WAW, and a bisexual open marriage part 2

[greenblue90]

What do you mean?

[greenblue90]

It's been almost a week and a half and things seem to be getting better, and better. That being said I am worried about a lot unresolved issues.

I hate to be doing things, but things seems to be going too smoothly. It feels like some things may be being swept under the rug for now. Our sex life has been on hold, until the infection goes away. I also know I need to be patient once it clears. I just hate feeling like that infection may derail the good progress we were making. Oh well

[25yearsmlc]

It's been almost a week and a half and things seem to be getting better, and better. That being said I am worried about a lot unresolved issues.

that's b/c there are unresolved issues. How will they get resolved?


I hate to be doing things, but things seems to be going too smoothly.

does "doing things" mean, addressing the issues? Things "going too smoothly"--meaning, b/c issues are being swept under the rug?? That way you avoid confronting the issues that need resolution. Oh...

It feels like some things may be being swept under the rug for now.

they are being ignored. And? (So, What are you going to do about that?)

Our sex life has been on hold, until the infection goes away. I also know I need to be patient once it clears. I just hate feeling like that infection may derail the good progress we were making. Oh well

You think by not confronting things, what will happen? Let's assume she somehow heals from this horrible infection (i can't recall ever cutting my h off for a UTI, btw...you make adjustments...geez)

then what? All will be well...I know you hope this. But honestly, doesn't a part of you already know you are delaying the inevitable by...delaying the work needed?

[greenblue90]

It's not that I'm afraid of ruining this superficial happiness. It's just that I learned like most WAW's R talk at the wrong time is completely self defeating. It's not that waiting for this uti to be over will magically solve everything. It's that I am worried of where we stand as of now. I know bringing it up during the uti will just get me blamed for being inconsiderate. She'll call me manipulative and controlling and every other thing WAW's do when they feel cornered with R talk.

Where do we stand? Not sure, last we spoke we were going to try things slowly, and together. We were going to work on our sex life, and we weren't going to go off with other OP's without asking each other for permission first. (her idea).

Then the damn uti hit, and I worry that she will clam up once again. Say that ml to me is not worth the uti that may come with it. She'll start feeling frustrated again for not getting her needs met again and go full blown WAW again. It sounds ridiculous, but a series of UTI's she got in the past were what contributed to us losing our sex life.

My only consolation is how affectionate she has been.

I know her mind must be spinning right now, it frustrates me because we had made so much progress healing I hate to see it all fall apart over something almost so random as an infection.

I also hate that everything has to be on her timeline. I've read many sitch's where WAW just keep asking for more and more time.

As for W's orientation, I am convinced that it will always remain fluid. The question is if we can channel that into a way that would not include OP's. The trips to the strip club, and porn were a good start.

I also keep trying to tell myself to shelf my anger and my concerns to rebuild the good times and to once again re-write the history she had already rewritten.

I guess the plan is to get her to the point where she realizes how dumb it would be to go through with it afterall.

I know young at heart asked me not to play the jealousy angle too much, and I agree. I also want her to realize that by going through with all this she is opening pandora's box and may very well lose me someday.

My hope is to do enough to have her say: is this fling I'm about to go into worth losing my husband?

I don't remember the poster but someone here said that they tried the open marriage thing, and his W snapped out of it when she found a love letter to him. Hopefully things will resolve soon. She insisted she was turned on to see me flirt with other women. So yes I intend to put this to the test, in the hopes that she will say: "jeez that girl seemed interested, I wonder if I could lose him to her....maybe we need to stop this open marriage thing."

Does that sound like a plan? Most likely not but it's the crazy game I'm working on.

[greenblue90]

Ok so I guess my insecurity has shined through. She's been asking if anything is wrong I've been shrugging it off. Well today I had told her it had to do with memorial day, and that I have been having a hard time thinking of some people. This is actually true, losing these people made me re evaluate what was important to include her. So yeah part of the neediness came from reevaluating what was important. She said she had noticed I had been a little needy. She tried to be understanding but once again tried saying she wasn't good at this stuff.

She then told me she was going to run errands alone. I was kinda hurt since what I really wanted was some understanding and closeness. She left and I took the time to play my guitar, and ride my bike.

She got back still moody, we got some food was majorly indecisive about what to eat. Got nothing I got food, still moody. We get back I eat, still moody. Watch tv still moody. I go practice my guitar some more, still moody, she says she needs to go to the pharmacy asks some questions I couldn't hear over the guitar she gets mad, drives away angry. She SHOULD be back soon.

Seriously WTH is her problem. She's always saying she wishes i'd open up and not let my mild PTSD fester, and when I do this is what she does.

[25yearsmlc]

It's not that I'm afraid ... It's not that waiting for this uti to be over will magically solve everything. It's that I am worried....just get me blamed for being inconsiderate. She'll call me manipulative and controlling and every other thing WAW's do when they feel cornered with R talk.

Where do we stand? Not sure, last we spoke we were going to try things slowly, and together. We were going to work on our sex life, and we weren't going to go off with other OP's without asking each other for permission first. (her idea).

Then the damn uti hit, and I worry that she will clam up once again. Say that ml to me is not worth the uti that may come with it. She'll start feeling frustrated again for not getting her needs met again and go full blown WAW again. It sounds ridiculous

My only consolation is how affectionate she has been.

I know her mind must be spinning right now, it frustrates me because we had made so much progress healing I hate to see it all fall apart over something almost so random as an infection.

How long has she been taking anti-biotics for it? They'll work soon.


I also hate that everything has to be on her timeline.

As for W's orientation, I am convinced that it will always remain fluid. The question is if we can channel that into a way that would not include OP's. The trips to the strip club, and porn were a good start.


I disagree, but hey, it's your life.

I guess the plan is to get her to the point where she realizes how dumb it would be to go through with it afterall.

I know young at heart asked me not to play the jealousy angle too much, and I agree. I also want her to realize that by going through with all this she is opening pandora's box and may very well lose me someday.

My hope is to do enough to have her say: is this fling I'm about to go into worth losing my husband?

None of this is about your own work on you. None of it.

It is all about changing/manipulating/ steering HER into "getting to see/to realize, etc-- things your way"...etc. did you read the DB books? I forgot.

I don't remember the poster but someone here said that they tried the open marriage thing, and his W snapped out of it when she found a love letter to him.


Hopefully things will resolve soon. She insisted she was turned on to see me flirt with other women. So yes I intend to put this to the test, in the hopes that she will say: "jeez that girl seemed interested, I wonder if I could lose him to her....maybe we need to stop this open marriage thing."

Does that sound like a plan? Most likely not but it's the crazy game I'm working on.

you said it.

[Young at Heart]

+1 on what 25 said.

GB, you cannot change your wife, only she can change herself.

You need to work on your GAL (in the fullest sense). You need to work on becoming a better man an integrated man who makes sure he gets his needs and the needs of his family met. Not your wants, but your needs.

Your worrying and "needyness" are (in my opinion) Nice Guy relapses.

The advice I got from John Gottman at one of his workshops for couples was that I should not try to negotiate a change in my wife's behavior until I can explain why she behaves the way she does or her reason for something as well or better than she can.

To do that I really need to have asked a lot of questions and listened to my wife first. That mean she needs to feel that her positions have been listened to and validated first.

You seem to need her to throw herself emotionally into you and comforting you right now; to devote herself completely to your emotional support? Has she ever done that in the past (possibly with someone else--maybe even a parent or family member) and been hurt for it? How did things go with her emotionally when you were overseas without her? What were her fears then?

Be strong, be brave. She is the one (in your words) in the MLC and that means she needs your love and you as a pillar of strength for her use as support while she gets her head together.

You have done wonderful things. View your glass as half full and not half empty. It will take time and change on the part of your wife for your marriage to be saved. You know so much about what is going on and what you need to do. See how 25 used your own words.

Focus on GAL and doing things that will improve you. My advice is to continue to provide unconditional love and make her feel loved in her languages of love.

A story that really moved me about a marriage in crisis and unconditional love was that of the Montana wife. It may be more fiction that truth, but I really want to beleive it and it helped me find strenght when I was in an SSM.

Montana wife story in NY Times \

I hope that you may also find the story motivational for your situation.

Good luck!

[greenblue90]

Ok so she came back last night claiming she drove around town angry.

She then tried to explain why she lost her temper
I tried to make her understand it was uncalled for. She then asked me if I had plans for the weekend. I told her no, she then told me she did. I said ok. I'm guessing you are meeting someone. She said yes is that a problem. (I know by now this is a challenge) I just said no, and backed away. (at that moment we were in bed cuddling. She instantly asked if everything was ok. I said yeah it's fine. She said: I can tell everything is not ok. I said: what am I supposed to do? This is hard. I then asked her a bunch of questions about it. Long story short it's an OW that lives nearby. She asked if I was bothered, all I could say was this is not easy to accept, you can't expect me to just let it roll off my back. She then said, "I don't even know if I will be doing anything with her". I told her that didn't matter.

I then asked what happened to doing things slowly together. She then told me that once again she felt uncomfortable seeing me with other women, and didn't want to see it. I said how do you think I feel knowing that you will be with someone else. She responded, but it's a woman, not a man. Clearly to her it is not the same to have a same sex fling as an opposite sex fling. I tried explaining to her how it was the same, but I could tell her mind was made up.

At some point I told her I didn't want OM involved. She said that it was no problem, that she only really wanted me, and that she had pursued OM only because it was "fair" since I could pursue women. So she did it out of spite....
We established that neither of us could tolerate opposite sex partners and agreed to set that as a boundary. (although if you keep score that's a losing deal for me, since I'm not bi) not that I care anyway.

At one point she brought up that things have been better because she finally felt that she could trust me enough to be herself(bisexual) without me freaking out. I agreed that we have been closer I'm the last 2 weeks than in the whole time I had been back. She felt bad for this.

I emphasized to her that to me she was the only person I needed, and that it hurt for her to need women. She apologized, and looked like she felt sorry for hurting me.

I told her I was not happy with the sitch but that I would let her try it out, and do my best to make it work. She seemed happy with this. (of course! She just got her cake to eat!)

We also made a strong commitment to work on our sex life.

We then went to bed.

Today she has been super sensitive of my needs, I know I'm trying to detach from this whole sitch, and I can tell she can tell. Before anyone says something I'm not trying to manipulate this time, I really do feel less loving towards her. This is not me trying to teach her a lesson, this is just the reality she will have to live with.

I told her: "the day I don't get jealous it's because I stopped
Loving you"

I'm trying real hard not to let jealousy kick in. If you get what I mean.

Ok so why am I allowing all this?

Well one I know she arranged this while angry at me, she's done this in the past and failed to follow through once the anger goes away. I think she does it out of spite. Childish I know, I don't want to encourage this behavior by continuing to react to it. I hope by sat she will be thinking clearly.

Yesterday we received our moving date, she came up with this date yesterday. Makes me wonder if she is calling my bluff about the open marriage bit. Feels like she is testing to see how I react before we move over seas.

At the same time I am also calling HER bluff. Seeing how committed she is to this open marriage thing. Up until now she has been all talk, I know her she has serious guilt issues. I'm wondering if she'll have a change of heart before or after it happens.

If it does happen whether she regrets it or not I know some damage will be done. To what extent I dont know. What my actions will be I don't know. Will I be hurt absolutely. Could I forgive her if she regrets it? I don't know. To be honest I don't know. I also don't want to make any threats I can't back up.

So yeah I am leaving the choice as to whether she can go through with it on her. I can't change her mind for her. Lord knows I have tried. I am going to give her a chance to redeem herself, and toss all this away. I think it is clear to her that this will hurt me. I want to give her the chance to choose not to do it.

Finally there is the STD part as much as a hypochondriac as she is I know this is weighing heavily on her. Maybe that will tip it over. Who knows.

All I know is that come Sunday morning I will at least have a clearer picture of the type of person she is for better or worse. This will help me to finally make some choices. It's really very bittersweet.

This whole time I have been wanting to give her the benefit of the doubt. At least I'll know soon.

[Kettricken]

I don't post often but this is just too much.

If it's not ok, why would you say that it is? If you're not "ok" then why would you say you are? This is passive aggressive behavior at its worst. What you think any of this is going to prove, I have no idea.

You are sending mixed messages and NOT BEING HONEST.

If she is testing you to see how you react to an open marriage, then you just (once again) sent the message that you may pout some but are basically ok with it. ARE YOU?

You are in this marriage too. You get to decide whether or not you are comfortable with adding sexual partners. If you are not, then why tell her that "you would let her try it out and do your best to make it work"?????????

[25yearsmlc]

K,

my guess is that it's b/c GB is hoping that either some Penthouse forum type event will occur and he'll get 2 women at the same time AND she'll be happy too...(but will prefer HIM over any OW or OM...)

OR she'll hate sex w/others, and fall back in love with GB and will spontaneously treat him right, not want sex with others anymore and won't punish him anymore with passive aggressive behavior or overtly hostile behavior...

b/c the worst thing to him, (according to your actions GB, not your words) would be for her to leave him. Then he'd be alone.

Alone in the dark, when you think it out and feel your fears, isn't this pretty much how you got here GB? (I'm asking..).

The idea that she is being "fair" b/c She said he can have sex with OMs is just not worth commenting on, except SHE came up with that too, as I understand it.

I don't know how to advise in a DB way with this, b/c it's not a marriage envisioned by MWD as workable.

I just don't get why you'd want to be married and yet each be able to date others? Wht happens when you meet someone you care for? That's why the 2 couples I know who had open m's both divorced.

Why does your w want to be married? b/c other than the money aspects & getting to live overseas, why does she want to be in a "committed R" that is by definition, NOT committed? I just don't get it.