult...but don't skimp on this. it's penny wise and pound foolish and will cost you more than a fortune of money in the long run, like in more pain and anguish.

She is using the non signature as an excuse for...what? B/c you won't agree to her idea of property division? Tell her to send you a completed one and you'll take it to your L...and then do that. You don't have to sign it. But for God's sake you need to have a L look at it fast.

If she really wants a divorce she can file and

if you fail to respond or don't hire a L, then she'll probably get what she wants...so you cannot afford not to hire one, really.

Living in your dad's retirement home and her living in her mom's, makes both of you unable to afford a home of your own? Why are you the loser and not her? Why aren't you both on your own?

I don't get this. You need a plan. Like a home she/kids can come home to...literally. B/C right now you are not bringing a lot to the table.
Sorry broken but you need to see this.

So detach first, so you don't have anymore of these harmful exchanges and texts that do NOTHING GOOD for either of you. YOU MUST DETACH MORE...OMG...the fighting is horrible, esp for a couple not even living together anymore.

DO you see how it only validates her choice to kick you out? The more you challenge her choices, the more you force her to defend them and the more you fuel her anger.

Stop that. It's not easy but it's not complicated. Quite simple really. You need to control your behavior more.

Plus
There's no "one right sentence" or "great zinger line" you can say that will wake her up. Let that idea go. You are wasting time/energy on a fruitless endeavor AND worsening things.

DBIng is about doing what helps and NOT doing what hurts....DB 101...


You need to read my previous post to you about her marital revisions--all WASs do it and ALL MLCers do it. Read what you can say in reply if you want to keep it simple. Don't take it so personally and it'll be easier to acheive that when you stop the R talks.

I really hope you do that. Otherwise you'll keep on getting punched in the face and standing up again for another round of punching.

As for whether she's a WAW or a MLC...Why do you think it matters?

You spend so much time on that label hoping it means what? That she's more likely to return to you but see, I don't know what evidence exists for that supposition.

She can be batchit crazy but not mentally ill. She can be a MLCer and a WAW.

This is just more of you trying to understand the why of it, and I'm telling you that what matters is what you will DO. The only "why" that matters is what your role in things were so you can learn from them.

Newsflash for me--
Most of my h's behavior in MLC was and is NOT comprehensible to me, even now. And he forgets parts of it. Or sees them very differently.

YES I eventually accepted that I would NOT understand his choices or behavior.

Therefore, questioning his choices constantly, and obsessing about what he was doing or thinking, could finally stop. And I could GAL and move forward...and finally, I did...

and maybe...maybe that is why h woke up.

I only know that once I came to terms with the belief that I'd genuinely be happy no matter what h did, h seemed to become curious about me more.

And my inner peace -which took so much work, must have eventually emanated from me.

All I really know is that after I came to peace with whatever came, and was happy with it,

He wanted back into my life---perhaps b/c my life looked appealing b/c it was! I really had GAL.

Broken, YOUR COURSE OF ACTION for your w's MLC/WAS/or mental condition

is the same

regardless of her "underlying cause" and that's good simple news.

You must detach so you can heal and not have anymore of your harmful contacts, so you can be fully available to your children

(trust me, I can tell you are NOT available to them by the tone of your comments here.

Just as I once did, you are going in circles & loops about your spouse's behavior and why it's happening and If it will end and if so, when, and blah blah blah--

Focus on the one thing you do control, YOUR OWN WORK....what are your 180s? What are YOUR GAL?

Have you read the DB books for real? I mean did you only read the MLC chapter? You need to read the part about your role in this, and your work on YOU.

It's all you control. You become a better man, the best man you can become, and you leave the results up to God.


[[SIDENOTE, you spend a lot of time here criticising her. I get the point of venting, I do. But ask yourself some time, "is this helping my sitch at all, or am I simply more comfortable being angry at her than angry at myself? Do I prefer anger to feeling sad in my rejection?)]]


but instead of asking what HE sees in HER, and commenting about her age and living with her mom, which was fine with you, and you have children...but you ask about what he sees in her and
I'd ask what SHE sees in HIM.

Other than his youth, (which is all about appearances-and if I'm not mistaken you said you two look alike??)

then otherwise, what can he possibly bring to the table? Is he well educated? A high income earner? A talented fun guy with a bright future? He sounds like none of those but maybe he's all of them. Or maybe he's Just a young guy who lends her his ear? Plays with the kids?

btw When you played on the Xbox, how often did the kids play with you when you were living together?

Imo, grown men who shut out their families for video games are, not grown men. Don't get me wrong. I Play them too. With our kids and or with my h. Rarely alone. Never at the expense of time with my family. NEVER.

Maybe your w thought you'd spend all your time on it? Why did she feel that way?

Broken, You spend a lot of energy on OM too and that's an easy fix b/c once you stop doing that, you'll have less pain....but the real question is about you.

Other than being the father of her kids, you'll have to ask yourself What do YOU bring to the table?

I know you want to assess HER flaws and her issues and the damage she's done (those questions are for later IF you are offered the option)

We're here to help you work on YOU.

So maybe he admires her. And maybe that's what she needs. You Can't do anything about what HE brings or gives her except learn from it.

Just sounds like you want to rag on her and vent. And if that helps you, then do it. But if it keeps you stuck, as I suspect, or if it's symptomatic of how you were with her before, then learn from it & work on YOU.

BTW-You mention her weight and seem to resent her losing it, and you say she's "too thin" now, etc. You also mentioned that her weight loss hurt you or didn't benefit you (even though it's good for her health).

I get mixed messages from that but it sounds important.

When she achieved such great weight loss, you told her not to let it get to her head or it would "destroy the family"....

Broken, that's one wacky odd (undermining) comment to make. Like if she were to become attractive to other men, then she'd destroy the family?

Why? B/c she might not need you? Or other men might be kind to her so she might not need you?

See how that sounds? IOW, sounds as if you would have to treat her better...or someone else would.

That's how I am hearing it and this is based on reading YOUR comments...

so, food for thought.

The comments insult her just as she begins to overcome what was probably a long term painful issue that ate away at her self esteem, b/c being that obese (you said 350lbs?) often reflects a low self esteem and or serious health issues.

But your concern, while 'supporting her', was that she would leave you?

What about the health advantages of her losing the weight? And the pride she finally got to take in her appearance? Did you tell her you were proud of her achievements?

Were your fears that she'd leave you b/c you treated her badly and now that other men might give her attention, which you didn't, then she'd want to leave you?

I think when you dig deep and bravely about what YOU can change in you

check that response of yours out.

Needing attention from OMs and responding so much to it --
Sure it might be narcissism but you also said she was a great mom. Narcissists usually aren't. Maybe she craved what was missing.

Here's the question YOU must ask yourself.

B/c it is the one way your w will come back to the marriage....


How would marriage to you today,& from this day forward, be better or different than before?


If your w cannot see any difference in YOU, then she won't likely want to resume the marriage.

Keep this^^^ in mind when you rant and obsess and spend your time/energy about her MLC or her mental condition or her texts or her lashing out and blah blah blah

instead of working on YOU.

and ask YOURSELF if you have changed...b/c if you cannot show it in some way OR if you don't really feel it and she can't see it...then why would she want to reconcile?

See, the real work begins with you and for a long time, the work is only with you. Right or wrong, Broken, that's how it is.

[cat04]

If your w cannot see any difference in YOU, then she won't likely want to resume the marriage.

Keep this^^^ in mind when you rant and obsess and spend your time/energy about her MLC or her mental condition or her texts or her lashing out and blah blah blah

instead of working on YOU.

and ask YOURSELF if you have changed...b/c if you cannot show it in some way OR if you don't really feel it and she can't see it...then why would she want to reconcile?

See, the real work begins with you and for a long time, the work is only with you. Right or wrong, Broken, that's how it is.

Broken,

While I can't say that I disagree with a lot of 25's post, I think this is really the most important part of what she said.

Something that we (vets) sometimes forget, or try to minimize, is where we started.

How painful it is, how hard it is to stop the circle of thinking that keeps us stuck. What it feels like when the slaps in the face keep coming.

We all have done what you are doing. Trying to figure out if MLC or not, being absolutly shocked by things that they say or do, trying to learn how to detatch, thinking that we are and then going backwards, then forwards, then backwards again.

We each forget that there is something that happens within us (and it is different for each of us), that stops that cycle. That "wakes us up" so to speak to where we shift our focus from them to us, where we stop making those steps backwards as frequently...

Time and patience, as well as dealing with our negative emotions, understanding our reactions to things and our motivations behind our thoughts, feelings, words, and actions, are all imperative to finding your way through this mess...

So, lets start with...

What are you doing for you today?

Regardless of her...regardless of anything she might say, think, feel, text, did in the past, or anything...

What are you going to do for Sammy?

[broken5150]

Now about the legal matters…

25, you have NO idea how I was recently blessed…

I was referred to a real great Christian lawyer by my pastor. However, this L wanted a $5,000 retainer. Where in the heck was I going to get $5000 from?!?

Anyway, just yesterday, my keyboard player in the worship team is very close friend of mine. Kind of like a dad to me. His W also went through an MLC and left him. Actually, he was the one that told me about MLC.

My friend is VP of an infamous chain of restaurants here in S. Florida.

L is a good friend of his :o)

Yesterday, my friend called me up and told me he had lunch with L and told him about my sitch. My friend told me “Broken, I went through the same thing you have and I don’t want you to get screwed over. God has put it in my heart to help you. Ive been blessed with a great job. Please accept that I paid your retainer!”

After a long pause, and sucking up tears. I asked him how could I repay him? He said, “you don’t have to. You were there when it happened to me and you are a good man. Consider it that its God looking after you”.

How about that!

Well, now that I have a L. I can now feel a little safer that Im not going to get TOTALLY screwed.

Now I can plan on getting an apt and show W that I can make it on my own steam. After all, I really needed a place for me and the kids when W is out doing her thing.

Once I get my apt. I would love to finally go back to school! Also, with my apt, all of my kids friends can come over and hang with them again. Their parents have stopped bringing the kids over to the house because of whats going on. Also, W has developed kind of a avoidant personality towards the parents. The last parent she met with, W told her that I left the house for another woman and that I physically abused W.

During this past year 25, Ive learned a great deal of patience. Although I have my moments of anger, I also spend the majority of my time in peace. I have a great support group.

I do love my W. But, when emotions are out of the way, I do realize that we were not in a healthy marriage. There were too many bad ingredients.

I would of loved for the both of us to go to counseling and work out our problems and live in a home of our own but she refuses to. She only sees me as the source of all our problems.

All the changes Ive been doing are for me. In her current state of mind, I don’t think she will ever see them. And to be honest, Im starting to careless whether she does or not.

Since I left her home, Ive been sleeping better. While I was at her home, I was waking up every hour on the hour. I would wake up to hear her buzzard (MIL) screaming at my daughter or whining and complaining how everything falls on her blah blah blah. The constant blaring of the TV’s with annoying Spanish soap operas was downright obnoxious!

25, I feel like I never really had a chance to be the man I should be in that home. She always ran to her Mother for everything good or bad because MIL was there from the beginning and she’s still there. Within the last couple of years, Ive gone through some tough situations like when I had to situate my father in a home. I went through a year of hell trying to get his VA benefits to kick in and being in and out of emergency rooms with him. To think she would notice this and see how I’m making strides in responsibilities and take to heart that I would go above and beyond for her as well??? Gues what I got in return??? I remember one night being very depressed not knowing if dad was going to get his benefits. W asks me “What’s wrong with you” I told her I was very worried about dad and his benefits. Her reply was “ If you are so worried and depressed, go jump off a bridge!”

I’m taking a chance in writing this comment because I really don’t want to sound self righteous but, I’ve turned to God to help me through this. Per MLC script, she is manipulating her environment to find her happiness instead of looking inward. She thinks that by tattooing a rosary on her ankle makes her good with God. She is just worshiping a god of her own creation.

Our marriage wasn’t perfect. It was kind of rough but, I would of NEVER abandoned her.

Im planning on going back to playing in cover bands and continuing my movie prop collections. These are things she had complained about and I put on the back burner. Actually, I just about put my whole life on the back burner for her.

What you wrote made allot of sense, 25. And the more independent I become, the less I see myself standing for our M. Im going through with the D and Im looking forward to being happy. This was her choice. Not mine. If it works out for her, great. If not, oh well.

She has spent almost our whole R comparing me to other men. Asking me “Why can you be like so and so. So and so’s W doesn’t have to work. So and so makes all this $ and you don’t”. “You will be nothing without me”. “Your kids can careless if you would ever walk in that door again”.

And now she pulls this???

Uh uh.

I the line is drawn here. No further

Im gonna live life for God, my kids and myself.

[broken5150]

ooops sorry about that. didnt copy my whole reply.

Here it is....


25 & CAT,

Thank you both for your replies and input.

First and foremost, I agree with everything 25 has written. Sometimes, actually, most of the time, I do catch myself repeating things over and over again. This is something I’m really trying to work on. And I know how it probably looks like from a readers stand point “Man this guy just keeps whining and whining the whole thing over and over again”.

If any of you have read the book of Job in the bible, I pretty much sound like him.

To be honest, I think the reason I do it, is to read other readers opinions so I won’t feel like I’m the only one that this has happened to (The whole strength in numbers thing).

I know through my ranting, I never really touch base on what Im doing for my GAL’ing…

First, Ive grown with God allot. Im spending allot of time in church (worship team, mens group, small group etc.) and also, learning in depth about what he wants from me and the type of life I should be living.

Ive been going to counciling once a week. Not only to I speak to C about what W is doing, also, Im taking advice on how NOT to repeat my previous mistakes and how to help my babies get through this season and be the best dad I can be.

I signed up my S13 in the gym so I can show him the ropes and have my little work out partner. Also, every time we go, I bring the other babies and let them hang out in the toddler room. Every day the kids look forward to have me come and pick them up. S13 is at that age that he just wants to sit in his room and play his xbox or watch wrestling.

One thing W has been commenting on, is how Ive stepped up to the plate and become a great dad. But when she doesn’t get what she wants, Im a “Deadbeat dad”. Another thing she has been ragging on me is, how I have not gotten my own apt. Well, Ive been very foolish and Ive been giving her allot of $. That, and also what I spend on the kids and on myself has left me living pay check to pay check. Her nasty comments about me not being man enough to get two jobs or calling me a loser jarred me in a sense that I HAD to start finding legal help.

Yeah, its very easy for her to call me these things when she is living rent free and mommy is doing everything for her.

This is one of my biggest source of anger 25, how we built a home and family together and she just found me as something disposable and threw me out with nothing! Then, she wants to suck every penny out of me and doesn’t care how or where Im living. Ive been VERY patient with her and I still honored her as my wife and have shown lots of support despite of all the nastiness Ive been receiving from her. Ive been hearing allot of comments from friends and family saying that they don’t know how I haven’t lost my mind. And needless to say, how shes rubbing OM in my face.

Now about the legal matters…

25, you have NO idea how I was recently blessed…

I was referred to a real great Christian lawyer by my pastor. However, this L wanted a $5,000 retainer. Where in the heck was I going to get $5000 from?!?

Anyway, just yesterday, my keyboard player in the worship team is very close friend of mine. Kind of like a dad to me. His W also went through an MLC and left him. Actually, he was the one that told me about MLC.

My friend is VP of an infamous chain of restaurants here in S. Florida.

L is a good friend of his :o)

Yesterday, my friend called me up and told me he had lunch with L and told him about my sitch. My friend told me “Broken, I went through the same thing you have and I don’t want you to get screwed over. God has put it in my heart to help you. Ive been blessed with a great job. Please accept that I paid your retainer!”

After a long pause, and sucking up tears. I asked him how could I repay him? He said, “you don’t have to. You were there when it happened to me and you are a good man. Consider it that its God looking after you”.

How about that!

Well, now that I have a L. I can now feel a little safer that Im not going to get TOTALLY screwed.

Now I can plan on getting an apt and show W that I can make it on my own steam. After all, I really needed a place for me and the kids when W is out doing her thing.

Once I get my apt. I would love to finally go back to school! Also, with my apt, all of my kids friends can come over and hang with them again. Their parents have stopped bringing the kids over to the house because of whats going on. Also, W has developed kind of a avoidant personality towards the parents. The last parent she met with, W told her that I left the house for another woman and that I physically abused W.

During this past year 25, Ive learned a great deal of patience. Although I have my moments of anger, I also spend the majority of my time in peace. I have a great support group.

I do love my W. But, when emotions are out of the way, I do realize that we were not in a healthy marriage. There were too many bad ingredients.

I would of loved for the both of us to go to counseling and work out our problems and live in a home of our own but she refuses to. She only sees me as the source of all our problems.

All the changes Ive been doing are for me. In her current state of mind, I don’t think she will ever see them. And to be honest, Im starting to careless whether she does or not.

Since I left her home, Ive been sleeping better. While I was at her home, I was waking up every hour on the hour. I would wake up to hear her buzzard (MIL) screaming at my daughter or whining and complaining how everything falls on her blah blah blah. The constant blaring of the TV’s with annoying Spanish soap operas was downright obnoxious!

25, I feel like I never really had a chance to be the man I should be in that home. She always ran to her Mother for everything good or bad because MIL was there from the beginning and she’s still there. Within the last couple of years, Ive gone through some tough situations like when I had to situate my father in a home. I went through a year of hell trying to get his VA benefits to kick in and being in and out of emergency rooms with him. To think she would notice this and see how I’m making strides in responsibilities and take to heart that I would go above and beyond for her as well??? Gues what I got in return??? I remember one night being very depressed not knowing if dad was going to get his benefits. W asks me “What’s wrong with you” I told her I was very worried about dad and his benefits. Her reply was “ If you are so worried and depressed, go jump off a bridge!”

I’m taking a chance in writing this comment because I really don’t want to sound self righteous but, I’ve turned to God to help me through this. Per MLC script, she is manipulating her environment to find her happiness instead of looking inward. She thinks that by tattooing a rosary on her ankle makes her good with God. She is just worshiping a god of her own creation.

Our marriage wasn’t perfect. It was kind of rough but, I would of NEVER abandoned her.

Im planning on going back to playing in cover bands and continuing my movie prop collections. These are things she had complained about and I put on the back burner. Actually, I just about put my whole life on the back burner for her.

What you wrote made allot of sense, 25. And the more independent I become, the less I see myself standing for our M. Im going through with the D and Im looking forward to being happy. This was her choice. Not mine. If it works out for her, great. If not, oh well.

She has spent almost our whole R comparing me to other men. Asking me “Why can you be like so and so. So and so’s W doesn’t have to work. So and so makes all this $ and you don’t”. “You will be nothing without me”. “Your kids can careless if you would ever walk in that door again”.

And now she pulls this???

Uh uh.

I the line is drawn here. No further

Im gonna live life for God, my kids and myself.

[25yearsmlc]

Broken

I'll post more details later but I'm happy for you to have a L and that's quite a gift your friend gave you.

I want you to rethink your postion though, that you "built a home & family" with your w b/c you did NOT build a home. I still don't know how either of you expected to have a nice life with a mil like that OR how you didnt' save any money for a real home of your own.

Ironically it'll take THIS to get you on your own so you DO build a home for your family, even if it's only the kids who stay there. I'm glad you are getting a place to live, save some money and you can pay your w in accordance with what your L tells you.

You need to save and invest or you'll be on the streets someday. That's not cool or responsible. But pay no attention to what your w does or says. Let it roll off your back.

Good luck

[broken5150]

25,

The reason we never got a home of our own was because she basically included her mothers income into our daily spending. MIL paid the mortgage , we paid for food and bills. And we were STILL living paycheck to paycheck.because W was always planning vacations to the same theme parks every month and buying every new toy that came out for the kids which to me was not necessary.

W had to file for bankruptcy.

Things were falling apart in the house and they blamed me for not fixing it. I'm NOT a good handy man. And when I would tell them I would hire someone, they would tell me they had no money. But they had money for Vegas,Disney,six flags etc...

My w clearly stated at the begining of this separation that she will NEVER leave her mother.

I wanted my own home 25. But like I stated before, non of my rules , opinions or views were honored, respected or even considered.

It was a bad sitch 25.

Sometimes I think this might be a blessing in disguise. God let's things happen for a reason.

I hope w wakes up one day and gets her life together. Not for me, but for the well being of the kids.

Just came out of a so called 20 yr "abusive" R. If this were so, she should of gotten herself together, healed then start the dating thing.

She was lying to whole time telling me she did not want another man.

Yesterday, she sent me a random text telling me that she thanks god for OM. And that she never left me for another man,the OM came after the fact. And she said "sorry, that's just life".

[Mach1]

Sammy.....

I get that you have the need to understand things going on with her right now....

And I get that YOU may not be able to fully "hear" the things that are being said to you right now...

Most of the time, the LBS has to hit bottom too, in order for our path to become fully lit, so that we can see it...

Reading and understanding MLC is imperative to any of us, right up until it hurts us more than it helps us.

Mostly, I agree with 25, that YOU need to forge ahead for yourself. Changing the things that YOU feel you need to change.

Not for her, not because you think she will see your changes...

Because YOU want to change those things.

For you..By you..Because of you.

How do you do that ?

What do you envision that looking like ?

I also see (from your responses, or lack therof) that you are still blaming a lot of things on your wife. That somehow, she did this TO you, instead of for herself..

In time, and with hard work on your behalf...

You will start to see that she didn't do this TO you, she did it FOR you.

And that is a gift, my friend. ( unlike DLR's hair extensions)

I'm not excusing her poor behavior, nor should you.

Looking toward her for either a reason for YOUR choices , OR a way for you to resolve your choices...may not be the best path for you to take.

It allows you to be a victim in all of this, and for you to receive the "sympathy" vote from friends and loved ones.

I wanted to......BUT

I would have......BUT

BUT....is an excuse, to not do better.

Im planning on going back to playing in cover bands and continuing my movie prop collections. These are things she had complained about and I put on the back burner. Actually, I just about put my whole life on the back burner for her.

Take a look at your above comment...

I would have done these things....BUT, I didn't , because of her....

Is that what you want your life to be like ?



Your lack of answers from you, leads me to think you may be avoiding the hard internal issues that led you here to begin with.

Have you always been one to avoid answers ?

Most of the things 25 asked you, you completely blew off, as if they were irrelevant.

I had asked you some questions last week that you did the same with.

Lets keep things fairly simple for now...

From what I have seen , and been through. In order for you to have a shot at seeing your kids more...It would be advantageous for you to have your own place....

More than likely, you are NOT going to have any rational decisions with your wife, that would allow you make effective decisions regarding custody issues....

Therefore, you must SHOW the court, that you are able to provide a home for your children, in order to have them more....

Congrats (???) on the lawyer...???

Just because he is all of that and the Ice Cream Man too, doesn't mean you don't have things to do for yourself through this.






So....

What's your plan Mrs. Doubtfire ????

[Jack_Three_Beans]

Listen to these guys, please.

2 things, Sam.

1 - questions you avoid, ring bells with these very intelligent people. The idea is to look internally; everyone here has a sad story, but not everyone here sees their part in it, the ones who don't see their part, repeat patterns i.e. mistakes and start blaming the world...never themselves.

2 - very quickly, she is pushing your buttons with the OM, not sure why, but at its most basic...people (and rats) push buttons because it grants a reward. Stop giving her what she wants when she pushes your buttons.