What to do when nothing is working

[2stepboogie]

J3B

Agreed

How do you tell the difference?

You will know when it is right. You will just know.

How do you know, isn't it (or you) worthy of your best effort?

It absolutely worthy of your best efforts. If you love them you walk through fire for them.

Isn't the effort worth it regardless of the outcome?

The only sanity that I have been able to maintain is that I did give it my best efforts. Not just after but during also. It is the small amount of peace that I can build on.

[LauraOh]

I hope to chime in for the "it's worth it" cause.

I was here 7 years ago. Busted it that time and learned so, so, SO much. About him, about myself, my faults, my weaknesses, strengths.

Learned about spiritual gifts. Love languages. Abuse and what it does to adults. Learned how to handle my bitter mother. My imprisoned brother. My dying father.

Learned about detachment. Learned patience. Learned my favorite of all--forgiveness. I have come to embrace this crazy, rollercoaster, wildly wonderful thing called life. It didn't come with a manual. We get to figure it out all on our own.

I will never, never, EVER be sorry my H wanted a D 7 years ago. And that he went and filed in Aug. He has set my world upside down but....I have learned how to look at these things in a completely different way.

Another favorite--focus on the positives. So many, many gifts they give us. We can be better. Sometimes we can win them back, sometimes not. But always, we can be better.

[♪CS♪]

^^^^ Great stuff.

[liz_palmer]

Okay, so here's our typical day when he's home from working - we ran errands together, went grocery shopping together, came home and put groceries away together, made lunch together and then sat in the family room and watched some DVR'd shows he likes together. We discussed what to have for dinner and I got up to make it. He comes in to check on me to see if I need help, if I do - he helps, otherwise he goes back to family room. We cleaned up dinner together and packed his work bag together. When we went to bed last night I initiated some personal time, which he enjoys but won't yet initiate. When all was over he looked at me and said, "we've got to stop doing this." then chuckled. I responded with a laugh.

I will say that one of my 180's is the initiation of personal time (this was one of his complaints). Another one of my 180's is talking more and letting him know what I like/don't like. So I imagine his confusion is at an all time high right now.

Even though I didn't show it, he threw me for a loop when he said that last night. I wasn't sure what to think.

Liz

[Starsky309]

Actually, it's her. She calls and texts him and he takes the calls and responds to the texts - sometimes ALL DAY LONG! Literally. I have seen the phone bill. He' an over the road truck driver and she works at his terminal. So she calls him and texts him while he's on the road to the point where mutual friends have told me she neglects her two young children. (She has 3 kids by 3 different men).

Liz,

You're deflecting, and enabling your husband's disrespectful behavior by making excuses for him. It takes TWO to text (I'd be willing to bet that the texts and calls are back and forth, and at least 30-40% are his, am I correct?), and he's flaunting your boundary. What did you tell him would be the consequence if he violated your boundary?

When my brother's wife was having an affair a few years ago, she tried the same cr*p, texting right in front of him and their kids. He told her "I certainly hope that's not your boyfriend you're texting, from inside of our own home. That's incredibly disrespectful of me, our marriage and our kids. If you want to do that, take it outside."

And she did, texting for hours sometimes out there, even in the rain a couple of times.

Who pays for your husband's cellphone, his company or does it come out of your joint family funds?

If you don't learn to lay out and enforce boundaries, Liz, I'm afraid of what you're going to find going on in your home while you're in PA.

Starsky

[alamo76]

db - Michelle's message, especially the fourth paragraph about separated couples, totally connects with the thoughts I made today in my thread. Thanks!

[liz_palmer]

Just got back from a session with my therapist. She's our daughters therapist (daughter is bipolar) and she treats the whole family individually or together.

I took the DR book with me and asked her to read it and assist me on the path that the book talks about. She was totally open to it and as I explained what had occured over the last 5 weeks since he decided there was no hope for our relationship.

She gave me some ideas for when he drops little 'bomb's such as "you're not the only one who likes green" or "we've got to stop doing this". She told me to stop ignoring his comments and to make him own the statements by asking, "oh, who else likes green?" or "stop doing what?" She said that he's 'feeling me out' when he drops those bombs and is testing the waters so to speak. She's met him so she knows he's a poor verbal communicator and says he expects me to read his mind and get mad when I guess wrong. So I should question his comments to force (for lack of a better word) him to communicate his meaning.

Thoughts?
Liz

[liz_palmer]

Starsky - I guess my 'hangup' on issuing boundaries and consequences to someone who has already told me he doesn't see any hope for our relationship and he loves me but isn't 'in' love with me seems useless. Why would someone who feels this way give a da*n about what I want? I have already told him that I thought she needed to stop communicating with him while he was home. And yet here it continues so that just proves to me that he doesn't give a da*n about my feelings.

At this point in time I'm more comfortable with him taking the calls in my presence than doing what he used to do which was to get up and leave the room to take her calls. THAT always made me feel like he had something to say to her that he didn't want me to hear. When I pointed out to him how it made me feel he no longer leaves the room to speak with her. This talk took place months ago, not since the deciding conversation on Mothers Day that he announced there was nothing else here to work on.

My other hangup is that I'm not sure HOW to issue boundaries and consquesnce to a grown man. I'm still suffering from the fear that he will pack up and leave. So, of course, I'm not at the issuing demands point. I'm going to think on this for a couple days.

Fortunately for me, my brother will come to stay in the house with my husband while we're all gone to PA. I was already one step ahead of you on that one.

Liz

[liz_palmer]

**UPDATE**

I had my family reunion this last week. Husband decided back in February not to attend. The reunion was 1300 miles away from home. I drove my mother, daughter and myself to the reunion and back. Every day I was gone HE called ME. The only time I contacted him first was when we ran in to a rain storm on the drive up and when I nearly ran out of gas on the way home. Otherwise I purposely waited to see if he would contact me…and he did, every day. Once he called or texted I would converse back and forth with him but I made sure I didn’t continue correspondence throughout the day. I would just wait until the next day when he called. While I was gone I continued to monitor his Facebook account and because he had advised me that he was going out while I was gone I wasn’t surprised to see comments about his activities while I was gone. For the most part he stayed home (his brother was staying with us and verified – and no, he wouldn’t cover for my husband, he’s against what’s been going on). There was an entry though that made me cry. It was a comment about what a good time he was having with <girls name> and <girls name>. I was upset because I just couldn’t get over how cruel he could be to post something he knew I would see. On the two day drive home I considered unfriending him on Facebook so I wouldn’t have to have it thrown in my face.

On the day we were to arrive home he called me earlier than he had called any other day. He asked me what time we had left the hotel and were we on the road yet. He seemed a little upset that I hadn’t texted him that we were on our way. (Remember this is a man who said there was no hope and we should sell our house and go our separate ways). I told him we had left around 7am and would get home around 7pm. About 120 miles from home I texted him asking if we should pick up dinner on our way in and he responded by saying that he was already cooking dinner. When I asked what he was cooking he told me it was a secret. &#61514;
When we got home he met us as the door, gave me a hug and continued to pinch my butt while I was greeting our dogs. I stepped away to use the restroom and when I opened the door he was standing there with a big smile on his face. He grabbed me and kissed me like never before. Afterwards I pulled back and told him I missed him. He said nothing, but it didn’t bother me because he had said so much with the kiss. (Been reading Love Languages) The rest of the evening was wonderful. He flirted and we some of the best sex we’ve had in a long time. We sat and talked about the trip, he asked me about the reunion and I told him he would have had a good time had he gone. He told me he hadn’t spoken to the girlfriend at all that day and he told me everything he did throughout the week. At the time, I thought it was strange. Why was he telling me where he went and who he went with? To rub it in? After some thought I think it was to reassure me that he didn’t do anything he wasn’t supposed to do.

He left for work the next morning. At some point that morning his brother came to me and we started discussing what went on while I was away. Turns out my husband went out Saturday night (the same night the post in Facebook turned up) and came home spitting mad. Brother said he mumbled something about ‘women’ and grabbed a bottle of scotch. Together they sat and drank and talked about what happened that night….husband went out with girlfriend and her friend. When the night was coming to a close she invited him back to her place to spend the night and HE REFUSED! His refusal lit her fuse. She apparently railed at him that here I was 1300 miles away, I would never find out, and what the heck was wrong with him. Of course her tantrum pushed him away and he came home. Husband also told brother that girlfriend was the one who ‘jacked’ his phone and made the Facebook entry about having a good time.

We’ll see how the coming week goes.
Liz

[liz_palmer]

Okay so I updated a couple days ago(still not posted) but I have another update (that I hope will be posted before my 12 yr old graduates high school).

Two days after we arrived home from our family reunion I was outside vacuuming my car when my husband walked up to me and asked me if I still loved him. I responded that I did indeed still love him and returned the question to him. He responded that he 'thinks' he loves me. I smiled at him and told him that I KNOW he loves me. He said he told his OW the day before that he was coming home and going to work on his marriage. He said he knew he had hurt me and I told him that yes I had been hurt by the whole thing but that we stood in front of a preacher 19 years ago and promised for better or for worse. We spoke a few more minutes - he told me that he had cosigned on an apt for the OW because she couldn't qualify on her own. I took the admission as it was intended and didn't get mad just told him to keep in mind that if she got mad enough she could screw us good. I had to go to work for a few hours and when I returned we talked about the OW some more. He said he spoke to her while I was gone and tried to apologize to her for some perceived promises he made to her but she was too angry to listen. He was upset that he had hurt so many people, me included. He admitted that she wasn't just the friend he kept trying to tell me she was, he admitted that she was manipulative and a couple other things. He also told me that she is the one who helped him to come home (tho not her intention, I'm sure). She apparently told him that if he was going to divorce his wife he should just go and do it that he had to be causing me a tremendous amount of pain by doing nothing. But, she told him, be prepared to jump through hoops because your wife is going to make you walk the line in order to come back. He told me he didn't think I would make him jump through hoops and took a chance.

Today he is at work again. I called him a bit ago and asked him how he was doing. He said he was doing okay that he was listening to music (truck driver that used to pass the time talking on phone with OW). I asked how it went with her this morning (they work together) and he said neither spoke a word to the other. He said she sent him a facebook message that she wanted to meet with him the next day when he got back but thinks she just wants a face to face with him to try to change his mind. I asked him flat out have you made your decision or will she be able to persuade you to change your mind and he told me there was nothing she could do to change his mind.

I'll let you know more as I know it myself. BTW - our 19th anniversary is in 11 days.

Liz