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[RedNailPolish]

Yes I feel very stupid right now. Everyone had already told me to stop talking to my MIL but like you 25, I also thought that perhaps I had it wrong and she was an ally. Seems that she is only when it suits her. Who knows what her intention really is. I still believe that it is good but perhaps she goes about it the wrong way???

H confessed last Christmas that he kissed a girl at work once. This happened a couple of years ago before S3 was born. It was the same scenario, felt sorry for this girl at work. She was hopeless and he was trying to be the hero. I have told him this before but not sure he has really taken it in.

I forgave him for this and we moved on, until this happened 3 months ago. I have since found out that they started their emotional affair since December last year. She knew he was married with a child and didnt care. Infact she went after him. Ive read alot of their emails & sms. She is bipolar and from what I can tell has BPD (borderline personality disorder) but I am not a professional, I am only going by her actions and what H has told me. In his own admissions she is crazy. But he too is obviously crazy for being with her.

We've been married for nearly 7 years. Been together for 11 yrs. I was 20 when we first met. He suffered depression but I didnt know it at the time. He was in trouble when I first met him. Failing uni and didnt have much money. I pretty much got his life into order and have encouraged & supported him to who/where he is now. I helped pay for his accomodation, bought text books, bought him a car, food etc. As you can imagine we became very co-dependant.

In a way I saved him. So maybe he wants to do the same to someone else?

[RedNailPolish]

Major set back.

H and I went bowling with S3.

H accused me of interfering with his relationship with MIL. He said why do u call her. I said for support. And he said well maybe you should talk to your own family or counsellor. I said MIL called me too. He asked when the last the last time she called? I said I couldn't remember. He said that's because she doesn't. All this felt so hurtfull. I said well she texts me too. He said that's only to make sure you're ok. I started getting upset.

Things got really bad after that. We ended up having a
BIG fight. Lots of things said. He ends it by saying he's done. I say I don't care and we go our seperate ways.

Bad nite.

I will not be contacting MIL from now on. If she contacts I will tell her I will not speak to her about H. Yes for real this time. I'm done with that avenue. I still love her of course but discussing this situation with her has done more harm than good.

I am going to go dark on H. No more outings from now on. I really need to heal. I am not in a good mental state ATM. H said some really awefull things to me and I'm very upset tonite.

[25yearsmlc]

you can tell mil without anger

that you are going to keep the R issues you and H have, between you and H... You are "sure" she'll understand...

and go to your own family/friends for support. It really is safer

[Walking]

Hey Red

Sorry about last night. That is tough. Listen, you guys have had fights before and you will again. Give him time to cool down and please, please, please get that man out of your head. Detach.

On the MIL issue, ask yourself if subconsciously you've been using that relationship to try to get her to do your dirty work for your. You think to yourself ... "I want him to know/think/feel X way ... so if I say Y to MIL that might get back to him and that may influence his behaviour to be/do/say X?"

One of the big learning’s for me over the past few years is that I have no right to do things designed to manipulate someone to get our way. I used to do it all the time. If I just write him an e-mail and tell him such and such - that will make him do/think/be whatever it was I want.

You strike me as a super organised get-the-job-done kind of woman. (‘cause us Aussie chicks are!!) You are strong and you have good skills - so it's easy for you to get your way in most relationships and at work? Yeah? You've been trading on that all your life (it takes one to know one!!). The lesson for you here, is that this is out-of-your-control.

You said a few days ago

In a way I saved him. So maybe he wants to do the same to someone else?

that's a pretty big call .... I wonder how he feels about you thinking that you "saved" him ... from what? Himself? And was that an entirely altruistic exercise in organising him to get his life sorted out? Was that about him … or was it about you making him in to the man/partner you wanted him to be.?

Ask yourself too, why you would have hooked up with someone who needed that much support to making him into “husband” material. You know there are heaps of men out there who don’t need a woman to come along and mother them to get their life sorted out – so what was it about you that made you chose a man who needed all that support?

Have you read “Women who love too much” by Robin Norwood? If not, pick it up. It’s a good read and you’ll learn a lot about yourself.

You also said something about him snogging another girl a few years ago and you “told” him what that was all about. Red, I do that all the time too. I sprout my “opinion” or “analysis” of a situation as though it’s the word of God and close the book on it. Finished. I’m learning that just because I’ve declared or “told” everyone what I think – doesn’t make it so!!! Everyone has to make their own learning and analysis for themselves. We can’t and really, really should never, think we can do that for them.

Girl, DETACH. DETACH. And when you’ve done that, DETACH some more.

Thinking of you. ((Hugs)) V

[RedNailPolish]

Virginia, Im an aweful mess today

Because of what H told me a few weeks ago (i hope this works between us. im trying to extracate myself from a difficult situation. and his plan to get himself away from crazy OW) I feel like he's lied to me again. i feel dooped and so very stupid.

i do love him still. and obviously and it is obvious isnt it, i have not detached. i go to bed thinking about him and our situation. I wake up during the night thinking about him and our situation. i wake up, have a shower, jump on the train, go to work and here i am still thinking about him and our situation. it is consuming me.

i try, i really do try not to let it. i try all sorts of distractions, i go to the gym, i eat lunch with friends, i watch movies, play with my son, go to clubs, play tennis, go for a walk, clean my room, organise my clothes, go shopping........but he pops into my head every time. though not as often as he use to.

"On the MIL issue, ask yourself if subconsciously you've been using that relationship to try to get her to do your dirty work for your. You think to yourself ... "I want him to know/think/feel X way ... so if I say Y to MIL that might get back to him and that may influence his behaviour to be/do/say X?"

I dont think i have been using my relationship with her to get her to do my dirty work. Ive been honest & upfront about what i want - which is to reconcile. If you know my MIL you cannot really get her to do what you want. She is a very strong woman with her own opinion and will do what suits her. Although I am somewhat confused because she has always stated to me that she is "still on my side" and would like to see H and I work things out. And she has told me consistently that H and I will work it out but it will just take time. But H told me last night that his mum was neutral to the whole thing. Why would she say that to him?

"that's a pretty big call .... I wonder how he feels about you thinking that you "saved" him ... from what? Himself? And was that an entirely altruistic exercise in organising him to get his life sorted out? Was that about him … or was it about you making him in to the man/partner you wanted him to be.?"

Im now questioning how he trully feels. He himself has admitted that I saved him. He acknowledged it to everyone and seemed happy that he had such a loving, supportive and devoted wife. I feel like now he doesnt need me Ive been discarded.

"Ask yourself too, why you would have hooked up with someone who needed that much support to making him into “husband” material. You know there are heaps of men out there who don’t need a woman to come along and mother them to get their life sorted out – so what was it about you that made you chose a man who needed all that support?"

To be honest when we first met he wasnt my type. I was going out with someone else and he knew that. There was a physical attraction. But I felt like something was not right about him and his situation. He made things out to be rosier than they were. By the time I found out the truth I had already fallen for him. He was charming and there was a lot of physical chemistry. He wasnt like the other guys id been out with. So when I found out he was failing uni and had basically no where to live, I came to his rescue. It wasnt easy as I was working full time and studying part time. I even took on another job so we could go on holiday. But I did it because I loved him. And he told me the same.

I always felt that he could achieve so much more. He is smart and a very hard worker. I just wanted to give him the opportunity to succeed. He did all the hard work, I was his support system. I dont think Ive ever tried to change him. Infact I know I havent. He always wanted to be where he is now. He just went about it the wrong way.

"You also said something about him snogging another girl a few years ago and you “told” him what that was all about. Red, I do that all the time too. I sprout my “opinion” or “analysis” of a situation as though it’s the word of God and close the book on it. Finished. I’m learning that just because I’ve declared or “told” everyone what I think – doesn’t make it so!!! Everyone has to make their own learning and analysis for themselves. We can’t and really, really should never, think we can do that for them."

Yes Im learning that I do this too. Feeling stupid now. Trying very hard to keep opinions to myself and no more analysing. Zipping my lip and opening my ears.

As for detaching, it is a work in progress. Lots of photos of my H around mums house. And every night S3 watches videos of him and H on my iphone. It makes me so sad.

[Walking]

Hi Red

I've been thinking of you and just read this response. How are you doing today?

In relation to maintaining the relationship with MIL and using that as support, I do know what you mean. I guess what you've really been using her for is validation because she has said she's on you side (and she should be on your side, life is going to get harder for her to see her grandchild etc if you guys don't figure something out).

When our self confidence (and rest of our world) is shattered, we do look for people to validate our choices and views, however, MIL has probably out worn her usefulness because regardless of how much she cares about you - H is her son. She'll always have to prioritise him and his feelings ... that's just the way it is.

Now ... detaching ... Detaching is very tricky and I think the reason that its tricky is because you really have to get to the place in your head where you really don't have an investment in if he comes back or not. The way I do it is to genuinely stop myself visualising a future where I reconcile with the particular man I'm trying to detach from (I've had quite a lot of experience in this particular skill in the past 5 years!!! lol). When you think of him, and get that warm feeling in you and that hopeful feeling that goes something like "if I just don't call him, he'll figure out how much he misses me and then we'll start to rebuild" you stop yourself and remake the picture so that you see yourself as you want to be, doing things you want to do, and him calling - and you taking the call just as if it were any old friend/aquaintance calling. Take the magic out of him.

i try, i really do try not to let it. i try all sorts of distractions, i go to the gym, i eat lunch with friends, i watch movies, play with my son, go to clubs, play tennis, go for a walk, clean my room, organise my clothes, go shopping........but he pops into my head every time. though not as often as he use to.

Great start, and 2 great clues in that sentence about how to detach more strongly.

In my very humble, but reasonably well considered , opinion, GAL is all about filling up the space in your life you devote to loving your H, because we need to focus that love on ourselves when they are out having their life crisis.

Sometimes I think of my life, and how much time I spend working on or thinking about particular parts of it, like a pie chart ... you know, the chart should have good and accurate representation of my energies spread appropriately between my spouse, children, extended family and friends, work,spirituality, recreation, passions/hobbies etc. Do you know what I mean? wish we had the technology to draw/illustrate!!)

When you GAL, you kind of redistribute the section of the pie that was devoted to your spouse, amongst all the other sections. You know?

So, when you use the word "distraction" in the same context of getting a life, I think you are half way there. In some ways GAL is about distracting yourself, or tricking your brain that if you are busy on one thing you won't have head space for the other. But the other half of getting a life is about genuine redistribution of interest and engagement in other parts of your life. Some people find themselves re-engaging in an old hobby or interest they had that somehow slipped down their priorities list, or re-joining a group they once belonged to, or joining a group or starting to do something they have always wanted to do but have never done. Itt's not about distracting yourself until he comes back - it's about remembering or learning that we become more healthy people when we have our own interests/passions/life. It's not healthy to get our life from our spouse.

The other clue is that horrible obsessive-thought feeling. He's just in your head all the time? You need to give yourself permission, or even a direction, that you will not give him the space in your head. What I do is visualise a spotlight. When he pops in to my head I literally take the spotlight off him and move it to an image of me. It doesn't take long, with consistant, disciplined effort, to change that habit of giving him head space - a couple of days.

Keep at it. Have a good day girl.

[RedNailPolish]

Thank you Virginia for your post. I will respond shortly.

But for now I'm just a little too mad to be clear.

H was once again late in picking up S3. Didn't apologise. Turned up an hour late. I had organised to meet a friend and was quite inconvenienced. I was a little annoyed when he turned up. And of course he had to put the baby seat in the car again as he takes it out whenever OW is in there. Makes me so mad that he does this. I mean why does he need to take it out when there is only two of them in the car. OW probably doesn't like the reminder of my son.

Anyway, after they leave I too head off. Then half an hour later I receive a text from H:
"Sorry I was late. I hope you didn't miss anything important. I think we need to discuss travel arrangements. I don't think it is fair I have to make both trips. It would be good if you could pick him up once in a while. Anyway have a nice weekend"

WTF!!! He's complaining because he has to pick up his son and drop him back home!? WTF!!! He sees him twice a week at max and from next week it will only be once a week and he's complaining.

Talk about passive aggresive behaviour. I'm sorry followed by a kick in the head followed by have a nice day!?

I'm so mad!!!! Grrrrr

[RedNailPolish]

I've noticed a change in H lately. When we first seperated he was give give give. He said you take S3, the car, the money etc. Now he wants to take take take. He has become so aggressive.

I'm not sure what to make of this. He's really starting to push my buttons. I really much preferred the "passive" H.

How do I handle this? At this point all I want is for him to go away.

[RedNailPolish]

I really hate to admit this but I have even found myself admitting that he's a jerk. I realise he's going through a "crisis" but if he is well enough to cope at work then he is well enough to cope with me. Right?

[Walking]

Because when someone first leaves, they feel guilty and will make all sorts of promises etc so they don"t feel so bad about what a d!ck they are being. As time goes by they become more comfortable about their decision and develop a sense of entitlement.

It's one of the reasons it's risky to "stand" too long without getting formal financial and custody agreement in place ... walkaways seem to become less generous and accommodating as time goes by.

Red, make sure you do protect yourself financially and in relation to custody arrangements. You can always wind those things back when things improve between u and h - but u need to make sure you are covered in the meantime.

If you haven't already, have a look at the Australian govt child support agency site (www.csa.gov.au) ther are some good resources there to assist in making agreements on custody etc.

Have a good sunday girlfriend.

V