I need fast advice!

[kermitdfrog]

Thank you 25yearsmlc and oldtimer,

25yearsmlc,
I am trying so hard to convince myself that I will be ok no matter what, but my counselor said it is really hard to "live in both worlds- the world of fighting for your marriage, and the world of moving on without him" I feel like all my energy is focused on saving my marriage. I will have to build a life without him when/if the time comes. My biggest challenge is lack of patience. My DB coach said to take one day at a time, reviewing things at the end of each day. I focus on that, and then I talk to him, or go to a restaurant that we used to go to (both happened today) and, again, I say to myself "What? He's divorcing me? This must be a cruel joke!" It seems so unreal. Talked to him this morning (household business stuff) and just mention of his sister and brothers, make me sad. I think to myself "They have been my family for almost 3 decades, and now they aren't" It's so surreal. Inside, I am just so fired up and determined to not let this happen. I feel like someone is dragging me into a fire pit, and I am screaming and kicking all the way. I may still get burned, but dammit, I will not go willingly. The challenge is, to "fight" by being patient and calm. Kind of a contradiction.

oldtimer, You are right about the respect. He deserved more than I gave him, but he never before communicated to me that it was a problem in our marriage. He is right. I didn't respect him the way I should have. But no matter what I do, it seems too late. I really feel I have learned A LOT about how to be a great wife in this journey, but he doesn't want to give me a chance. My goal is to somehow get him to give me time to show him. But he needs to reengage, and how do I get him to want to do that? It's like he has turned the "off" switch, and refuses to turn it back on. My DB coach says she thinks there is still some connection there. I hope she's right. I really feel I need to have hope.
Do you all feel there's still hope? Any other advice on getting him to give it more time? I know him well enough to know what he wants in a wife, and I feel I have really improved in those areas, and if he would give me a chance, I KNOW he'd feel better about me and our marriage. But how to do that?? Like I said in an earlier post, I am finally becoming the woman he always wanted me to be, and he won't stick around to see it!
Any additional advice always welcome! Thanks!

[oldtimer]

Quit trying to "make" H do, see, feel, or think anything. Back WAAAYYYY off. Respect him as a man with his own thoughts, feelings, wishes who is able to make his own choices. Leave him alone.

Focus only on yourself. Work on your own co-dependence issues. Get happy.

[kermitdfrog]

thanks oldtimer

I respect your view on my situation, and there is a lot of truth in what you are saying. The problem is, to "back off and let him make his own choices" at this point would mean to give up on a 28 year marriage. I can't do that. At this time, that IS his choice. But it is a choice that affects many others. Me, our kids, our moms, and other friends and family. It would mean selling the house we raised our kids in. It would mean financial stress, maybe even financial ruin. This is not just "his choice". He made his choice the day of our wedding. Obviously, the final decision is in his hands. I cannot MAKE him do anything. But that doesn't mean I can't try to find a way to save our marriage. And contrary to what he seems to feel now, we really did have a solid marriage. He never once said he was unhappy. Our counselor feels that he is running from his mistakes, as well as any problems in our marriage. I can't just sit back and watch him destroy our lives. While I always have respected my husband very much, I don't think I did a very good job of showing it. His behavior now, however, is not really worthy of respect. Having said that, I am still trying very hard to give him unconditional love and listen to his views. It is just really hard, because his views are so hurtful.
Thanks for your response.

[25yearsmlc]

thanks oldtimer

I respect your view on my situation, and there is a lot of truth in what you are saying. The problem is, to "back off and let him make his own choices" at this point would mean to give up on a 28 year marriage.

NO IT DOESN'T! IT MEANS TO STOP CHALLENGING AND ARGUING AGAINST HIS CHOICES B/C YOU FORCE HIM TO DEFEND THEM AGAIN & AGAIN...


I can't do that. At this time, that IS his choice. But it is a choice that affects many others.

HAVE YOU ACTUALLY READ THE DB BOOKS? YOU DON'T SEEM TO GET IT. SORRY...

It would mean selling the house

Maybe so. Maybe seeing that will wake him up, maybe not. It's not the worst thing in the world and you DO have to wrap your head around this soon. It might happen.

we raised our kids in. It would mean financial stress, maybe even financial ruin. This is not just "his choice". He made his choice the day of our wedding.

Wake up. He changed his mind.

Obviously, the final decision is in his hands.

IT'S ONLY IN HIS HANDS...WHAT'S IN YOUR HANDS?? ?what are your 180s? What are your GAL activities?

Until you work on YOU and ONLY YOU, none of the rest of this stuff matters b/c you need to change you.



I cannot MAKE him do anything. But that doesn't mean I can't try to find a way to save our marriage.

We're advising you how to do that! Hello? You don't want to listen.

You want to do what you've always done, b/c it's what you've always done, so you'll get what you've always gotten

He knows you want him to stay. You are clutching at him and it's making him run away faster. Do you see that?

You think stepping back is giving up but it's not. DBing is about the radical but simple idea that you should do more of what works For your marriage and Not do (or do less of) what does NOT work for your marriage...Hard, but not complicated. Stop resisting it. You have a DB coach and two veterans here telling you the same thing. I won't keep arguing with you. That which you resist, persists.


If your marriage was ever happy, and I believe you when you say it was, then trust that when you back off enough, those memories will resurface in him.

I can't just sit back and watch him destroy our lives.

Ending the marriage is a terrible thing. I get it. But it does NOT "DESTROY YOUR LIFE" unless YOU LET IT...stop that stinking thinking now. You are catastophizing this. Making a sad situation worse. How would you react if he died? After the grief passed, would you be hysterical? Would you fall apart and shrivel up and die? Why not? B/C of ego? Hey that's not a bad thing but it is something to remember. What is this Fear based drama all about? You are letting your fears dictate your reactions and that's a bad policy.



While I always have respected my husband very much, I don't think I did a very good job of showing it. His behavior now, however, is not really worthy of respect.

OMG ^^^^^ MORE OF THE SAME right in front of you. You are saying on one hand you were NOT respectful enough to him & wish you had been..THEN Now you say you "always have"been respectful...??? and then here, you say he doesn't deserve respect...

Gee, you'll show him!...See what I mean? That's anger. And that's NOT helping you. It's a repeat of the something HE is fleeing.

How are you showing your h, that marriage to you NOW, would be different than before? (Answer...you are NOT demonstrating that).

You just finished saying the whole thing about respect --BUT "NOW he doesn't deserve my respect" and I am RIGHT .....and being right is more important than being happy!....

Seriously, you need to choose whether being "right" is more important to you than being happy..b/c you are just going in circles here defending the behavior you are repeating, even while saying you know it's what bothered him...

Here's a tough thing to hear but you need it....I know You don't realize you sound really controlling and critical, but you do. So the comments about unconditional love ring hollow.

What 180? Where are the 180s?



Having said that, I am still trying very hard to give him unconditional love and listen to his views. It is just really hard, because his views are so hurtful.
Thanks for your response.

back off so you won't feel so hurt. Guilting him will backfire.

Here's the problem as I see it just reading here.

You SOUND like someone who isn't listening well. You sound as if you DEMAND he "see the light", and (that you get your way) b/c you are RIGHT and someone else is WRONG...

see, this does not work. It does not help marriages in trouble. I said this to you before so please read my LONG post to you again.

If these comments seem at all like something your h would say, then do the opposite.

No one said give up.

Either you don't understand the concept of DBing and detachment, or you don't want to do it.

IF so, then try another approach on another site.

But this is divorce busting and you have a DB coach and us and you keep arguing and I don't want to do that.

It's NOT hopeless...but you have to stop blowing it. You have to do something different.

No more arguing with him/his choices or with us...he's fleeing for a reason.

I am NOT blaming you but I wil say this one more time.

HE HAS JUSTIFIED LEAVING IN HIS MIND..

SO YOU HAVE TO COUNTER THE NEGATIVES HE HAS, rright or wrong, WITH POSITIVES...

DON'T FUEL HIS NEGATIVES...

NO MORE BLAMING AND GUILTING HIM B/C IT WILL CONVERT INTO ANGER AT YOU...

GAL, take a breath. Do some real 180s. Stop the obsessing/worrying/projecting and stop living in fear.

When you operate in fear, you are not operating in faith.

Turn your pain and anger over to God, trust Him,
and BECOME A WOMAN ONLY A FOOL WOULD LEAVE.

Then leave the results up to God.

[25yearsmlc]

I suggest you read an article

by Laura Munson on what she did when her h told her he wanted out. It's a bit different but you will probably love it.

I think the article is called "Those aren't fighting words" (but I don't know how to link stuff here. Sorry.)

[kml]

Oooh - great article! here's the link: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/02/fashion/02love.html?pagewanted=1&%2360;!--Undefined%20dynamic%20function%20data_sanitationlib::sanitize_string:1%20called--&%2362;

[kermitdfrog]

25yearsmlc,

Please understand that my words on these posts are for you all to read, not my husband. They are written to vent and share my feelings, in hopes that others will have suggestions or at the very least will be a friend who understands. MY HUSBAND DOES NOT HEAR THESE WORDS FROM ME. I have been very cautious with my husband. And aren't we all trying to "get" our spouses to do something...come back into the relationship? Otherwise, why did we buy the book? We are trying to "divorce bust". But just because I desire something from my husband, doesn't mean I am trying to force something, or that I am not trying to show him respect. I want to restore my marriage the RIGHT way. Because obviously I wasn't doing it right the other way. So I'm learning. That's why I'm here. He called today about my car (in the shop) etc. I was pleasant, but not over the top. I did not say a single word about our marriage or divorce. My DB coach suggested that if he shares any feelings that are hurtful, I should resist the urge to react, but rather just let him know that I hear him and understand. But lately, he hasn't said anything to warrant that. He will be dropping by some time over the weekend to do some small projects in our house, so that will be a real test.
But again...these words on these posts are not at all what my husband hears from me. But I thank you for your words.

[Reincarnated]

Kermit -

These two ladies know what they are talking about. If you can follow their advice, you have a chance.

I can tell you, I was unable to follow their advice. I went into a suicidal depression, instead, turning myself into something that I had never been, and my arguing, begging, pleading, and rationalizations did nothing but put the nails in the coffin. I literally went crazy - 2 week-long stints in the mental ward. I did not save my marriage.

I did learn a lot about myself in the time since my bomb, however. I came to realize co-dependence and ACOA issues that were just under the surface of my own denial. Having never dealt with those things that I carried since childhood, I was not equipped to deal with my husband leaving. (It didn't help that he fell into the arms of a mutual friend and was in a full-blown affair, but that is his burden to bear - it doesn't relieve me of my responsibility for the divorce outcome).

I don't know if me behaving differently would have lead to saving my marriage, if he might have changed his mind - there are no do-overs. Looking back, though, I can see how my reactions to it all did contribute to the complete break-down.

Even after all of that, I have recovered. I am not the same person I was then, or even the person from when I was married. So much has changed. There is a lot of truth in "That which doesn't kill you makes you stronger." And even if you feel like you are dying, you aren't. You are still here. And there is more to your life than your marriage - you have to force yourself to focus on that part of yourself, even if you don't want to.

If you can hear them, listen to 25 and OT. I truly hope that you can, that there isn't more going on within you that can get in the way, as it was for me.
No matter what the outcome, you will need more strength than you ever felt capable of - and you are capable of it, even if you don't believe it right now. It will seem counter-intuitive, but you must have faith in YOURSELF, and if you are spiritual, in God. Not faith in your husband or your marriage - that is beyond your scope right now.

Do the 180s. Make yourself get out of bed and out of your own head. See a counselor to talk about YOU, not your marriage, if you have your own issues to deal with. Work every day to become the person you want to be, for YOURSELF, not for any other reason. If he is worthy of you, he will see it. But that is his job.
Don't discuss this with well-meaning friends and family - they just don't want to see you in pain; some may even just want to commiserate instead of being supportive (there is a difference).

[25yearsmlc]

kermit

that's good to hear. But still, how's YOUR WORK ON YOU going?

Your posts are about getting him to do/feel something. And DBing really is not about that.

It's not even first about saving your m so much as saving yourself, and as a result the m.

Did you read the article?

She even says SHE learned that HER happiness was up to HER and her h had not learned that HIS was HIS responsibility so he blamed her for his problems.

Read the article. You'll like it.

[Reincarnated]

I went back and re-read what I wrote.

This is a more accurate statement:

If you can follow these ladies' advice, you have a chance...

of keeping your dignity and self-worth
of living a rewarding and happy life
of being the best person you can be
of living up to your potential
of attracting good, healthy people into your life


Your marriage might be saved. It might not. But, ultimately, you are on your own journey here, uncharted territory - and the reins are in your hands.

Give up the goal to save your marriage - you've done what you can towards that.
Make goals for yourself, about yourself.

As much as you want to make someone else see something, feel or think something, you can't. Believe me, that was a lesson that was very hard for me to learn, and took a very long time to understand to my core.

But you can do those things for yourself.