WAW, Filing as Fast as Possible

[aeolianchaos]

Oh, the * next to reading the books. Just something to consider. One thing I have had to try and catch for myself.
It is easy to just keep reading, reading, reading, and not ever fully practice.
Try to take time in-between to really digest and put into practice the ideas.
The goal is to become a "finder." Not be a continuous "seeker."

I really appreciate what you are pointing out here. This is something that I have done a lot of - staying inside my head and not going into the 'doing' mode. Thanks for pointing this out, because its something I really do need to stay conscious of. For me, I believe that forming a concrete plan of action and preloading decisions can help me get going on the 'doing' part of things, and that allows me to evaluate real evidence and adjust based on experience rather than my own limited predictive abilities.

One thing that strikes me though is that she is afraid of your anger. And it's PERCEIVED anger. As you said, you never did anything - so... HER drama. She knows she did something horribly wrong by having a PA, so possibly she is perceiving that anger that she thinks she deserves and preparing herself.

My anger has been a bit scary in the past, particularly as a manifestation of depression and low self-worth. Usually just a lot of noise, but still it's something I have remorse for and am happy to be in a better place at this point. However the worst thing I've done since the PA was exposed was say some mean/vulgar things.

I did express some rather violent thoughts about the OM to my W when I was wrapped up in my angry thoughts and I can see how they might have scared her, but she certainly never indicated to me any fear that I was going to engage in violence towards her. And I never suggested that I was going to/wanted to/intended to be violent towards her. In fact, I offered her coffee when she came to get more of her stuff because I was concerned that she wasn't in a good place to drive.

The toughest thing about this process/journal is the "why's"...both how did this happen and now why our WAS are oblivious to the positive changes in each of us. I KNOW these thoughts are not healthy, but I find this element the most challenging.

Yeah - I totally hear you on this one. It is really tough to get my head around the 'why' of how this happened. A lot of that is because we can only be responsible for half of the relationship. If I could read minds, I wouldn't have the experience I'm having now.

The notion of the 'Wall' the WAW puts up is an interesting and appealing one, but I think its a little simplistic. WAW's can have plenty of their own issues and those can be playing a big role in their behaviors. Self-justification, denial, avoidance, etc.. aren't just the walls they've put up to protect their hearts, its a way of coping w/ their own unethical decisions and perhaps dealing w/ their deeper issues (lack of a solid sense of self, perhaps..). I'm not saying the WAS doesn't have some kind of barrier to experiencing love as a result of the LBS but I think in a lot of cases its a both and kind of thing.

This can be nice - hey, I don't have all the problems!! - but it is also a little disempowering: there are things they need to deal with that are basically out of your influence, and now that they are front and center, they might decide to jettison you(read: me) in their process of self-discovery.

Yes, I think she is testing you. How are you thinking of responding?

If I respond at all, it will be civil and to the point. The fact is, I can't know what exactly her motives and thoughts are. At this point it could go either way and I'm not interested in playing that game with her (despite the fact that I'm clearly asking for people's interpretations on here ) She may just be acknowledging something, she may be attempting to find a reason to contact me (I certainly have done that enough in my life..), she could be doing something more nefarious. Its a world of unlimited possibilities. But, if I do respond it will be to the point and I will treat her as if she is being honest and sincere.

I agree she's testing you. Part of me suspects that she's hoping to see if you're moving on to appease her guilt. I think she's under the impression that she can just be "off the hook" which would infuriate me...

Yeah, I can see this perspective and I can understand the potential for that. On the other hand she might be trying to prove that I am too angry at her for her to communicate. The fact that this came the day after my L received the D complaint (which I still haven't received.. W's L filed it in late june) seems a touch odd, but I don't want to go down a pointless speculation. Technically she is 'off the hook' - I can't control her and certainly the notion of doing 'the right thing' as a 'married woman' is something she may not be entertaining at this point. I don't think there is a lot I can do about any of that. Although I really hate to see all this produce go to waste.. Maybe I'll just bring it with me.

Even if she hopes you are moving on so that she does not feel guilty, her happiness should not be tied to your happiness.

Dark is dark. It is counter intuitive to not respond when they are being nice. We often find it is the counter intuitive action that gets the best results.

She could be curious...

Did she ask you a question?

Do you mean that her happiness shouldn't be reliant upon my happiness, or that my happiness shouldn't be contingent upon hers?

She didn't directly ask me a question.

WRT to Dark, I guess part of it is that I'm not even sure that I'm dark or not. So much of it seems to be just the way the cookie crumbled - no direct communication, so dark by default. I never fully chose "I'm going to 'go dark'" or anything like that - its just apparently the way things have ended up.

I don't want to fall into the trap of 'silent treatment' or 'shunning' as those seem too punitive to me. I have acted punitively in the past and its something I'm trying to get away from as best I can.

The truth is, I would like nothing more than to be able to share all of the experiences I am going to have with her. We've been each other's best friend for almost a decade (well.. she hasn't been such a good friend lately..) and I've always valued sharing these experiences together. So, its probably one of the hardest things for me, not to be able to share all these

AND I got an e-mail from her while composing this reply. It's a question regarding a bill, but also says

"It's been a while since we last spoke.. I hope you're well"

It's been 12 days according to my phone. Not really an epic length of time, but when we were married I don't know that we went more than 24 hours w/o speaking except once or twice when she has been in Europe.

If it was a friend sending this to me, I'd think it was a thoughtful thing to say. When its a likely STBX - doesn't seem to ring so pleasantly.

[~ kd ~]

I am thinking the former. If you are happy... she'll be happy... She might like that idea, but it's not likely to benefit her long term... but that's not your problem.

Dark is for you. So if you're going dark, it's not punitive to her. It's to maintain your sanity and detach... thus ejecting yourself from the roller coaster.

I get the "sharing intel with friend" thing... Like you said, her friendships been... not so much... lately.

But, now she's being all nice. Now she's being curious. Hoping you have a good time and now hoping you're doing well...

I asked if the first was a question. It was not. This second is also not a question. As such... there's no "answer".

If you want to respond... give it a bit... if the next one is a question... answer it... maybe...

[aeolianchaos]

If you want to respond... give it a bit... if the next one is a question... answer it... maybe...

We'll see. I'm not getting back to her this evening. I just don't want another surprise visit where I'm not really fully prepared to deal with her. I do have to get myself 'lined up' before I can really interact effectively w/ her at this point.


Anyways.. not a lot of other new stuff going on.

It's kind of funny, but I've gotten much more into the music I used to listen to while at the same time basically separated from the music I've been working on for the past decade. It's a nice change of pace, and I'm enjoying being a 'consumer' rather than 'producer' for a while.

I did read something really wonderful tonight and wanted to share it for anyone who is reading my thread and is interested in this kind of stuff.. its from Eckhart Tolle:

"In fact, doing is never enough if you neglect Being. The Ego knows nothing of Being but believes you will eventually be saved by doing. If you are in the grip of Ego, you believe that by doing more and more you will eventually accumulate enough "doings" to make yourself feel complete at some point in the future. You won't. You will only lose yourself in doing. The entire civilization is losing itself in doing that is not rooted in Being and thus becomes futile"

[aeolianchaos]

Well, I decided not to respond to either the text or e-mail. Both can wait.

It is weird, and I know her first assumption will be that I am mad at her and refusing her communication. So perhaps I will respond in a few days and say that I had a great time and it was a wonderful experience. Is that a bad thing to say? Is it a jab? What if its true?

In the meantime, getting out of town early tomorrow and doing the family thing in a big way. Loaded up the iPod with a lot of tunes and I'm actually going to bring clean clothes with me this time(!) Really looking forward to it and at the same time, a little sad that W isn't going to share this experience. Too bad.

Applied for a job today - that is a huge 180 for me. H3ll, its a huge life change. I don't think I've ever applied for a job since I met my W (I've worked, just not in a 'wage earning' way.. mainly independent contracting). I'm still a little on the fence about this whole 'real job' thing, but this gig pays ok and I realized they actually offer benefits. That would be nice - at least until I can decide what I might want to do with my life - maybe it would cover some of my therapy visits.

Anyways - gotta pack. I'll check in sometime this weekend, I'm sure.

[~ kd ~]

If you tell her you had a great time, it's not a jab... if you MAKE SURE that it's true... So make sure you have a great time...

[wawinla]

A:

I'm glad you're getting away. Enjoy the weekend with family.

[aeolianchaos]

Had an incredible weekend - got out of town on time and almost no traffic along the way. Leaving tomorrow morning to head back to the 'real world.' Never enjoy that 'back to life, back to reality' sensation I get.

I got to see my entire immediate family (minus W) for the first time in about 8 months. I really focused on enjoying them and their company, and just the experience of being around people who were sincere. It was a great time and I'm very appreciative of how my relationship with my family and siblings has evolved over the past year.

If it weren't for the need to maintain a degree of anonymity on here, I'd share more because its an incredible story. But I think its safe to share that this past year I gained a B and SIL. That's vague enough, right? they are both awesome, BTW.

Being completely honest, there were many moments where I was a little bit grateful that W wasn't there this weekend. The way she has been for the past year+ has been so covertly hostile/aloof/insincere that I feel like it was just better w/o her. The conversation was open, honest, sincere, and flowed naturally. I feel like if she had been there, it would have been stifled and people would have picked up on her energy (apparently people HAD been picking up on it long before I figured it out..) and felt uncomfortable. So even though I do love her, I was happy to have the experience of such nice conversation and a good sense of being.

But also sad - to be around everyone else with their SO and be the 'odd man out' was a little discouraging. At times I was appreciating the way other people's relationships were - some partners so much like one another, some very different, and some somewhere in the middle. But all were there and truly present. And that was beautiful to me, and its something I know that I want in my life - someone who will be present, who will be known and allow themselves to be loved for who they are, and love others for who they are. And that made me, on occasion, feel a little sad that right now its not something I'm having.

Not too bad though and ultimately, its still ok. I'm grateful to have the awareness and wisdom to recognize the beautiful qualities of these relationships. And I know that it is something I want and will have to create within my own.

I still haven't communicated with W or responded to her latest communication. Wouldn't mind saying 'Thanks! It was an amazing weekend!' But I think it is a little weird to txt someone back 7 days later. It isn't as if I'm that busy.

Met with a vocational counselor and discovered: I am still who I am. At least in terms of interests, abilities, and skills. I think that a strategy of embracing this is probably better than fighting it. There is a lot to it and its kind of a gnarly issue for me. I know that this isn't a job/career support board, but for me I think it's important find a vocation that reflects my skills and strengths and interests.

[ESN]

Welcome back! Glad it was great, and you sound great too! I LOVE this post. This is how I feel all the time. It's a relief to be without BF and sad as I am that things aren't working and we have a D together, that energy is just draining and exhausting me. I too am looking for that same kind of present and accepting R. I think appreciating it in others is a great trait and will allow it to come to you more easily (at least according to Abraham-Hicks :)) ...

I'm getting certified to life coach and the book I am reading now (by Martha Beck) talks about the social self and the essential self and basically coaching encourages that essential self - sounds smart to take that really seriously and not fight it as you said...

[aeolianchaos]

Well.. what goes up must come down.

This morning was rough - nothing directed/communicated to W, but just feeling mopish, self-pitying, and a very low sense of worth. Looking for a job is just straight-up disheartening and I have no real network to speak of in this city - I never knew I was going to need to create one when I got here!

It gets ugly because I then start to mix up my need for survival/income/etc w/ the 'partnership' I had with my W, and how the position I'm in is in many ways a result of the way we had been living and moving from city to city in support of her success while I put my own needs on the back burner. Then I think about how much SIMPLER it would be to JUST change careers or JUST be getting divorced rather than both at once. And then it confuses things -- do I want her back just because it would be easier? To what extent does that play a role in things? Is it just about avoiding more change or is it just about loving her? How would I act differently if I had a job I was going to and felt a little more financially stable? How would I act differently if she was here and I didn't have to deal w/ both of these things at once? What would that feel like?

I think there is a part of me that fears the ugliness that may come from requesting spousal support, and another part of me has compassion for the 'pain' it will cause her. But I also feel like I need to be compassionate towards myself and recognize that I am also experiencing pain and I am in a far worse earning-position than she is at the moment, as we moved here (and the place before here, and the place before that..) for HER gig and I didn't have anything going for me. Another part wonders if it would be just another nail in the coffin...

Is it even realistic to think that she would really change enough for me to feel good about our marriage again? I know its a possibility, but is it at all a probability? What would motivate her to change? Is she really going to look inside herself and say "Holy cr@p I've been a really self-absorbed person!" When she has a support system (family) and people enabling her (friends) to do the things she is doing..?

What motivation does she actually have other than the possibility that she a) recognizes that I am not the person she was framing me as in her head for the past year or b) recognizes that her behavior is hurting her and getting in the way of a more authentic happiness?

Right now what I know is that she filed for D, and has only communicated in the briefest of terms. I know that we haven't spoken in nearly three weeks. As much as I am often okay with it, there is also times when I'm not okay with it and really miss her and having that companion. Even if its been kind of imaginary in some ways this year.. We never went a day w/o talking to each other for almost 9 years and its tough not to have that in my life right now.

I feel like I should respond/acknowledge my
W's email/text at some point soon. She might not even get them as I'm pretty sure she is on a vacation w/ her S this week. My intention would be to say "Thanks.. I had a great time and B/SIL are wonderful people."

I don't want to shut a door by just not responding.

Got back into town and W had left a cable bill in my mailbox and had removed the Change of address sticker from it. Continuing this weird thing of 'hiding' from me. I still find that a little insulting even if I know its her own drama.

[~ kd ~]

Man, chaos...

You SO remind me of me... 10+ years ago...

You're smart, you're hyper aware, you're sensitive, you have so much going for you... and you're... stuck...

Two words for you, my friend:

Live Life

Yes, I am here. So one might wonder, how did that help me?

I can honestly say, it was once I realized and started doing that, everything got so much... clearer...

My "reason" / "excuse" is I gave up... somewhere along the line...

I've recognized that and now, I am on my way to doing something about it again!

There is no easy path. There is just the path we create. Just because something seems like it is easy, does not make it so.