WAW - true or false?

[rh24]

First post! I first bought DB several years ago while trying to work 'solo' to improve my marriage. Got things stabilized, but things were never 'good' since and almost 3 months ago (3rd week of March) my wife dropped the bomb.

I had a lot of frustration and resentment toward her because I've gone to individual counseling - now for the 3rd time in the past 8 years. I admit, I definitely have things to work on - but I really resented her unwillingness to engage in the process as a couple.

There's still a shadow of that resentment under the surface, but at this point I am committed to doing whatever I can do to save our marriage.

Two of my biggest problems have been: 1) The 'fight or flight' response - I would ALWAYS react negatively to any perceived attack or criticism and over the years this really damaged our relationship. The individual therapist I've been working with for 6 months now has helped immensely and I have significantly improved my awareness and handling of these situations, although I'm certainly not perfect. 2) My had a 'faulty belief' that 'Dad working around the house meant he was either 'whipped by mom' or 'avoiding mom', this is due to the pattern with my parents growing up. Along with this, I just realized in April that my wife's #1 'Love Language' is Acts of Service. So for years, every time I neglected doing things around the house she basically took it as me saying "I don't love you." That was a breakthrough realization for me which I have done a major 180 on!

After my wife dropped the bomb, as many do, I fell completely apart - crying, begging, pleading. I got her to go to ONE counseling session with an Imago Therapist, but then she wouldn't go to the 2nd session and that's been it for joint counseling. The day after the one session my wife told me "I never want to have sex with you again." It has been 13.5 months since we last had sex.

After hearing all that, and when she refused to go back for further counseling, I panicked. I called a couple of female friends who are part of married couples we're closest to seeking advice and also hoping for a little support since I know they value marriage. My wife mainly talks to her mom, who divorced her dad right after my wife left home for college; and she talks to her older sister, who hates me pretty much. And the only other person she's 100% open with is her best friend from 'back home'. They all 'support' her, but not in a 'valuing marriage' kind of way!

On April 26th, my wife was at that point highly suspicious that I'd been talking to people 'behind her back' and her distrust of me and feelings of being controlled by me (a MAJOR hot button for her) were at their peak. That morning she told me "I'm pretty much waiting until summer when the kids are out of school to do something (meaning file for separation/divorce).

She indicated she's just not happy and feels like she can't be herself and do what she enjoys doing.

She then talked about how 'secretive' I am and asked if I've been going to my therapist. I said yes that I've been going every week (true). She expressed frustration that I "just don't communicate" and that I should talk to her about the fact that I'm going to my therapist. I very calmly replied, "You know, that was a very specific discussion with my therapist. I said that I wanted to talk to you about my sessions, but my therapist said that is too much about doing it for 'her' when the focus needs to be on doing it for 'me' - and based on that I should NOT initiate a discussion, but that if you were interested and asked about it that I could talk about it. You've never been interested enough to ask, so that's why it hasn't been discussed."

She then said "I talked to (friend) and said that I thought I could tolerate you, but she said 'You shouldn't have to TOLERATE your husband.'" And she also said "You're not a bad person." Which is a MAJOR upgrade from 3 weeks ago when she said "You're just not a nice person."

We were talking a bit about my therapy sessions and I said "I wish I would have some across this therapist years ago and that I could have recognized the things I know now much earlier. I would give anything to never have hurt you." (I said with a very honest tear in my eye). I then said "I have changed, and I continue to work on things and making changes. My hope was that it would be good for OUR relationship, but if it ends up that it just makes the NEXT relationship better, then I guess that's good too."

To which she replied "Great! I get the 13 'bad' years."

I was glad to see the regret/remorse in her face with that - I think it really made her think. IT WAS A HUGELY EMPOWERING, CONFIDENCE BUILDING MOMENT FOR ME...SINCE THAT STATEMENT, THINGS APPEAR TO HAVE SHIFTED SOMEWHAT.

I also at some point said something along the lines of "If you don't like me, then I agree, I don't want to be with you either. I deserve more than that."

I also shared with her my breakthrough in the 'work around the house' faulty belief.

Since that time, I have been focused on 'working on me', being more confident, trying to make being in the house together fun for her and the kids (S12 and D10). Things have been generally positive, I have 'almost' completely backed off my pursuing behaviors - right after the bomb I would hold her in bed at night and be 'clingy'. For 2 months now I have completely stopped any and all 'romantic touching' and stopped saying ILY. I realized we were in a major fuser-isolator pattern and that my pursuit was just pushing her further away so I have 'changed my steps in the dance'. The only 'pursuing' behaviors are that I am trying to engage her in positive verbal discussions, which can be really hard at times - face-to-face goes ok roughly 50-60% of the time. On the phone is always a pain, for some reason she's VERY short with me on the phone - one word answers and quick to hang up, so I've cut that out for the most part for now.

We are still in the same house, still sleeping in the same bed. I know she harbours a TON of resentment toward me. She is a MAJOR Injustice Collector and literally has lists of all my 'injustices'. After getting my head on straight in early April I have addressed those injustices much more constructively as she's raised them a few times - each time I did NOT get defensive as I majorly did in the past (typically going into 'fight' reactivity) and I acknowledged her feelings, admitted my wrongdoing and apologized very sincerely. Mind you, these injustices ARE all valid and I really do wish I could take them back. I just hope I can keep removing the wall between us brick-by-brick.

I keep telling myself, as I've been advised, that it's a marathon, not a sprint.

The one big problem I have right now is that 6 weeks ago she told me "I'm pretty much waiting until school is out to 'do something'." Well, school has been out for almost two weeks now. Based on that comment, I keep thinking "Today is the day she's going to talk to an attorney." It's a real energy drain! Last weekend though she mentioned how a house down the street from us sold quickly and that she'd like to put our house up for sale so we can move into a neighboring school district, which we have talked about doing for a while. To me that's kind of sending a different message from "I'll be talking to an attorney very soon." But I try NOT to 'interpret' and just take things at face value.

Lastly, a few times a week, my wife gets on my personal laptop when I'm not home and checks my Facebook account and FB messages, and my personal email (inbox and sent). I know this from checking my browser history and I can see what's been accessed and when. I feel like she doesn't trust me (that's pretty obvious), but I wonder if there's an opportunity for a positive discussion to come out of this if I confront her?

Anyway - I know - TOO LONG OF A POST! I just wanted to get perspective...IS she a WAW? Or just REALLY on the verge of becoming one? I feel like she has some kind of 'master plan' as I know she's talked a ton with her mom and sister about getting a divorce and she has some certain things that she wants to happen to make it possible, like she wants her mom to move to our area from out of state and she wants to change jobs.

In part due to my 'moderate panic' over the fact that should could be going to an attorney any day, I started phone coaching with Dotty on Monday - just an FYI.

I just don't know if I'm doing THE BEST THING right now, or if I should be doing anything else. I don't know if I should engage her in any discussions or ask if she'd like to participate in relationship coaching. We live close enough that we could probably swing a 90 minute session with Michele in Boulder, but my wife would throw up a roadblock over the cost for sure - she used that as a major excuse against couples counseling.

Thoughts? Guidance?

[zero12]

I don't know that there is some threshhold one crosses to become a WAW, but I suspect your real question is if she has reached the point of no return. That would require us to know your wife very well, because she's the only one who really knows. Based on her actions, I'd say she has one foot out the door, but she's not completely gone. Don't be surprised if she does move forward with D or S, but don't stop working on it either. Good luck.

[rh24]

So after much calm, last night a flare up and a BIG talk!

Yesterday I did not talk to W at all during the day. I get a call from her at 4pm asking if I'm picking up son from hitting lesson at 4:30 that she was dropping him off at. The day before I asked if she would mind taking him and I said that 'if it would help, I could probably leave work in time to pick him up if she wanted me to' - that was all that was said. So when she asked if I was picking him up, I calmly answered 'No, I cannnot - I could have if I'd known earlier.'

She KNOWS I work 45 minutes away and she KNOWS she did not communicate with me any further on the matter. I handled it well - normally in the past I would remind her of EXACTLY what I said and how she dropped the ball by not asking for help sooner, but that was the 'old' me!

I could feel a little 'chillyness' over the phone, but nothing major. Then our son had a baseball game at 6pm, I arrived basically at 6:01pm and saw that W had 2 chairs set up where her and MIL sat with no room for me to get a chair and sit with them. Given that, plus the earlier 'chillyness', I stopped and talked with one of the other dads who is a friend of mine for a bit before I walked over to greet W, MIL and D. I said hello and W ignored me, so I said "Hello [full first name]", she then said hello back. I was BSLI for a few minutes, but felt the chill, so I went back over with my friend and sat. Periodically I would get up and go talk to W about events during the game, especially as our son was involved.

After the game she just left and went home without saying goodbye. One of the other dads invited some of us over for a beer as the game was played at a field in our neighborhood. I told my son to tell my wife where I was going and that I wouldn't be gone too long and I watched my son walk the few houses down the street back home.

I got home around an hour later and W was not happy. I was being BSLI and she just said "This is not working, I'm not happy and you're just acting like everything is ok." So my son did NOT tell W where I went, he just came home and didn't say a word, leaving her to ask. She then criticized me not calling to let her know what I was doing.

She starts saying again how she's not happy and that she 'needs to do something' and that it pisses her off that I just 'act like everything is fine'. Initially I didn't really react to that. Then she pressed me, "So you don't have anything to say?"

I responded with "I'm just focused on making the changes I need to 'make a better me' - that's where my energy is going and if you need to 'do something' then that's up to you."

She said "OK then, that tells me all I need to know." Then she said "You know it would be nice if you could just talk from the heart, for real, instead of reciting what your therapist tells you or following the exact steps outlined in a book." Then she rolled over to go to bed.

I heard in her message (my translation): Would you just talk and share what your thinking/feeling because I don't like your whole BSLI/PMA act - it seems disrespectful like you assume everything is just fine when it's not.

I took that as a clear sign that I could not afford to just go silent - that she needed to hear something 'real' from me. So I 'went for it' saying a lot of what I was really feeling - here are some highlights:

- She asked me if I was happy. I told her that our situation was bigger than just answering that question, that that was way too much of an oversimplification. That there's a LOT at stake and that I am focused on the big picture and the long haul so whatever I'm feeling right now is not going to distract me from that.

- I told her that I am NOT 'acting like everything is ok', but that I have made a choice to be happy with what I have each day. I told her I'm treating each day as the last day we might be together and that I am just appreciating every minute of it from day to day.

- I told her I KNOW that I hurt her. That I now know what the faulty beliefs and reactive behaviors were and that I HAVE fixed them and continue to improve myself - again, in the hopes that it will help our R, but if it just helps the next R then that will be ok.

- I told her that I already 'let her go' and see our 'past marriage' as dead. That I still choose her and want to build something new and better than what we had.

- That I apologize for the hurt I caused her in the past and that it IS in THE PAST, and that I OWN IT, and I know it's not something she can just get over quickly, but that I am committed to doing everything in my power to make up for my past mistakes until the day I die.

- I told her that I have been trying to respect her and give her space and that I hate like hell not being able to touch her or hold her or say ILY.

- I told her I realized that I was the one responsible for my own happiness and that it's not HER responsbility and that since making that realization I have made that choice to be happy, and to be positive and that I'm working every day to improve myself.

- She complained that in the past I sat on the computer all the time and treated her and the kids badly. I replied "I no longer sit on the computer, I treat you well like I wish I had all these years and the same with the kids."

After all this she was crying a lot. I was very heartfelt and empassioned in my delivery, but even-keeled and confident.

I ended up asking her why she's been checking my Facebook and email - all she said was she didn't like some of the things I've been posting - which basically amounts to some good 'positive thinking' quotes that have been inspiring to me. I told her "If you're looking for a 'nail in the coffin' you will not find it. I am not doing anything that would be damaging to our R, ONLY things to improve myself." I know there's more to it than that, otherwise she wouldn't be checking my FB messages and sent email.

She responded to my comment about her not being responsible for my happiness by saying that's where she was starting several months ago when she would just go work out, make plans to go out with friends, etc. This morning I followed up on that and said that I thought she might have misunderstood me - I told her MY definition of her not being responsible for my happiness meant that we would certainly 'do our own thing', but in the end we would also put energy into our marriage, that I did NOT see it as 'living separate lives as roommates under the same roof'.

She complained that she 'had been ok' trying to 'do her own thing', but that since I talked to 3 of our friends that that is all ruined for her now, that she doesn't feel comfortable and she's not happy. [RANT: This is stupid to me, getting a D won't change that! I apologized for that once already and I reminded her last night of that apology and that I wouldn't be apologizing again for that.]

At one point after talking about how I had 'let her go' and was 'not pursuing her' she did confirm saying "I do need space."

I also asked her "What is ONE thing I could do that would help move our R in a positive direction?" She referred back to our ONE couples therapy session where the therapist basically ended the session by asking her the same thing and she replied "I don't know. I don't know if there IS anything." The funny thing is - as a result of our exchange I heard at least 3 different, concrete things I CAN do to minimize her fear and to restore her hope.

This morning I also told her "I know I'm the last person you'd take any advice from right now, but I would think that after seeing the changes I KNOW you've seen in me that you might consider going to see a therapist for yourself." She didn't react. She would SO benefit from that, but I know I can't push that.

I would LOVE to get her to read the 1st Chapter of 'Divorce Remedy' because I think it PERFECTLY summarizes all the things that are
messed up with our situation, but I'm sure as soon as I were to ask that would become the #1 item on her 'Things to NEVER do, EVER' list.

OK - so where to from here? What did I do well? Where did I screw up? (I know there was some pursuit in my comments, but I felt she
needed to hear something 'real and from the heart', so there it was!)

Hopefully she's not calling an attorney today! How do I react if/when she does?!

[zero12]

You did very well. Picking up on the her wanting to hear how you feel is a big thing. Listening yourself was also a big thing.

I would guess that she's distancing herself, because she doesn't trust these changes. It's also possible that she's torn about how she feels. I sometimes think my H would like me to reach out to him, but I can't. I care very much for him and would like to show affection, but I think I'd be leading him down the garden path and just confuse myself in the process. No matter what the reason, the coolness toward you is a protective instinct. It may be a means of protecting you as well as herself.

So, if she files, keep up the changes that you're making. You need to do this because consistency in the face of the worst will show your sincerity. If you get you're wife back you'll need those changes to make it the long haul. And if she still leaves, you'll need those changes to make yourself a better person. In the short term, keep your cool. If she really goes that far, then she probably needs it -- whether to start life anew, or to gain the clarity that comes with space, or to see what happens when she hits bottom and you aren't there to blame. This is someone you love, who is hurting and making decisions about what she needs to do to survive. Detach. It's like that saying, "If you love something let it go."

Good luck.

[rh24]

Thanks zero - that's helpful!

OK - weekend update time.

After the 'pretty big' talk Thursday night, the weekend went quite well.

Friday night I got home, changed, then picked up D from softball practice and took her to her soccer game. W and MIL went separately. I was at one end of field talking to other parents, I noticed W and MIL had arrived and set up chairs so learning from my poor handling of the baseball game the day before I went straight up and talked to them and hung out for a bit. Then I saw another friend and went to talk to him for a bit before returning. Mostly watched the game with W and MIL and all was good.

Got home and we went to bed early since Friday was an 'up at 4:30am' day and D had to be at softball at 7am Sat morning. There was no further R or 'situation' talk that night between W and me - just normal stuff.

Saturday was a busy day - D had 3 softball games, S had 2 - first game at 8am, last game at 7pm. We had 'overlap' for one game, I went to S game. During that game he had a pretty bad error because he totally swiped at a groundball, looked afraid, he's better than that - normally in the past I would have 'put my foot in his butt', but instead I went to talk to him and tried to be positive, encourage him and pump him up.

One of the other parents I was sitting next to observed the whole thing - she said that was great. Next inning, S makes an awesome play in the field, then leads off the next inning with a laser shot double. Same parent reinforced to me the positive result of my positive reinforcement.

So at the 7pm game, W and MIL were there. We were sitting next to same parent. At one point she brought up to W how great S did in response to my positive reinforcement. She then said to my wife (about me), "Yeah, he's really growing as a person - that's awesome." [I always had a tendency to complain about whatever was going wrong within the game in the past - nobody could stand to sit near me!]

On Sunday, one more baseball game and two softball games. During last game of the day, W and I were talking about what we wanted to do for dinner and what work needed to be done around the house. W said "I need to go to the grocery store." I said "You could say 'we' need to go to the grocery store - if it would be better for me to go that's totally fine." She responded, "Well it's just that I've had to do for 13 years." [Big time 'revisionist history', but that was fine - I just wanted her to know that I'm there, I'm involved.]

W decided grocery trip could wait, we went out to dinner as a family, with MIL. At one point during the meal, one of the kids was talking negatively about something - kind of a 'glass half empty' thing. In response I said something like "You need to see the good result happening and believe in it and good things will happen. If you think positive thoughts, good things will happen."

To that W chimed in, "Yes, that's your dad's new philosophy." (or something like that). She did not seem to say it sarcastically.

Got home from dinner and I washed our cars with the kids while W and MIL did a blitz cleaning job inside. Then took dog for a walk with W and MIL - it was good. Then back home, finishing up laundry before hitting bed. Another full, busy day with a lot of good interaction.

This morning I got up first, switched over laundry and started last load, then emptied dishwasher. W got up and went to work out, I got ready and left for work before she got back. That was another learning from our R talk Thursday night - she doesn't like it when I don't leave early for work. She wants to see me be more work-focused, which I don't disagree with.

Lastly - I had a few added notes from our R talk Thursday night that I left out of that post:

- W commented about me doing work around the house now just pisses her off (because I didn't pull my fair share for so long). I told her I'm sorry she feels that way, but that I'm not going to stop doing the work because that's the right thing to do and I wish I had done it our entire marriage.

- Towards the end of the discussion, I suggested we sell the business, move to a slightly smaller house and have her not work (she has said many times she would like to just be able to stay home and not work) - I'll find a travelling job if it would help! She's always talking about how her sister's husband has to travel a lot and she thinks that's good for their R. Sis doesn't work.

- W talked about wanting a friend - I talked about TRYING to be a friend, but only getting one word answers back makes it hard!

- Her new business partner just got engaged to his long-time GF, GF's mother isn't in the best of health and he said he wanted GF's mother to know GF would 'be taken care of'. W started crying telling me that story. Her mom is in good health and very active, but she also wants her mom to know that she will be taken care of. Hopefully MIL seeing changes in me is making a dent in this one.

- W said she thought at beginning of our R that I would NEVER hurt her and she started crying big time upon saying this.

- She needed support from me last summer when she was going through her 'business divorce'. I said I SO wanted to, but I just didn't know how and I apologized and said I wish I could have that to do over.

[RockHead]

God that all sounds so familiar! One difference is that my WAW says she sees the changes I have made, but doesn't believe they'll last. Her IC has only solidified her commitment to seek a separation.

Another difference is that I'm further down the track. I finally agreed to let her make an appt with a mediator for this Thursday. 1.5 weeks ago I realized my GAL had worked, I was at peace with letting go and agreeing to a separation. She's been saying we'll have 50/50 shared custody, so I proposed that we keep the kids in the house (D11, S5) and we move in and out, possibly sharing a 1 BR for the off week too, as finances are pretty tight to afford a 2-3 BR apt for me + the mortgage and bills. Particularly a furnished short term, as we're talking about a 90 day separation to start.

I started DB coaching with Chuck last week, he confirmed that what I had been doing was right, and suggested some more things I could do. It's not easy. I'm still hopeful that we can re-kindle the relationship, but then this weekend one of her tests was, "you only stayed married to me for $". Yeah, right. We were poor as church mice 18 years when we married, 15 years since she was permanently disabled buy a fall which bought us a nice house, 2 kids... WTF?? But I know that's her testing me. The more she sees the positive changes, the harder she tests and lashes out, because those very changes conflict with her established position that I can't change, and she should move on.

Sunday she brought up a discussion of property settlement, re: the house, and I just kept saying, "We'll talk about it with the mediator, that's what she's for." Finally I had to leave the house rather than continue into a shouting match. W is terrified that I'll take any portion of the wheelchair accessible house in a D. My position is that I want her to stay in the house, but I can't start a new life with our kids if I have nothing. I went out and did something she had asked me to do earlier, spent some time talking with a friend by phone, and about 2 hours later she called and said our S wanted me to come home.

When I got home she was online, looking for a 1 BR or studio that we could share. Making the reality of a separation real was part of Chuck's coaching, so I guess that took!

It all stinks, it isn't what I want, and certainly isn't what I want for the kids, but I realized that if I kept resisting a sep, I would leave her no option but to file for D. Agreeing to the sep was a MAJOR 180 for me. When I told her I wanted her to be happy, and to make the mediator appt, her eyes were like saucers and her jaw hit the floor! A couple of days later, the big test/lash-out with the "you just stayed married to me for the $$".

It's funny how awareness of what's she's doing makes it so transparent!

[rh24]

I guess I'm feeling a little 'rollercoastery'. I guess I am seeing small positive signs. Even after our big talk Thursday night, and with me surprising myself by even initiating further discussion to clarifiy a few things on Friday morning - we had a pretty nice weekend.

For some reason I start feeling a little connection on the weekends, then it seems like Monday has us back to square one.

MILD RANT COMING:
Yesterday and this morning I find myself with 'less than helpful' thoughts - frustration that she's not willing to work on herself at all, feelings that if she's not the type of person who IS willing to work on herself at all do I really even WANT to be with her, feelings that there are a lot of factors that are keeping her on the fence like fear of telling the kids that makes me feel like maybe I should to on the offensive and drop a bomb back on her and either get things over with or motivate her to 'engage'. Those types of thoughts have been more prevalent the last 24 hours.

I just keep telling myself to chill and 'stay the course'.

[rh24]

So here's a new update:

This weekend is W's birthday. I arranged for a limo to take us and another couple gambling about an hour from home - about a five hour round-trip with 3 hours of fun gambling. That's been something that we've always had a lot of fun doing together. She's also been pretty stressed out about her work and all the stuff going on with the kids activities and stuff so I wanted to give her a fun, relaxing, 'nicer than usual' experience.

I've had this planned for almost two weeks. All I had told her was to keep the late afternoon to early evening clear on Saturday because I had something planned for her birthday. At dinner Sunday night, W was talking about how much she would like to go gambling soon and I was thinking "Yes, nailed it on the birthday plans!"

Last night on the way to son's baseball game, W says "I'm just too tired, I don't want to do anything on my bday, I just want x, y and z presents (all practical things) and to get some rest."

I was floored and very disappointed. I didn't react all that well, but I did WAY better than I would have in the past.

I got a chance to talk to MIL alone and I asked "Do you think she really means it? I just need to know if I have to cancel the limo - which will cost money and tell our friends 'nevermind'." I asked if maybe I should just tell her the plans and see what she wanted to do - MIL thought that was a good idea.

So I told W, here's what I had planned. She immediately said "A limo?! Have you met me? When have I ever wanted to get a limo?" Then I offered some alternate plans for the limo - to go out as a family for dinner using the limo. She didn't like that either. I said, "OK, I'll just cancel it, but there's a $99 fee since it's within two weeks." To which she says, "Great, I could have used that to buy X!". I replied, "Please don't turn this into a negative against me. I was trying to do something nice that I thought you would really enjoy."

Things were a 'tad' heated, but I maintained a fairly even-keel. I told W, listen "I just feel really disappointed because I put a lot of time and thought into this because I wanted you to have a really great birthday - I don't want to feel this way and it's not your fault - I'm just sharing how I feel."

After that she was a little cold for just a couple of minutes and I was thinking, 'OK, there is the nail in the coffin of our M'. But then I just went into 'positive' mode pretty straight away, and within minutes she was interacting with me in a very positive way for the rest of the night.

I was actually very surprised at how well the rest of the night went. The only thought I kept coming back to was that she was happy that I was able to share how I felt about something and then recover and go on about the evening as a nice, normal person.

When we got home it was late and we all were heading straight to bed. She got in bed first and I pulled a stool up next to the bed and I told her "I'm sorry that I felt frustrated and disappointed about changing your birthday plans, I just know that you've been working so hard lately and have had a tough time and I really wanted to try to make your birthday great. I understand that you're tired and that's fine, we'll do whatever you want to do."

To that she said "I do want to go gambling sometime, but it's just too much right now, I need a break."

I then rubbed her head slightly and told her "Good night."

In the morning I accidentally set the alarm 15 minutes too early. Normally that would be something she would slam me for. When I realized it I said "Oh, I'm sorry, I thought I had set it for Y." She replied very nicely, "Oh, that's ok." I was pleasantly surprised by that reaction.

We had a decent morning routine. Then when I got to work I checked my schedule and called her to let her know that I could take S to baseball tomorrow so she could try to get her mom into the doctor, which was one of her stress points for this week. She was appreciative and said 'Thank you.'

That's about it for now. I thought I handled the situation MUCH more productively than ever in the past. She seemed to react positively to it, but as always I know that's just my interpretation. Just last week she expressed the need to hear what I'm feeling, so by doing just that hopefully that will help to remove one of the bricks in the wall between us.

[sandi2]

I'm not sure which thread to jump in, but since your title is asking a question of your W being a true WAW or not....I'll land here. If you read Michele's article on the home page about the WAW Syndrome, it explains very well the WAW.

She doesn't have to actually leave, in order to fall into that category. A WAW has left the M "in her heart". She feel "done" with it.

What are you looking for here at DB? I saw where you were doing a lot of journaling. Does that seem to help?

[rh24]

Sandi - thanks for chiming in!

Yes, the journaling helps, but I was hopeful for a little more input around 'try this', 'stop doing that', you know - directional guidance.

I just had my 2nd phone coaching session with Dottie yesterday and that's been helpful.

Short anecdote: Yesterday morning as my W was leaving for work, I asked her for a hug as I had a business trip coming up and might not have seen her until my return (I hadn't booked my flight yet). She DID hug me, but also said "I'm just not there yet."

I took the 'yet' as a VERY encouraging sign that maybe her foot isn't as far out the door as it was before I started DBing!