What happens next part II?????

[aeolianchaos]

Rick,

I think you are sincerely trying to be easy-going and accommodating where you can.

I wouldn't count on an IC to 'help' your W sort things out. Especially if its during your D14's appointment. I think it's a possibility, but it's a better possibility that your action in taking your D14 to counseling might be showing your W some of what is best in who you are.

But perhaps there is an opportunity here for you to show your D14 strength, and the willingness to get help when things are difficult. Maybe its an opportunity to show her the kind of ego strength that it takes to acknowledge who you are and what your experience is like right now. And the strength to persist and love when things are difficult. I would think these are good qualities to show one's child.

Incidentally, the ability to ask for help is a key metric of people who live happy lives.

[Rick1963]

Thanks aeoloanchaos for the kind words. Are you saying that I should take her instead of W? I think W will be asking to take her.

[sandi2]

All 3 of us married strong women and all 3 of us behaved the same.

Behaved.....as in being passive? As in letting resentment build until you are blowing the stack? Am I thinking of someone else who said they had to work themselves up for a few days before expressing how they felt.....and then the temper was lost?

Rick, I am considered by my H, and most others, to be a strong woman. So, maybe that qualifies me to tell you something about being M to a strong woman. Strong women HATE, HATE, HATE for their H's to be passive! The stronger the woman, the more important it is to have respect for him. Otherwise, she will chew him up and spit him out. In fact, she will continue to disrepect him to see if he has any b@lls at all.

The H may think he is cooperating or letting the W have her way.....but in reality he is passive. The stronger the woman...the more she desires to have a man who will stand his ground....especially when she is wrong. That is why you see some women go after the bad boys....not b/c he's bad, but b/c she often mistakes his bad behavior...as him being strong.

Oh, and one more thought here....if the H leaves the children's discipline up to the W to carry out......very bad resentment will take root. She wants a man who will take charge. I'm not saying to take things to the other extreme. You have to use some wisdom here.

Don't confuse being easy-going, nice guy mentality, who loving, kind, good-hearted, cooperative, etc., as passive. Not the same thing.

[25yearsmlc]

golden post by sandi....READ IT AGAIN!!! Please...it's valuable.

So "passive' to ME, means either passive agressive or lazy or cowardly

and abdicating responsibility onto another, or dumping all the messy stuff to another,

so HE the passive one, can be the good guy!

or the guy who never actualy decides--so he's never technically wrong! (in fairness, he's never technically right either, but you can bet he'll want to look that way).

[b]
Please Rick, banish the sentence "I told you so" from your language.

It's harmful, self righteous, teaches NOTHING but gloating....and it erodes love and forgiveness.
[/b]

After I read my h's contract to go to Alaska, I point out maybe 6 or 7 things wrong with it, 3 of which would be deal breakers to any other client of mine. I said it was a ponzi scheme and that it probably wasn't even legal.

H said I was being "negative" and "a wet blanket"....he signed it.

3 years pass and every single objection I had has risen up to bite us hard. It has cost us a fortune PLUS lost years...

I have never once said "I told you so", or ANYTHING like that and it was not easy.

But it was my goal.

I saw the pain and anger in hs' eyes and his shame. No way would I add to it "just to make sure he learned a lesson" (= I was right!!)

That's purely selfish ego/need to be vindicated or right on my end, and 10 other bad ideas in a marriage.

Please rick, learn from that one. It's a biggie, and it would be a huge 180 for you to man up in that area.

No more waiting for your w to decide things and then privately "hoping" your d is alright.

If your d were drowning in a lake while your w was "supposed" to be watching her

but your w got distracted -- would you stand by and watch your d drown

b/c your w didn't tell YOU to save the d? Would you watch her drown and say "I told YOU to watch her but YOU didn't!"

Of course not Rick.

So when you fear your d is losing it, go get her help!

Don't delegate or outline various job duties to each party or just dally about...be her dad!

and don't use ANYONE else as an excuse or obstacle to you helping your baby girl yourself.

Carry on Rick and good luck

((( )))

[Rick1963]

This thing about me acting passive is news to me. I always thought of myself as a go getter, Straight shooter, direct and never sugar coat anything. I always thought of myself as being more aggressive than passive. But in looking back I admit that I have been passive in many instances and letting W take care of stuff. Mostly around the pets, D's schooling or decorating the house and our finances. I really don't know how to make this clear in my head yet. But the one thing that comes to mind and it is why I fear the future without her (sad to admit this) is because I feel dependent on her. I have always depended on her financially the most. Even though I have always worked and paid my way? <This is something I really need to look at. The other thing related to finances is that since W bought the horse, 2 years ago she's broke. I pay all of the bills except for 2, food and property taxes. Now in looking back I resented that I'm paying for mostly everything. And I really should not have been upset about it.

I have been paying attention to my interactions with W. Last night W served us dinner. We sat to eat. Our dog is very old and unable to walk. He was at the other side of the kitchen and started to cry. Which latetly means he wants to be near one of us. So I got up to get him and so did W. I got to him 1st and picked him up. W made hand signs that she opposed/was annoyed at me for doing this. Not sure why? I asked where would she like me to put him down. She said anywhere under the dinner table. He stopped crying and we spoke about superficial things while we ate. This is how W always communicates with me. It is usually not all verbal but mostly physical, a stare, silence, turns head, ignores. I always felt that I needed to read her mind to find a response. So what usually followed was me getting pissed, not always an angry outburts but would make some wise remark. This is something I have learned about me. W would say that she does not anwser because she is afraid of me getting pissed, I agree. So last night when she did that I did not get pissed instead I did what I thought was best for the dog and our dinner time. I did not make any remarks or asked why she seemed annoyed. Sandi and 25 I see your POV and will keep looking at it. In addition, for the past 3 weeks I have said very little to W and really trying to practice LRT. Sorry to be all over the place but it has been helping me see things about me when I write stuff even if doesn't make any sense to some.



PS: I'm thinking of inventing a DBIng helmet cause my skull is full of bumps.

[Rick1963]

Is it possible that my W is going through a MLC? Not to deny my behaviors. But I have been thinking about this for a while. She has changed in the past 2 years. Wondering if I should be doing other things? Just a thought.

[Queen_of_Swords]

It's possible. Especially if your wife has had an abusive childhood.
Recognize that abusive does not just mean physical abuse.
Abuse can be one of five types: Rejection ( includes the death of a parent or divorce), physical abuse, emotional abuse, sexual abuse ( from outside the family) or incest.

[Rick1963]

QS thanks. I don't know if W was abused. I know my MIL is aloof and does strange things. I do know her parents have been separated for at least 30 years but live together. So I imagine her parents must of had arguments while she was growing up. W has denied that they argued even though I have seing them argue many times. Welived with the for a year 14 years ago. I also know MIL's mther abandonned her when a child and live in foster homes for a period.

[Queen_of_Swords]

Abandonment = Rejection.
Rejection is the worst form of abuse to a child. Why? Because to be be rejected = abandonment and abandonment is death to baby/child. Your W has been living in survival mode since perhaps before she was even born.

That's why it's listed first. It can be felt kinesthetically and chemically by a 24 week old fetus in utero.
Especially, if the mother doesn't want the child, or is herself in an abusive relationship.

Your W has a lot of stuff she's never dealt with and has papered over. It is NOW coming back to bite her in the butt. At her core she doesn't know who she is, her intrinsic value, or even what she wants, she's unaware of the value system the structures her life upon or recognize the "lies" that she's based her life upon.

What she did to get approval and acceptance to survive as child no longer works as an adult, this causes her pain and confusion.

Rick she has to work this out and it has little to do with you. Unfortunately she, like my STBX, has to be WILLLING to do the work, face the pain and restructure their lives from the foundation up for HERSELF.

You can't make her, persuade her, or encourage her. You can't counsel her or cajole her.

Keep on DB'ing Rick. She'll eventually have to relate to you in a different way.

[Rick1963]

QS thank you.

We were supposed to have our furnace serviced yesterday but they never showed up. The AC sytem is leaking water so I have to dry it everyday. I asked W if she would like me to take care of it she said she would. I trully offered to take the responsibility away from her. I just called her to see if there was any news. She said that the repair man told her that there wasn't anyone in our area yesterday to answer the service call. She laughed and said that she had spoken to the person yesterday and he told her he would be over in an hour but never came. We both laughed I said thank you and we hung up. they will be here next Thursday she said. My question is did I do the wrong thing by calling home about this? I hope she does not feel like I'm persuing.