my h and son gave me necklace

[rysmom]

thanks for your reply. it's good advice. Im going to a new therapist tonight. I still suffer severely from worry, anxiety and depression and obsesseing about the situation. I think i will get the book OCD work book today maybe it will help.
I went and played tennis with a guy the other day, and i went home feeling worse than i did before. i love my h and can't think of being with anyone else. I just need to find some good female friends and focus on my life. I get lonely sometimes though and miss being loved by my h. I wish i could call the DB counselor but its to expensive.
Hope things are going well for you and your w.

[rysmom]

Journaling
today was a good day. It was great weather and i got some things done. i listened to Wayne Dyer tape and it made me think more positive. I haven't listened to him in a long time.

[25yearsmlc]

Why is it not good to let h see that he is hurting me by doing what he is doing?

BECAUSE IT DOES NOT WORK...THE GUILT MAKES THEM ANGRY AND RESENTFUL....You have been repeating the same behavior for years now. I remember you when I was here yrs ago. How can you still be in virtually the same emotional place? You have confirmed and validated your h's choice to be with OW, b/c marriage to you cannot improve or change, b/c you have not...

You wanted me to post to you. Aside from getting excellent advice from MrBond, which you rarely respond to, you are also doing a real number on your son. Do NOT make HIM feel abandoned.

You should be reassuring your son that h loves him and values him, which you know is true.

In the two years your h returned to you, what was different in the m? Why'd he leave again?

I'm guessing it's b/c you seem to be in the same the place as you were before he left the first time.

At some point, Your fear and discomfort with the concept of genuine change, has to be outweighed by your desire for happiness. Or you will remain stuck. Life is short. You are wasting it wallowing.That only happens when you get sick and tired of feeling sick and tired. If not for yourself, then do it for your son until you are well enough to want happiness b/c you think you actually deserve it. There's too much "woe is me" and "why isn't happiness landing on me?" going on here. Have you tried meds? That's not a judgement, it's a question from someone who has been there.

I don't know what else to say Rm...I do wish you well but I don't have advice I think you'll take.

[rysmom]

thank you for your response 25 .I called db counselor Cheryl yesterday,she is very good.
When i came home yesterday h had left some vitamins by my door for tendonitis i told him i had a couple of weeks ago. i thought that was so thoughtful i text him and thanked him and asked how his day at work had been. he said ok.

[25yearsmlc]

rysmom,

It sounds as if your h and you have a friendship. He does some thoughtful things for you, either b/c you are the mother of his child, or because he feels guilty, or b/c he likes being kind to you.

But he's cohabitating with OW now, correct? And am I correct in assuming he has said nothing about a reconcilation with you? Am I correct in assuming you two don't discuss the topic of you two being married again?

What is the legal status of your m? Are there religious reasons he might not ever file for divorce? (Yes, even though he's living with OW, to some people it's not the same as officially ending a marriage and beginning another one).

Are you ready to stay in this limbo state of in between, forever? I'm sincerely asking. I think if you are honest with yourself, at some level you are more comfortable with your present situation than you are with the idea of changing yourself or trying something new. I am not sure what you fear about change, since you surely are not happy now. Yes you have moments where you say you are happy but they appear to be related to hopes you rekindle, every so often, about a reconciliation. If those are the only times you are happy, you are in for a world of hurt.

For your son's sake, if not yours, wouldn't it be valuable for him to see you pick yourself up, dust yourself off and move forward in your life? You can move forward without giving up. But the constant contact you have with your h is a form of co-dependency and odd interacting, where nothing substantive gets discussed but you get gifts that you coo about and praise him for, and which you see as signs of a reconciliation, but then I guess you forget that he gets in the bed of the OW each night...how can that be alright to you after so much time? Surely you know your approach has not worked...(or if it is working, we can't see it b/c it's moving at a glacial pace.)

I'm not saying what you should do legally; but I am saying your approach to your m, whatever it is, hasn't moved him closer to you and you have not GAL or done any 180's either. At some level, you are rejecting the DB principles b/c you don't follow many, if any. How do you feel about that statement? I mean, I'm asking what you are doing to GAL or what 180's you've done b/c I cannot think of any but I'm hoping I"m wrong.

So are you willing to try something new, since your present and past approaches obviously did not work? Please don't ignore the hard questions, b/c what is really hard, (harder than answering the questions) is being here in limbo/hell so long, b/c you won't look at or ask the tough questions. You have a lot of fears and anxieties. They seem to paralyze & cripple you. Was this one of your h's issues?

Also, you guys reconciled for some time, 2 years (?) and then he left again, correct? What did you do in that reconciled time?? How were things any different than before?

Why did he come home at all? Was it guilt, or his son, or something you promised to do differently? And why did he leave again?

Specifically, what did he SAY to you when he left? What reasons does he give, and what are you doing to make those reasons seem untrue or invalid, now?

I believe in prayer, for it has great power. But sometimes people use prayer in lieu of action. Prayer helps us to face our fears and ACT IN OUR INTEREST even though we have those fears. It's not a vehicle for remaining in the same position forever. "Standing" for your m, does not mean standing still.

Do you get what I'm trying to say?

[25yearsmlc]

yesterday I called h and said my Ryan doesn't want to be around ow , don't do that to him again. h hung up on me probable cuz ow was right there.

Couple things to note...use of the word "my" when discussing your son with HIS father. Also how old is your son now?

Why can't he speak for himself? And why would RYAN say that anyhow? This is you projecting and trying to punish/scold your h. AND OR trying to withold the one piece of leverage you have (Ryan) against your h. Not so loving...

Do you think your h hanging up was something he did b/c you secretly "got" to him and scored a point, or b/c you made him angry?

I doubt the presence or lack thereof, the OW, had anything to do with that. I think you angered your h a great deal with the thinly veiled extortion of "I will withold MY son from you if you don't do what I want"....

that's how I would have taken it anyhow. And you are getting great input from MR.BOND but I don't see many responses to him. He's a man giving you some insight.

The men on this site are a big part of how I learned to know my h, to see his actions differently, to "get" him better. I read many of the books the men here suggested and I tried many of their ideas out. I am SO grateful for the men I met here, who helped me save my m. Not just "Mars & Venus" stuff either. But deep insights into the male psyche, and what motivates them and us...

Don't ignore the gifts God sends. I am positive that a few of the men I met here were indeed Godsends. You say you pray and turn it over to Him, but when you come here and get some great insights (albeit uncomfortable ones) don't cast them aside, b/c they don't reinforce your fear based approach...which is you "hoping" for the best and taking whatever crumbs your h tosses your way, eagerly thanking him for his "thoughtfulness", and yet also reeling in anger and pain, every time the OW is with your h, even though you know they live together...

Of course she's going to be around your son. Of course, if they live together they are a couple and your son will have to cope with that. Your "reeling" behavior won't help him, it'll pull him apart and he'll feel he has to take sides.

But you know down deep your h loves him very much. Wouldn't your h love to have custody of Ryan? I'm asking that question not to terrify you, but to get you to realize that in your h's eyes, he left the marriage, not his son. So using his son that way, is going to push a lot of buttons in your h. And it made you look vindictive and petty, and unrealistic....

This seems like an area ripe with potential for 180's from you.


No doubt your h & son will give you a tasteful gift for Mother's Day. How about handling it in a new way? Let's NOT assume it means anything other than what it says or is...a Mother's day gift...

[rysmom]

I dont know what to do different. cheryl the DB coach suggested i ask h over to repair something at our house. i have been really depressed lately and don't think im up to that though. i feel stuck and frusturated about the situation. i was very sad today thinking of past mother's days as a family. H text me and said happy mother's day. You are the best mommy. in a way i hate him saying and doing nice things and going to bed with that woman every night. I feel like im losing my mind sometimes.

[25yearsmlc]

I understand you are in terrible pain. Are you getting the kind of help that is making enough of a difference? I ask this, b/c there just has to come a time when you get sick & tired of feeling sick & tired, and you either snap out of it, *which we'd all do if it were that easy), or you start doing whatever the heck it takes, to NOT feel so bad anymore.

A friend of mine lost her only child some years ago. At first she felt "obligated" to feel all her pain and not "hide" from it so she didn't get help...this lasted long enough to do more damage to her life (drinking, losing focus at her work, her marriage suffered, etc) but I couldn't say much b/c if I had been her, I would have felt so badly too, it's a terrifying loss....but finally she did get help, serious help, [i]b/c she said she was willing to do anything to no longer feel the pain she was feeling[/i]. Like a diabetic needing insulin or a patient needing pain meds for a broken leg, we all come to a point at which we can no longer tolerate feeling bad about something we cannot change from the past.

If you are there now, just do what it takes to not feel so sad & helpless, so often. That's how you strike me, sometimes.

It's not an insult, it's an observation. You have been stuck in pain, off and on, a very long time.

So, what do you want to do about it? I support you in moving towards changing something, anything, b/c what you've done so far is not getting him back home. It's one thing for him to be pleasant, but it's a whole other thing to get him home. OR IF NOT HOME, for you to move forward in your life. I feel as if you really are in a waiting pattern and it's not the kind of pattern that allows you to GAL or do any big 180's...it's too much waiting and not enough of "what works".

Does that make sense to you?

[MrBond]

rysmom,

I was reading glamgirl's excellent post when I noticed that you had responded to her. There was something in your response that I think is very important to your sitch.

You said: "My h i into a lot of dark stuff, porno, heavy metal, howard stern radio show all day, all evil stuff, and making a lot of money that corrupted him"

First off, there is nothing "evil" about heavy metal, howard stern, etc. If you take it for regular entertainment value. I personally listen to heavy metal and don't think it makes me "evil".

All of those things are your H's choices. They don't make him into who he is. Plus when you are so condemning, why would he want to come back? What if he likes heavy metal from now on? Would you not accept him back if he listens to it? Accept him the way he is now. That's why he's with the OW.

The most important thing you need to do is let it go. You have to accept the fact that at least for now, he likes those things and truly forgive him. And you have to forgive the OW.

If you read glamgirl's post, the most important message was forgiveness. Once she did that, God was able to do His work. Plus you need to forgive for yourself. Holding onto the anger, resentment, fear, pain, is digging you further into a hole.

Forgive and be free. It's not easy, but you have to do it for your sake.

[MrBond]

"I don't want my h to burn in hell and that's where he is headed if he doesn't repent from his sinful life style."

It's responses like this that really get me worried about you.