semi journal entry: ....I also went out last night to buy a copy of No more Mr Nice Guy, but the local store didn't have it. I went ahead and bought in ebook format
....I read half of it already, and I have to say it sure this hit me where I am vulnerable. Like the book says I really am having a hard time accepting that my "nice guy ways" are pretty self destructive.
....Which brings me to my next point: I come here to vent, to get a sympathetic ear, for advice, and the occasional 2x4 to the head.
...I have found the recommendation for NMMNG to be excellent, and only wish Young at Heart would have recommended it sooner.
....Just like the NMMNG and DB say, make yourself happy. Yeah they are not super macho activities, or what many would even think as worthwhile hobbies, but I DONT CARE. They make ME happy.
....So yeah not making excuses, just trying to let you guys now this IS what I like. The best part is that it gets even better once I move. So it is win-win! If someone here doesn't like that then tough! (That's NMMNG too you know)
....Ok now let's talk about W.
...Here is what is really starting to get on my nerves, (assert your emotions, see I'm already making progress. )
....I am not here for strangers to demonize my wife, or for my DB efforts to be belittled.
....Thanks to DB and NMMNG I am starting to see how my W's outbursts for what they truly are, manifestations of WAW syndrome mixed with depression.
....Calling my wife bats**t crazy and other things does not help the situation. Yes there are issues she and I must deal with, but a general attitude of her being of her rocker is just plain condescending.
Besides what am I supposed to do kick her to the curb? I swear I have been getting that vibe from some of the posts lately. I understand people have concerns, but please watch your tone. She is still the woman I love because she has proven to me time and time again that she is worth it. I am willing to fight for this M, and hope that this is just another bump we can get through. If all my efforts are for naught I am glad I can finally say it will be ok. I have DB and NMMNG to thank for that.
I hope I am not over reacting, but I sure don't like where this thread has been going lately. I need help to fix my issues, and hopefully the M. Not for someone to try to convince me that my W is worthless. I am trying to save this.
Ok rant is over....
I re-read the posts in this thread. I don't think anyone has said here to kick your wife to the curb or that she is batsh*t crazy. What I read isn't belittling your DB efforts, it is suggesting other things for you to read or try or advice others learned from trial and error.
I think that you have gotten a lot of good advice and several folks have opened their hearts to you and shared their own personal experiences on what worked for them when their marriage was in crisis. You are not alone. You are not the first person to have struggled in marriage. MWD has a wealth of experience in helping people save marriages. You have found a caring community. It just might be one that doesn't tell you everything you want to hear.
I think that you are doing an incredible job of figuring things out so quickly. It is also clear that you want to make your marriage work. You are a quick learner and committed to your wife, which is wonderful. There are elements to being a Nice Guy that are endearing, but as you now understand there are also costs and problems. I know as I was once a NG, who was focused on pleasing others at my own expense.
I also think that a lot of this has overwhelmed you emotionally. When my marriage was in crisis I was very afraid that I would loose my wife.
I also think that it is good for you to reach out to your father. I aplaud you for that.
You said you ranted and that you like an ocassional 2x4 to the head. If you will now let a 62-year-old man rant for a couple of minutes you might also get some of the avice you say you want from this forum.
Re-read Glovers book a couple of times to really understand what he is saying. It is about becoming a better "man," an integrated person, who takes care of his needs and those of his family. It is not necesarily about having fun or what you like. It is all about getting a life about living a good life that counts.
As cheesey as the website is, take a look at the suggested reading list of books Men's Reading list of 34 books My suggestion for your next book is a very dorky book called Being the Strong Man a Woman Wants. It is the story of a young man who goes on a hike with his grandfather and learns about several thousand years of collective wisdom in how men and women interact. As politically incorrect (and dumb) as the book is, there is a reason that there are male and female sterotypes, and that generalizations such as in the book Men are from Mars.... ring true to so many. You may feel that you and your wife are "different" and modern and above such things, but you may also be surprised (over time) what you and she both need deep down inside you. I can almost guarantee that you won't like the book and think that it was a waste of money, until you try some of the suggestions. (While you are at it get the Five Languages of Love by Chapman as if you really understand what he is saying it will make a huge difference in your life.)
Start reading other books from the list. Some will be full of crazy ideas that are just plan dumb, but might have just one idea that resonates with you. Even if there is just on idea, it is worth reading the book. Get the books from a library so you don't have to spend money on all of them. Again, you are embarking on a journey of GAL and becoming an integrated man, a whole person. That doesn't mean there is something wrong with you or with your wife. It just means that you are growing.
When you think you have things pretty well figured out, then and only then get the book by Dr. David Schnarch called the Passionate Marriage. It should scare the hell out of you and yet teach you so much. He views marriage as the hardest thing anyone can do. He calls marriage a crucible that melts and renders two people through pain, stretching and growing into a family. His view of marriage is incredibly hard work with incredible intimacy and passion as the reward if you do it right.
Again, you are doing very well in figuring things out. You have made amazing progress. I think that you are well on your way to trying to save your marriage. Ultimately, it will be your wife's choose if she wants your marriage to succeed or not. You can only change yourself and support that which she has chosen to do.
My advice to you is to try to learn from others who have gone down a similar path before you. That vicarious learning can be from books, from the advice of friends and relatives, or from people you share common dreams (such as those on this forum).
Be open to what others say. You don't need to do what they say or suggest, but you should be open, listen, and see what makes sense to you. Then you can experiement and try what makes sense to you. You can also ocasionally try something that doesn't make sense. That is what is so incredible of MWD's 180's and the success that they bring.
Sorry for preaching.
Good luck to you and your wife on finding happiness. I really do wish you the best.
>43 years of marriage--My wife and I are now closer than we have been in decades. I believe that my SSM is over.
