I appreciate the suggestion, Finah, but I don't think that I will take that route. To me, "exposing" seems a lot like pursuing. You want the R with OM to end, so you try to introduce pressure through social channels. In my sitch, I would think that it would only backfire. No, my approach will just be clean, cold darkness. It is one of the greatest 180s that I could possibly choose to make. Plus, I want to have as little to do with my W at this point as possible. I can't takes it no more.
In addition, her family already knows that she's living with this guy, and I'm pretty dang sure that they don't approve of it. If her own family couldn't do anything to talk her out of it, I doubt anybody else would, either. The only person who can make such a decision is her.
You know, it's a little dicey making a diagnosis of BPD or other personality disorder when a WAS is in crisis - they all can behave pretty wacky when they are in full crisis. It doesn't necessarily mean they have a personality disorder. BUT - your wife might truly be a candidate for BPD, IF she was like this BEFORE she had the affair.
I appreciate the suggestion, Finah, but I don't think that I will take that route. To me, "exposing" seems a lot like pursuing. You want the R with OM to end, so you try to introduce pressure through social channels. In my sitch, I would think that it would only backfire. No, my approach will just be clean, cold darkness. It is one of the greatest 180s that I could possibly choose to make. Plus, I want to have as little to do with my W at this point as possible. I can't takes it no more.
In addition, her family already knows that she's living with this guy, and I'm pretty dang sure that they don't approve of it. If her own family couldn't do anything to talk her out of it, I doubt anybody else would, either. The only person who can make such a decision is her.
As long as you have ur reasons......just didn't want you to think that there were no other options.
Just out of curiosity what is ur WW's relationship like with her parents?
Are they divorced? or remarried
Are they distant towards her, meaning are they not active in her life
etc....
Me:29 WW:26 No kids 2 dogs T: 11 M: 2 D-day 1: 08/2010 D-day 2: 05/2011 1 POSOM Separated: 06/2011 WW ILY commits to M 9/18 Files D 9/19 ILY Still 9/21 WW are fun
There were moments when she would be *somewhat* like this before the A (blaming all the problems in our M on me, calling me an awful and selfish person when she was PO'ed, etc.) but there was never this amount of rage or avoidance of responsibility. No, the only reason I haven't totally walked away from her and pushed her out of my life in no uncertain terms is because this isn't who she is. I've known her more closely than anybody else in her life for years. Her behavior is highly unusual and out-of-character. Her family agreed with me on this when the A began.
I'm hoping that someday she'll come back to the person that she used to be. I guess we'll see.
Rape survivors can harbor some really deep scars that come out in destructive ways, and I have seen all sorts of destructive, out-of-touch reactions come out of her throughout our R.
You ARE dealing with someone in crisis.
The affair is a symptom.
This isn't normal, plain vanilla, WAW.
It is a WAW with nuts on top.
Sexual abuse/trauma.
It sounds like she was being treated and that she exhibits some signs of BPD.
It has been my experience that they do exhibit signs of the "Cluster B" disorders.
My experience? My W.
The pervasive characteristic I have noticed is the resolution of emotional distress by assuming the victim role.
They develop coping mechanisms that WERE healthy for them to develop to deal with the trauma but are not healthy in adult relationships.
The other thing you have to realize is that she will lack empathy until she decides to stop being the victim.
You are the perpetrator now in this scenario.
Don't expect rational behavior until she decides to deal with her demons.
You have to remove yourself from the equation West.
Let her live with her choices. It is the only way she will decide to make different ones.
Don't expect anything but hope for the best.
AND start living your life like she isn't coming back.
I tell you this because it is the only healthy choice you.
My goal is to some day be the person my dog thinks I am
Finah: Her R with her parents is a dysfunctional one. They are pretty healthy, good-standing people; they have been married for 30 years, they both have P.h.D's, and they both have pretty good jobs working for the state. However, they were abusive toward my W and her brother growing up in the sense that they were "perfectionist" parents -- my W often told me that she felt like her opinion was never really valued and that nothing she ever did was truly good enough. Also, her mom was emotionally and verbally abusive for a while. She eventually apologized after to my W after going to therapy, but the damage was done. Finally, her dad had affairs with another woman multiple times, once while her mom was giving birth to her brother. I can't help but think that such an act might have contributed to this somehow.
Gritter: Thanks so much for the advice. It's good to hear stuff from somebody who's already dealt with someone very similar to my W. I have at this point abandoned the hope that she will return to any kind of rational behavior -- like you said, I am the perpetrator now and she is once again the victim of my selfish, awful ways. I hope that she chooses to face her scars head-on, but perhaps she never will. I will just have to do my best to be healthy and happy in the meantime.
Since my last post, I have been working very hard at plunging myself into work. Fortunately for me, I work at a credit union that is very active in social and community programs, so I've got some pretty good GAL activities that are coming up. Also, as we speak, I snagged a long weekend and have been able to steal away to my hometown. This means seeing lots of my family and friends, eating good food, and doing fun stuff.
Unfortunately, I also feel as though I'm harboring a dark secret. Everyone on my side of the family knows that my W and I have separated and may eventually D, but I haven't told anyone about OM. My dad strongly suspects OM, but I have denied it. I'm not sure why I'm keeping this a secret anymore. Maybe just in general because it's easier to keep a lid on things. I also feel that telling everybody would blow any possible chances of R and may even bring on some even nastier behavior from her. I don't feel like messing around with it for the time being.
I'm not going to lie, I'm trying hard to be strong with all of this, but the "mind movies" have been getting stronger and stronger, as have my emotions regarding them. I'm feeling that they would not be nearly as strong had my W not told me a lot of cruelly explicit details about her sex life with OM. When she first broke the news of the A, she cared very much about how I felt. When I pressed her for details about the extent of her A (like, had she slept with him?), she was reluctant to say anything, admitting "it's nothing that you want to hear."
After she quickly went into "alien" mode, she really didn't care if what she told me hurt me or not. (I would literally flinch or clutch my heart when she would tell me something particuarly hurtful and she would just act like it was nothing.) She began discussing very intimate details about their sex life, including his preference for S&M, the size of his equipment (he's been blessed down there), and just in general how more "experienced" he was than me. (I've only slept with her. He's slept with almost 10 people.) At the time, I didn't prevent her from saying anything because I had a strange desire to know the details. I'm not sure why. I just did. Now, months later, it's only making the images in my mind more distressing and agonizing.
I'm really struggling with this right now. I feel so angry, so hurt, so betrayed. I sometimes wish that I could find a way to make her hurt like she's hurting me. What hurts the most is how she has herself convinced that she's doing nothing wrong and that I'm to blame for anything. I hate dealing with someone who is so out of touch with reality. A lot of times, it makes me question my own sanity. "Am I wrong?" I ask myself. "Did I really push her into this? Was I that bad of a husband?" It's strange. If this was happening to someone else, I would say "no" in a heartbeat. But when you're neck-deep in it, it's harder to see reality for what it is.
Sorry to kind of go on about this. It was just getting bottled up and I felt that I needed to release it. Where better than DB.com? I know that I will eventually get past this. Unfortunately, I feel stuck. A lot of me feels like I don't want to be with my W anymore because she has treated me so cruelly. Yet I think of dating anyone else and the idea just turns me off.
Things'll get better, I know. Just feeling blue tonight, I guess. I'm really not looking forward to my W coming down to visit. I just want her to get in, see the rabbit a few times, then let her on out. Nothing more. I really need this darkness in order to heal from all of this nonsense. I just don't care if she doesn't "get" it or feels that I'm being selfish. I'm tired of caring about her whacked-out state of mind right now.
If OM is so great she should want everyone to know how great and happy her and OM are
She is wayward man, nothing out of her mouth will make sense and believe absolutely none of it.
Her lashing out about their sex life.......please......give me a break.......what a drama queen. I wouldn't believe any of it. It's like the drunk guy at the party bragging about how many girl he get's with when in fact he is still a virgin.
I'll be totally straight forward with u.
If you don't expose this......and allow this affair to run it's course.......you will end up divorced. I'd bet money on it.
I said it in another thread.......your M can survive her anger, your M will not survive an active A, if you don't do anything about it.
This has gone on too long.
Either D her.
Wait for her to D you.
Or start exposing to anyone and everyone.
While I agree with a lot of the DB principles...
An A is a different ball game.....and it's not for the weak hearted.
Think about this......what have you shown her......
You have shown her that if she is boinking OM.....you are going to go dark and stand bye and wait for her to return.
No woman will respect that.
I'm sorry if I am coming off strong.......
Nothing is going to happen if you don't do anything.
GAL all you want, stay dark, but you need to show your WW that you are strong......and you won't stand for this and that your are the better man and you will fight to your death for her.
If you end up D.........years from now your WW will look back and see that you didn't fight for her........you went dark.....stood bye........idle........waiting for her to make a move.
Have you ever picked up a girl...by doing nothing? No.
Look OM is a wuss, a pathetic POSOM who can't pick up single women, he has to go after married women.
Do I need to explain how much better of a choice you are over OM........your WW knows this deep down.
She won't end this affair on her own. You need to help her.
You can help her by exposing it all at once.
OH she will be livid........she will threaten divorce and all sorts of crazy things about how she was thinking about coming back to you but now she's not.......it's all an act dude.
You are all ready in LRT mode........you don't have anything to lose. Either you are going to let this A die out in a couple years.....expecting your totally WW to come to her senses.......or start fighting for what you want.....
And don't you dare trickle expose this........if we are going to do this......we are going to do it right and I will guide you through it.
Learn from my mistakes.......I trickled exposed.....WW ran all over me and I backed down......when I should of kept on exposing.......
Look man.....you are young.......you only live once.......and you will only get one shot at this......
You have to have NO FEAR.
Understand POSOM is in Disney land right now.......he gets your wife.....while you sit on the sidelines.........start making his life a living he!!.......make him realize that you are not someone to be messed with, that if this continues you will ruin his life......his career.......everything.......make him believe that carrying this A on w/ your WW is not worth the hassle.
I'm telling you.......all OM's are cowards.......as soon as it starts to be more trouble than it's worth.........they bounce onto their next victim.
Me:29 WW:26 No kids 2 dogs T: 11 M: 2 D-day 1: 08/2010 D-day 2: 05/2011 1 POSOM Separated: 06/2011 WW ILY commits to M 9/18 Files D 9/19 ILY Still 9/21 WW are fun
Well - a word of caution about exposing the affair.
There are some cases, true, with a basically sane spouse who still has a conscience, where exposing the affair snaps them awake and out of fantasyland.
These cases are RARE.
More often what I have seen is that when the affair is exposed, it pushes the WAS further into the affair with the OP, and makes them see the LBS as petty and reactive.
(Plus, if you DO reconcile, it will be awkward forever with your family, who will never forgive her).
Far better, imho, to do what you did - drop the rope, stick to the high road, and after the initial period of pursuit doesn't work, let her think you are moving on.
As for what she has told you about OM - S and M, really??? Ick. I think that just tells you something about how whacked she is right now. And I suspect her comment about his equipment may not even be true, just designed to hurt you - we already know she's capable of spewing the nastiest stuff. Don't get sucked in.
