Eeesh.. Spewing Venom like a cobra. Good for you for handling it with grace.
This is purely a question - but do mean exactly what you are saying about it being best for the kids if they live with you in the house?
As long as you aren't using that as a reason to keep her around and your motives are just that.. than so be it. She will think what she wants. As 25 said "It's life, it ain't always pretty".
Continue to feel bad for her. Staying empathetic is way better than getting angry.
M(f): 40 D'ed: 8/12
Show empathy when there's pain. Show grace when warranted. Kindness in the midst of anger. Faith in the face of fear.
I do feel its best for the kids to have the stability of our home. I know when the D is final, things will change but I think the impact on them should be delayed as long as possible.
I don't like the thought of her leaving but it is probably for the best right now. I don't think seperation is the answer she is looking for but what do I know. It seems she is buried in guilt. I think she regrets her decision...maybe I hope that.
I agree that anger is not the answer. I am gettin a lot better at avoiding it. Thank you.
General question....when most couples seperate, do they shuffle the kids back and forth between homes????
yes, if they share custody.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
General question....when most couples seperate, do they shuffle the kids back and forth between homes????
RO
When my W moved out we sat the kids down and asked them what they wanted to do (ours are 14 & 12, so understand a bit more, not sure of your kids ages), and they wanted what we had hoped i.e. a week each at a time. This worked as W only moved round the corner, so schooling remains the same, and they can pop round each others at any time.
Although this has now changed, as the kids want to be with me 10 out of 14 days, and the reason W has become nasty.
It hard, and morally a week each is right, BUT, its what the kids want..
So, what I am saying is........
If what you are saying you believe is right for the children's welfare and well-being, and not your own personal agenda, then stick to it.
It will be hard, very hard, you will get venom spuing big time, but stand by it for the kids
Me - 37 W - 38 D - 14 S - 12 Together - 16 Married - 12 Bomb - April 13, 2011 W moved out - May 13, 2011
The man I became is changing back to the man I was........... and more
I do feel its best for the kids to have the stability of our home. I know when the D is final, things will change but I think the impact on them should be delayed as long as possible. Maybe so. But beware it looks like you are trying to control things again. And plus you didn't spend much time w/them before the bomb so she's seeing it as either a tactic of yours to control outcome OR it's you trying to punish her.
It's mind reading on my part I admit, but something tells me there is an ounce of truth to the above. I think you believe consciously that what you want is what's best for the kids, which is convenient and probably what she believes about her desires for them, but there's a streak of "that's what she gets" in your tone. IDK, just a gut feeling I won't push but I do feel.
I don't like the thought of her leaving but it is probably for the best right now. I don't think seperation is the answer she is looking for but what do I know. It seems she is buried in guilt. I think she regrets her decision...maybe I hope that. Where do you get that "buried in guilt" feeling from? What has she said or done that indicates any guilt? I just hear about all the spewing and venom and that sounds like anger to me. And given your past - which is probably her focus a lot, I get that.
I agree that anger is not the answer. I am gettin a lot better at avoiding it. Thank you.
Well good. showing her your anger is about the last thing you need to show her or the kids now.
A strong man is in control of HIS emotions, not trying to control others'.
She may need to be released to see what she needs to see.
It's a discovery she has to make that you cannot help her with. She's solving a puzzle only she can solve and you have to release her to her task.
No more judging her okay? It's lousy for the kids and lousy for you...it's a poisonous way of thinking and living. You said that you are working on your negativity and staying positive so you really need to work on this RO...
have you worked on your personal NON-M issues? You said you had "30 years of misery" to deal with along with the pain of this, and I wonder how that work is going. I assume you meant deficits in childhood and the way your family dynamics were...
also financially=are you seeking alimony from your w? IDK if you are in the US but are you expecting to get half time custody?
lots to work out and so does she. Maybe if you keep the road home paved and smooth, things will turn around. Or maybe they'll turn around after the separation happens. I do think you need to stop talking so much and your need to "clarify" will backfire. You could write 39 things on a sheet of paper and the more you write the more likely SOME part of it will be at odds with her recall. She will focus on THAT part of it and it'll have been for nothing.
IMO, there are only two responses to venom spewing about the past...
1) IF there is simply no validity to their recall of an event or it's out of the blue MADE UP...you can say "wow, i don't recall it that way at all but I'm sorry you felt hurt"...
2) if there is SOME or a lot of validity to what they say you reply "I hear you and if I had it to do over again, there are a lot of things I would do differently."
Neither of these responses can really be argued, they diffuse without you being a doormat.
Also they both show a CHANGED MAN b/c if #1 applies, you have said you are sorry if she was hurt...perfectly reasonable.
If #2 applies, you are owning the behavior and showing that you "get it" and that's different now b/c you are changing the behavior. Problems being worked on, are no longer problems...
make sense? No need to engage in any detailed arguments.
As for the Legal issues, let the Ls work them out. That's what we're here for and it spares you from dealing with the ugliest parts of this AND separates you from the legal fighting in your w's eyes. The less involved you seem to be the more your L can take the heat. You want that.
It's keeping the road home paved and smooth and
even if you decide to give up and quit the pro marriage efforts
having a smoother r with the mother of your children is a good idea.
Hang in there, keep up the DBing work on you and only you. You are all you are in charge of.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
25 n GAL, thx but not a lot of time to respond right now. Will do later.
Been thinking a lot about the separation. Seems she wants to leave with the kids 50/50 with more regard for herself than the kids. I would be more open to the suggestion if we weren’t in D proceedings. If she was willing to work on things and wasn’t so emphatic that we are done maybe I’d have a different opinion. Should I tell her that? Seems at this point it would only make it easier on her. Protecting my kids well being trumps that every time. Maybe if we weren’t in D process, I’d have a different mindset. Make any sense? Sounds sort of vindictive. I don’t like seeing her in pain but I hate the thought of my kids being in pain.
I do feel its best for the kids to have the stability of our home. I know when the D is final, things will change but I think the impact on them should be delayed as long as possible. Maybe so. But beware it looks like you are trying to control things again. And plus you didn't spend much time w/them before the bomb so she's seeing it as either a tactic of yours to control outcome OR it's you trying to punish her.
I have actually been the primary caregiver for over two years since leaving my career to move home. I am now making our time together much more loving for all of us.
It's mind reading on my part I admit, but something tells me there is an ounce of truth to the above. I think you believe consciously that what you want is what's best for the kids, which is convenient and probably what she believes about her desires for them, but there's a streak of "that's what she gets" in your tone. IDK, just a gut feeling I won't push but I do feel.
There may be some of that honestly. I don't think it's a motivator though, just a byproduct of a bad situation. She is processing a lot of bad ramifications of her decision to D. She is going to have to deal with that.
I don't like the thought of her leaving but it is probably for the best right now. I don't think seperation is the answer she is looking for but what do I know. It seems she is buried in guilt. I think she regrets her decision...maybe I hope that. Where do you get that "buried in guilt" feeling from? What has she said or done that indicates any guilt? I just hear about all the spewing and venom and that sounds like anger to me. And given your past - which is probably her focus a lot, I get that.
It comes from things she has said over the past several weeks. She "doesn't know how she's going to explain this to the kids when they're older". She realizes we haven't tried everything to resolve our issues. I have asked her and she can't answer, just says "she's done". She is by nature an unbelievably nice person. How can she, as a mother of two young boys, say she wants a divorce without even considering therapy or a seperation? Won't even discuss it. How can she do that when she sees and acknowledges the changes that I am making? How can she not have guilt?
I agree that anger is not the answer. I am gettin a lot better at avoiding it. Thank you.
Well good. showing her your anger is about the last thing you need to show her or the kids now.
A strong man is in control of HIS emotions, not trying to control others'.
**I like this line.
She may need to be released to see what she needs to see.
**I know. She mentioned the "if you love something set it free" concept to me in the recent past.
It's a discovery she has to make that you cannot help her with. She's solving a puzzle only she can solve and you have to release her to her task.
No more judging her okay? It's lousy for the kids and lousy for you...it's a poisonous way of thinking and living. You said that you are working on your negativity and staying positive so you really need to work on this RO...
**I get it. I am trying to be more empathetic.
have you worked on your personal NON-M issues? You said you had "30 years of misery" to deal with along with the pain of this, and I wonder how that work is going. I assume you meant deficits in childhood and the way your family dynamics were...
**"Misery" may be a bit strong. The last year has been miserable because I have realized what I have been. The rest of the time I think have been superficial and empty inside. The void has caused me to hurt the ones I love by not being emotionally available to them.
also financially=are you seeking alimony from your w? IDK if you are in the US but are you expecting to get half time custody?
**Not sure yet. I am in the US. I left a promising career to come home and start a business. She is the current breadwinner. The plan was for me to start a business. To be honest, I have been such a mess that I have not been in the frame of mind to do that in a successful manner. This D is probably going to suck away all of the cash I have been using to run the business which pretty makes me high and dry. I have tried to explain this to her. This really upsets me. We have never discussed anything other the 50/50 custody. We are traditionally both great parents.
lots to work out and so does she. Maybe if you keep the road home paved and smooth, things will turn around. Or maybe they'll turn around after the separation happens. I do think you need to stop talking so much and your need to "clarify" will backfire. You could write 39 things on a sheet of paper and the more you write the more likely SOME part of it will be at odds with her recall. She will focus on THAT part of it and it'll have been for nothing.
IMO, there are only two responses to venom spewing about the past...
1) IF there is simply no validity to their recall of an event or it's out of the blue MADE UP...you can say "wow, i don't recall it that way at all but I'm sorry you felt hurt"...
2) if there is SOME or a lot of validity to what they say you reply "I hear you and if I had it to do over again, there are a lot of things I would do differently."
**very similar to what my DB coach has me doing
Neither of these responses can really be argued, they diffuse without you being a doormat.
Also they both show a CHANGED MAN b/c if #1 applies, you have said you are sorry if she was hurt...perfectly reasonable.
If #2 applies, you are owning the behavior and showing that you "get it" and that's different now b/c you are changing the behavior. Problems being worked on, are no longer problems...
make sense? No need to engage in any detailed arguments.
**I like it.
As for the Legal issues, let the Ls work them out. That's what we're here for and it spares you from dealing with the ugliest parts of this AND separates you from the legal fighting in your w's eyes. The less involved you seem to be the more your L can take the heat. You want that.
**This is the tricky part and is a significant source of tension. We are trying to resolve things ourselves without paying $30K in legal fees. She wants none our physical assets (house, land (which has been in my family for generations), etc). Now says she never wanted to buy them in the first place. That leaves our retirement accounts and our liquid assets. Retirement accounts, no problem. Liquid assets, big problem for me. They represent my only means of supporting myself if I don't get a job. It's very difficult to discuss these things without nerves getting frayed. It is being discussed only because of her decision to D which I obviously very much disagree with. Another source of guilt for her here.
It's keeping the road home paved and smooth and
even if you decide to give up and quit the pro marriage efforts
having a smoother r with the mother of your children is a good idea.
Hang in there, keep up the DBing work on you and only you. You are all you are in charge of.
I fear my W is slipping into a deep depression. I explained our situation to a friend of mine who feels the antidepressants she’s taking may be playing a major role in my W’s behavior. She is on a low dose prescription. It may be and explanation for her precipitous downward slide. Doesn’t seem the explanation can be that simple though.
I am concerned for her. I reached out to her BF just to verify that my W wasn’t holding everything inside. She is so nice and worried about burdening people that I could see her not confiding in anyone about our situation. She said they are talking which makes me feel better.
I am considering offering to swap nights out of the house with her. We could leave the kids in the home and we could set a schedule to stay away. I want to help her but don’t want to hurt the kids. She is taking a strange approach….feels like if the kids are going to have a 2 year “recovery period”, why not start it now and “get it over with?”. I love her to pieces but feel she is so naïve about what a D does to kids.
The reality of our impending financial situation is also starting to hit home with her. When this thing first started, she was looking to buy a new home (in the 3000 sf range) in her hometown which is a higher end community about 10 miles away from us. She said she wanted to have the kids go to school there too...I immediately told her that wasn't goin to happen. She now is considering moving into a 1200 sf 100 yr old investment house in our current town. All of our lives are going to change dramatically and she is starting to see the reality of that I think. I think this adds to her guilt.
She mentioned last night how I used to be so certain of my opinions that I wouldn’t consider other people’s insight or thoughts. She is doing the exact same thing regarding this D. It is so spooky that we each seemed to have turned into the other person. She has taken my old persona above and beyond though IMHO.
