Stillness

[Still learning]

I read all of these. A bit of an overacheiver in the "educate yourself" department, I guess. But the more I read the less I was screwing up my R. The parts of all these books that resonated with me were the parts I needed at the time. The others seemed, well, not so helpful. Then I worked on some things, came back and read the books and ya know what? The parts that resonated were different. Take what ya need, move forward, and if you come back and see things differently - I guess that's growth. Well, I HOPE it's growth anyway!

[Endeavour]

Read the N.U.T.S book a few days ago. Interesting ideas, but I can't say it rocked my world. Some of the stuff just seemed silly. But the emphasis on integrity and self-respect certainly resonated with me.

I've read it it too and it's clearly not on the same level as Passionate Marriage, and it's a bit "dumbed" down so I can certainly understand why you weren't impressed. To be honest, the writing wasn't that great either but that said, a lot of it outlined exactly what I had been trying to tell my H for years. The way the author explained it may have been simple, but my H finally got it. And this is a man with a Masters degree so he's not stupid. But when it comes to R's, apparently he needed it all spelled out in simple terms by another man.

[aeolianchaos]

I've read it it too and it's clearly not on the same level as Passionate Marriage, and it's a bit "dumbed" down so I can certainly understand why you weren't impressed. To be honest, the writing wasn't that great either but that said, a lot of it outlined exactly what I had been trying to tell my H for years. The way the author explained it may have been simple, but my H finally got it. And this is a man with a Masters degree so he's not stupid. But when it comes to R's, apparently he needed it all spelled out in simple terms by another man.

Endeavor,


You captured much of my thoughts on it quite well. The issues were largely presentational for me - for some it would be exactly what they need and I'm appreciative of that.

Just had another online chat w/ WAW. Will post more later - don't know if it 'went' much of anywhere.

[aeolianchaos]

So another substantial conversation between WAW and myself. Although I don't know how much substance there was in it.

Kind of felt like stasis to me.


AeolianChaos I'm going to be moving out next weekend, so maybe its going to be easiest to just handle it all in that process?
WAW: oh wow
did you find a place?
AeolianChaos Yeah. Just need to sign the lease.
WAW: thats great!
WAW: anyways, you dont have to tell me where it is- just curious. I hope you like it.
AeolianChaos ?
AeolianChaos You think I am hiding my address from you?
WAW: no not at all
I just dont want to overstep my boundaries.
AeolianChaos what are your boundaries?
WAW: not quite sure... but I feel like there are some. I just dont want you to feel like I'm prying
AeolianChaos Why would I feel like you are prying?
WAW: I dont know...its my own insecurities I suppose
AeolianChaos You feel insecure about how I feel?
WAW: i feel insecure about how to communicate with you and I feel insecure about how you feel in that Im just not sure
AeolianChaos what is it that you are just not sure about with regards to those things?
WAW: if you want some space...
WAW: I want to still communicate with you
AeolianChaos Why is it that you want to still communicate with me?
WAW: because I care about you
you're a big part of my life
AeolianChaos So you feel like because of that, you want to be in touch with me?
WAW: yes...is that wrong? I just dont know if you want me to- and if you dont, I wont try
AeolianChaos What would that look like, in your mind?
WAW: us keeping in touch? well i'm not sure about the future, but in the immediate- doing what we're doing? talking online?
AeolianChaos Why do you think I wouldn't want you to?
WAW: I dont think that, I just dont know what you want.... I'd like to think that in the future you and I could still be friends, but that might be unrealistic....and unpredictable as of now
AeolianChaos why do you think it might be unrealistic?
WAW: given our circumstances, what I did to you...
AeolianChaos In cheating on me?
WAW: yes. and wanting the divorce. it wouldnt be totally inconceivable if you didnt want to talk to me again
AeolianChaos Well thats a challenging part.
WAW: I cant imagine
AeolianChaos I value our relationship a lot. Enough that I wanted to work things out even when things got very difficult.
WAW: I know
AeolianChaos A lot of that value, for me, was in the fact that we had created our lives together for almost a decade. It wasn't in my day to day feelings about you or anything like that.
WAW: I still value that aspect of our relationship, we grew up together.
AeolianChaos Yes, in many ways we did.
WAW: I do want to talk to you about this, and how we can still communicate...but I have to chase CAT down for her vet apt. I didnt expect we would talk about it. you can always email me.
AeolianChaos About what?
WAW: what we were just talking about...or whatever.

... (some chat about my moving arrangements.. nothing special) ...

AeolianChaos Well go take care of CAT. If anything comes to mind, feel free to shoot me an e-mail
WAW: I will. good luck with the move, and have a good time with your parents when they come-
AeolianChaos it's not until next weekend
WAW: ok. I'll talk to you later then- take care:)
AeolianChaos bye


I'm going to break this into two posts.

[aeolianchaos]

I don't know how to respond to a lot of this stuff - especially the stuff about if I want to talk to her or not. One of my original goals was for her to feel like it was 'safe' to communicate with me again - without me using logic to overwhelm her. That said, is it safe for me?

I'm trying to avoid laying down any hard ultimatums or anything like that at the moment. There's always time for that when I am more settled into myself.

I also want to make sure whatever I say I mean it, am willing to stick by it, and I'm doing it for the best of reasons. this whole 'friends' thing though.. well I don't know. I'm kind of mystified by it and can't help but wonder if there is a secondary agenda to it.

Is it because I've been acting with dignity? Is it because she feels like she has something to prove in maintaining a friendship? Is she eating cake (keep in mind she did see OM again after walking out.. no clue about if she still is, but I tend to assume so)?

More importantly, what the heck does my integrity and well being dictate?

Sometimes I wish that whatever was going on was more on the surface - a little uglier and grittier. I feel like at least things could be more clear.

Feeling pretty burnt out right now -- I have been spending a lot of time writing cover letters and trying to get a job. Too much focus on one thing and my anxiety tends to kick in as life feels too out of balance.

Because I see the employment thing as almost an 'emergency' its a little tough to take my focus off of it, yet because I focus so much I can tell my effectiveness is declining.

Networking seems to be going well, although sometimes I just feel a tremendous sense of ambivalence about what kind of career I want to pursue. Most of the interesting stuff (psychotherapist, architect, LEED consultant, occupational therapist..) seems like it means another few years of school. It could be worth it eventually, but right now I kind of want to find something that gives me enough security and stability so I can pay off the 40K in student loans I already accrued.

[aeolianchaos]

Quick Journal,

Feeling a little less burnt out today. Measured out the new apartment - a glorious 310 sq feet not including the bathroom. I've been sleeping on an air mattress for the past month or so, but I'm thinking that i might upgrade to a futon once I get in there. Any recommendations?

I actually really like the challenge of arranging things in constrained space. It's like a puzzle and I feel smart afterwards.

Still kind of scratching my head about yesterdays conversation. Not ruminating, but definitely unsure what the deal is. And what I'm going to do about it.

[kml]

310 s.f.? That's a puzzle for sure!

Have you thought about one of those loft beds like in a student dorm? Bed up top, desk or sofa underneath? Could free up a little valuable floor space.

Futons can be comfy to sleep on but putting one up and down every day could get to be a drag, not to mention making and unmaking your bed every day.

[Finah]

I'll make an attempt. 
 
She instantly gave you the power in the convo by saying "you don't have to tell me where it is" expecting you to lead the convo and you asked good questions and then about half way through it finally comes out.  " I want to still communicate with you "  Call it cake eating call it whatever, she knows she still needs you in her life.  And then the R talk she wants to talk about it but throws it back your way by saying "email me" then you throw back her way and she said " I will " 
 
It's up to you where you want to take it and what you are comfortable with.  I would expect more, whether it be friends or something else.
 
If she still is involved w/ OM its pure cake eating.  If she is not involved I would handle it differently as it could be genuine and she is just kind of scared and unsure.
 
 

[Telemark]

Finah said it well; she has one foot on the dock and one foot in the boat. You were wise to ask questions rather than volunteer information. Might be a good time for you to pull back just a little. Always leave your audience wanting more...

Off topic: you mentioned LEED consultant. I am a LEED AP (our firm has two); took about 6 months of intense studying and then took the test. Regardless of what the construction industry is like right now (terrible) energy & resource conservation and management is the wave of the future. I have several certifications, but the LEED has opened the most doors.

Just my $.02...

[aeolianchaos]

hi KML! Thanks for contributing to the thread.

Fortunately its 310 over 2 rooms, so I've got some wiggle room in terms of locating things.

6 years ago, I lived in a 170 sq ft studio in south beach for about 1.5 years w/ my WAW! That was very challenging. This is just me, so I'm thinking it might be a little easier.

I used to sleep on a futon, it wasn't too bad. But you are correct - setting it up every day could be an irritant.