Sorry you're here. This is not easy on any of us. And you're still new at this. But I have some recommendations.
Your list up above, while true, is really no different than any list any person can make about themselves. We all have issues, personality traits, quirks, etc, that we are not proud of. What you will hear repeated here in MLC land is that if you change FOR your wife, you will ultimately fail. You CANNOT and SHOULD NOT change FOR your wife. You MUST change for YOURSELF. So what does that mean?
I think your list is a good start, but a very superficial first glance at yourself. Let's take, for instance the fact that you state you often ignored her by withdrawing, stonewalling, neglecting your wife. If you're honest with yourself, I'm sure there are aspects of that behavior that you also exhibit with friends or family. You can't change that without going deeper as to the WHY you do these things. I don't pretend to know why. You may not either. But this is the voyage that we must undergo as the LBS. Why were we the way we were (TRULY) and only then can we move forward to address these issues. But you must address them from the perspective of changing them because it's something you dislike about yourself.
For instance, if someone is a bad listener (likes to be the talker and interrupts a lot), and the spouse complains, then the obvious solution is to force yourself to stop talking. So then the next time your spouse talks, you force yourself to listen. But your inner monologue is screaming. You find it very difficult to listen (but are still proud of yourself that you do). Over time, that type of action becomes very frustrating. You either give up trying to silence your inner monologue, or you become bitter and resentful that your spouse doesn't really want to hear your opnions. Either way, that wasn't a REAL change made for the right reason. The better approach would be to stand back and evaluate why you have a need to speak rather than listen. Are you intimidated? Do you have insecurities about something? Do you have an inability to handle being wrong? And then go even deeper than that...WHY do I feel like this. Only then can you look for ways to change your CORE. Then once addressed, moving forward, you will find that the next time you have a conversation, not only is it easy to listen, but you DON'T have that inner monologue screaming at you because YOU have genuinely changed. It's not an act.
Just judging from your posts you're still WAY too focused on your W. That's normal, but it's not where your head needs to be. You must focus on yourself. JUST yourself. That does not mean ignore her. Obviously with kids, you will likely have some contact. But that means stop thinking about how to win her back and start focusing on how to improve yourself. Then no matter what happens, you ARE a winner in the end. This is not a place to learn how to win back your spouse. They are not a prize to be won. They are on a very painful, long voyage of their own.
As for this weekend, if you room together, you expect nothing. And you make no moves. She has made her position clear. Let her wear her cute PJs alone. It is not your place to try and "talk her back to you". Be pleasant and kind and avoid R talk. It is never the right time unless they bring it up, and even then sometimes its not the right time. Remember the mantra, "Believe NONE of what they say and 50% of what they do". You will find it hard to believe, but it is so so true.
Originally Posted By: reccos
So I am not sure going dark or doing a 180 would be in my best interest.
Perhaps going dark may not be, but you must learn to detach. You're still WAY too worried about what she's doing, thinking, saying, etc. You must learn to live your own life and you must at least go dim. She made this choice, you did not. Let her live the life she claims she wants. Don't convince yourself (falsely) that you need to be around her in order to make a difference. This is wishful thinking on your part. Because remember, you cannot change her.
Originally Posted By: reccos
W in fact said at one time that Positive attention is like an aphrodisiac.
So true. And if you provide that in a co-dependent fashion, she will continue to be miserable. You CANNOT spoon feed her happiness. It is a short term fix. She must find it on her own. That is the journey she's on.
Originally Posted By: reccos
So it looks like I need to work on myself and improve in being more positive...
If you work on yourself, the positive part comes naturally. Strength my friend. This is not easy or quick.....
"Love me when I least deserve it, for that is when I need it the most"
M18 Me39,H42 D16 Bomb 1/10 Moved out 3/10 OW 6/10 H wants to R,OW gone 11/10 H moves back 5/11 H wants to wear rings again 9/11
She wanted to be close in certain situations and not in others. So I gave her space and worked on being distant.
I thanked her for coming with me as a courtesy, and her response was wouldn't she, she is my wife...
Blew me away.
She is acting like nothing happened. But guards her iphone like our national security depended on it.
So.... I am thinking that she is playing this game trying to make me think that nothing is going. If there wasn't anything going on, then was the secrecy with the iphone?
Does she think I am stupid!!!!
Honestly, I could walk tomorrow and she would be in a world of hurt financially not me. Wonder if all of her lovers would bail her out with all of her financial woes?
Oh well...
This is hard and frustrating, especially someone who you love and trusted...
Interested in comments, suggestions, opinions, advice
It is becomeing very clear that I need to a least go dim.
But not sure how.
Right now we need to come up with $600 to pay her oldest daughter back because she agree to her youngest daughter to send her to FLA for a school trip. Of course we didn't have the money and she blames me because of the type of work I do. We do have it now, but not sure I want to be the nice guy here. I also don't want to cause more resentment either.
So How do I deal with that issue?
Then she writes to a mutual friends of our with the following:
Here is the deal, I am not in love with my H anymore. I haven't been for a couple of years. I am not really sure why. He is attentive and tries to do anything and everything to make it like it was in the beginning. I believe that when we got together he was what I needed at that time. I was just out of a terribly abusive relationship. I had two daughters with him and was married to him for 15 years. My current was the polar opposite of my ex. We also shared a love of soccer. He was a coach and both my daughters played. I clung to him and he to me. We both were newly divorced and it just felt right. As time went on I realized that it seemed that the only thing we actually had in common was soccer. He also had 5 boys that we had custody of in addition to my 2 girls. All the boys did not like me and all were constantly in trouble. Selling drugs, taking the car and wrecking it without permission, alcohol, sneaking out, running away and just plain mean to me which also put a strain on the mariage. In addition, he was out of work for several of the years we have been together. I do understand the economy is in the toilet and he would take jobs just to get some money but that also was difficult for me. I believe that all these factors played into my feelings or lack of feelings for him. It has really escalated in the last year. I know its all me as he does try to do things for me. He knows were I am with regard to him and does not want me to leave. I feel bad for feeling the way I do but I can't help it. I have absolutely no desire to have sex with him and it is a struggle when I do finally relent. I want to leave but am just not quite mentally ready. I am not looking for another relationship by any means. I feel that I need time to get to know myself. My daughters will both be in college in Kansas this fall so I think that is what I am waiting for. I also do not want to hurt him although I understand this is inevitable. Although, I do have needs that have to be met mentally and physically.
So do I let her run around, have her fling and not be accountable or just not care?
I read your words and can just imagine how much pain you feel. ((reccos)). You do realise in reading what she's written it is truly all about her and not about you? reccos, you need to take care of you. Your W is totally focussed on herself right now. She doesn't really know what she wants, and in most cases of walk aways, I don't believe they truly understand what they really do have, to so easily to discard it. If you can possibly swing it to talk to a DB counselor, I believe you would find it of value.
BITS Me-51, WAS-52 Kids 2 M-26yrs, H.left 2009, 2 more Bomb drops, Reconnection spring 2013 Change is inevitable, personal growth is a choice. Love is a action and choice you make, every day.
Everything came to a head when a good friend of mine confronted W about this affair she was having with this guy who is married with wife and family in another state. Apparently he was traveling into town every two weeks. W said that the A was coming to an end because OM company was closing the office here.
I am thinking even though the office closed, OM still travels to here once a month. I think that he and W still see each other when he comes to town. I am also afraid that he is giving her the line that he will never lie to her. Why would he? W could never validate whether it’s true or not.
Just late last week, she was in a very good mood. What her psychiatrist termed a hypo manic state. So I think he was in town. She also took work off Thursday afternoon. I think she saw him Thursday and Friday morning.
I am trying very hard to work on myself and not have this affair affect me. I am trying to be upbeat and positive with W. W seems to like that as well as the attentiveness.
This is very hard.
W has shut me out almost totally with any affection. I am very frustrated with that.
I have told W that I totally trust her. But having a difficult time with that as well.
W now wants us to help the daughters financially over the summer with new partment as well as use the paycheck I get get from a second job to pay back the oldest daughter that W used with sending youngest one a school trip when we didn't have the money in the first place. I feel like all I am good for is a paycheck.
Fearful that if I go dark, that W will go back to surfing the online dating sites and looking for that attention.
What do I do if my suspicsions about OM is true? Do I confront W? I feel divorce is not the answer. I can attest to that from experience. Don’t want to go through another divorce.
I am desperately looking for direction, support, advice and help...
So much of what your W writes reminds me of my D23, who is bipolar. In the bipolar world, the earth revolves around them and their wants at the moment. Anyone who enables them to get what they want is just that: An Enabler. The are usually quite intelligent, but use it for the wrong means. They are not good at relationships. My D23 is about to enter into her 3rd marriage. Pregnant. I can't be happy about another grandchild being born into her hell of a life.
All this just to point out that you seem to be trying to be everything she wants, and you JUST CAN'T DO IT. It won't help you at all, just make you more miserable, and nothing you do will ever satisfy her if she doesn't want to be satisfied.
This may sound cold hearted, but Marriage be Dam'd, stop enabling her. Do it for her as much as for yourself. Work on yourself and what YOU want. If that want is your W, then you are going to have to find another way around it. Withdraw you support, when she comes seeking, out of habit and expectation, set your boundaries. Seek professional help, take meds, or hit the bricks.
I say this from the experience of raising a Bi-Polar child, so I have 23 years of experience. I can't count the times my D has said "I'm leaving and you'll never see me again." The first few times, it leaves you panicked. Now it's just, Yeah. Okay. Whatever. She will come back because I am the safety net, just as you appear to be to your wife.
Decide what you want for yourself. You can't fix her, and she can't be fixed unless she is ready to do the work. Move your focus from her and her life to you and yours. Remember, unless you are a believer otherwise, you only get to go around once.
I am reading divorce remedy. In chapter 5 Michelle talks about therapists. My W was seeing a therapist, but W feels there is nothing being accomplished. W has said that therapist is asking her what she wants to accomplish. W is unsure. W has said that therapist had suggested about leaving me and moving on. That has not happened. Michelle also talks about that if a therapist is laying there own values on a client, that the client should leave that therapist. The question I have is do morals and values ever play a role in therapy? I get the Solutions Base Theory. When does or how does a therapist start to direct a client without interjecting values or morals, to a person who is Bipolar, is cheating on their spouse, they know its wrong and are having a hard time accepting that, to help them realize that they are not only hurting the people that love them but also hurting themselves. A bipolar person may find that the thrill and excitement of having the affair makes them feel good even though they know it’s wrong. Is infidelity in a case of someone who is bipolar a choice of being unfaithful and disloyal or is it a psychological problem.
I am finding myself having trouble sleeping these days. My wife has also talked in her sleep and been talking to the OM. a little nerve racking if I may say.
I am working out 3 days a week. Focusing on my business but finding it real hard. I love my wife very much, but it feels like we are roommates for the most part. She has started to become somewhat receptive to being to a little more intimate. But it feels very disconnected when we do become physically intimate. I long for that connection and intimacy we once had.
Unfortunately I did find out that OM still travels here once a month. I still have my suspicions which I am trying very very hard not to think about that he and W still see each other when he comes to town. I also feel that they communicate via instant messaging on her iphone. She is very protective of her iphone. Gets real nervous if I even pick it up. I heard W say the heart wants to do what the heart wants to do. So it makes me nervous when I hear those types of things. I have told W that I totally trust her. But have times where that is difficult to deal with as well.
What do I do if my suspicions about OM are true? Do I confront W? Like I have said before I feel divorce is not the answer. I can attest to that from experience. Don’t want to go through another divorce.
Still desperately need direction, support, and advice and help...
It is very much appreciated to those who have responded...
What makes you think you can control whether you get divorced or not?
Is your wife on bipolar meds? Abilify, lithium, tegretol? If she is not on any of these, then say your prayers.
My daughter and mother are both bipolar, my wife is MLC. One of the things I have learned is that you can not control mental illness.
So to answer your question, no you do not confront your wife. Let her go and detach from her. It is like squeezing a bar of soap. If you hold on too tight it slips away.
So my daughter (step-daughter / 18) approaches me with alot of apprehension and tells me that she thinks her mom is having an affair.
She wants to confront her mom. Daughter has had alot of conversations apparently with her dad who seems to have told her that mom my W, was doing this in her first marriage. He told her once a cheater always a cheater. Apparently she was having an affair with someone from work. That lead to various fights and arguments. Her dad ended up running and around and drinking alot. Lead to being an abusive situation. Daughter is real upset and angry at her mother right now. Daughter is real angry at life right now.
She has also talked to her older sister who is also very angry with her mom. Oldest Daughter away at college.
I am real close to both of my daughters (W's daughters).
I have explained to daughter that this an issue between her mother and I. That I ask that she let me handle it. My daughters are real stubborn and very out spoken. I have always encouraged that. So I am afraid that they will talk to their mom and it won't be exactly pretty.
So what should I do? Let nature take its course?
I am working real hard on becoming detached. I started to move into the other bedroom, but wife told me she wanted me to stay. Wife has told me that she loves me, wants to be with me, enjoys my company, but is very arms length or cold when it comes to being inimate. I feel like she is a roommate.
Very confused!!!!
Desperately need direction, support, advice and help...
It would be very much appreciated. To those who have responded thank you very much... You have been a big help.
