Rebuilding a friendship...Thread #4

[Navyguy]

25, thanks for giving me some of your time. I hope you know how appreciated you are by all of us on this board.

But essentially, isn't she saying "I will stay m to you for now, but I will never let go of the past or forgive, and I will hold the past 'sins' against you even if it isnt' you I'm angry at..."?? IS that it, in brief?

I think that is what she is basically saying, but in her mind there is no "if it isn't me she's angry at". She is totally convinced that I am the problem. She seems to vehemently refuse to put 2 and 2 together and see how her past affected her and my actions over the years.

Her indecision and possible depression are the obstacles.You are not responsible. Don't pretend to be or she'll be enabled to wallow in her despair and indecisiveness.

I agree. I think I have probably taken validating too far to where I have started to enable her. That is why I MUST avoid the R talk...anytime I try to defend myself, she pulls all the skeletons (i.e. times where I did screw up as a husband/father and I can't defend my actions) out of the closet which reopens all the old wounds. IC told me the other day "there is no way I can win with this woman"...IC actually said she is "bullying" me.

So she was pathologically conflict avoidant?? And still doesn't have to speak up for herself? If so, then you have to become a better mind reader...good luck with that.

Yes, and I think her conflict avoidance trait comes from her childhood. Her dad was a tyrant and she learned to keep him happy at all costs, or there would be consequences. I have brought up how she doesn't ask me for what she wants/needs many times in the past and her responses are "that is not who I am" and "I don't think I should have to do that". And when I do bring that up, she sees it as me blaming her. Her friends have even told her she needs to speak up more....it seems that she just can't.

Funny you mention the mind reading. I took the CPI 260 personality test a few months ago. My empathy (reading other people's emotions/feelings) score was off the chart (like 99+ percentile). For some reason I can't seem to make that work with W though.

Do you feel as if your approach is working? If not, why not do something different?

I thought it was working pretty well until the R talk the other day. It feels like no matter what I do we're not going to get to where I want to go unless W starts dealing with her past.

Have you read "No More Mr Nice Guy"? I haven't but a lot of guys have and they highly recommend it.

I have not, but I will check it out.

Also the Five Love Languages, which I found very helpful is a good one. Thing is, you can change the dynamics of the R to an extent without her, but you are going on almost a year of no ML and she seems depressed to me, does she get c for that?

I have read 5LL. W's is acts of service, and I have been focusing on that. W went to counseling 3 sessions before the separation. No idea what they talked about but I'm almost certain they didn't get into her past. No professional C at all since then and I'm pretty sure her two main confidants (both of which she has known for less than 4 years) have no idea what she's been through in the past.

Also why are you getting off the ADs? I ask b/c you began to and then the R talk and antsyness seemed to come up.

I already did that math in my head too. Already back on the ADs as of yesterday. I haven't had any noticable side effects from them and it appears they did prevent me from reacting as strongly to her.

I don't see anything for you to do except change your approach. You sound like an insightful kind man with a good brain...and a wife in some sort of crisis.

Thanks for the compliments, it really means a lot to hear that. As far as my approach goes, I'm going to try to do the "loving pullback", meaning I will be a nice as I can to her, but I will initiate as little as possible with her. That is basically what she is asking for anyways. Who knows...maybe's she's subconciously asking me for what she needs to save our M.

BUT please...listen carefully to my next comments...

As a former JAG officer with experience defending men accused of abuse, (sometimes falsely) her near allegation of sex abuse, is a huge red flag to me.

Couldn't agree more...and as an Naval Officer I've had to deal with similar issues for some of my troops.

make sure you document the "incident" you discussed with the IC...and beware.

I figure that between posting here, talking to my IC, and keeping a journal on my computer at work, I'm in good shape. Is that a safe assumption?

and transferring her victimhood onto the kids.

That was my biggest concern during the separation and probably still would be if we end up splitting up. She is a great mom, but I think that is because we are great parents together..."united we stand, divided we fall". She thinks we can just teach them by simply telling them the right things. I told her that I totally disagree with that...they will learn much more from our actions.

Oh, the actual phrase is "Do you want to be right or HAPPY", (not right or "married"...) and that's an important distinction. Make sense?

Are you sure it's not "be married or be happy"?

It is a very important distinction...makes perfect sense.