isn't it possible she misses her step daughter and therefore stays in some contact b/c she feels guilt for abandoning her and or wants to maintain a R with her?
The short asnwer? No. I have a lot of threads and it is a lot of reading but I have documented almost every single convo I have had with XW in the past 4 months. My D has a cell phone and she can call XW anytime she wants and vice versa but it rarely happens. The contact has been very limited. Without having to go back and quote the last 6 threads just trust me when I tell you this is not the case.
Originally Posted By: 25yearsmlc
For your d's sake, I'd say they should maintain a relationship. You have to protect yourself when it happens, but I don't find your ex's contacts hard to understand. But I know it's tough on you and is on every couple that has children. You are forever connected. Sorry you're going through this.
I could not agree with you more. I would have loved for XW to reach out to D and have a R with her more, it would be the right thing to do. They still do but I don't believe XW has handled the sitch in the best possible way. She says it is to protect herself and D feelings and that maybe that is wrong. There is no maybe in this scenario. It is wrong. Children suffer the sins of the parents.
Through all of this, have you ever just tried being the woman's friend?
Cat, I am trying to figure out at this point if I want to or if I can. I did NOT bring the convo to R on Friday. Sure I took the bait. Stupid of me.
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Having a conversation with her that didn't turn into R talk?
Yes
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Getting off of the phone at a good point?
Yes
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For her own reasons, she wants to continue contact, to which you haven't been opposed, even though you were advised to minimize it...
Ok so here we have a woman that did not feel listened to or respected or valued and my level of contact should have diminished? I will give you one better. My DB coach suggested not only I talk to her and allow her to vent but to initiate more contact with her to not go dark or allow too many days to go by without talking to her. There was a clear goal at that point. Bust the D. There is no clear goal anymore.
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Do you know how to do that with someone?
Such a loaded question. You know what one of my 180 was, to be friendly with her and talk when she called. If she would have called the old 2step there would have been 1 phone call made and that would have been it.
I could say so much more today about this subject but I won't.
For her own reasons, she wants to continue contact, to which you haven't been opposed, even though you were advised to minimize it...
Ok so here we have a woman that did not feel listened to or respected or valued and my level of contact should have diminished? I will give you one better. My DB coach suggested not only I talk to her and allow her to vent but to initiate more contact with her to not go dark or allow too many days to go by without talking to her. There was a clear goal at that point. Bust the D. There is no clear goal anymore.
The lack of a clear goal, makes your choices harder. In some ways...
The diminished contact, isn't for the M, although it does allow them space...
It is to allow the LBS some time to heal, time to regroup, time to be able to not "take the bait"...
Actually, even now, I see her wanting contact with you, as a good thing...or a potentially good thing...
Personally, I get the feeling that your XW is feeling pressure. Probably an internal pressure more than anything else. While she sounds certain in her choice, she is uncertain in her choices. It is all very confusing.
I read somewhere that a person who truly wants to end a M, ends it. Period.
A person who is uncertain, doesn't cut the apron strings completely...
Is there truth to that statement?
I believe so. Where that leaves the LBS...ends up being up to the LBS to a huge degree.
Originally Posted By: 2Step
Originally Posted By: Cat
Do you know how to do that with someone?
Such a loaded question. You know what one of my 180 was, to be friendly with her and talk when she called. If she would have called the old 2step there would have been 1 phone call made and that would have been it.
I always ask loaded questions.
I do know that your responses to this are different than they would have been.
My best friend, is also the man that I am in love with.
We started as friends and that friendship has grown.
He gets to see me at my blondest (which is funny, confusing, and frustrating at the same time), my angriest, my saddest, my most childish, my sexiest, my happiest, and everything in between. Somedays, we talk about serious stuff, other days, we don't talk about anything of substance whatsoever...
The friendship, is one of the reasons that I fell in love with him. It is the basis of relationship. If that goes, I don't think we will have much of a relationship...
Somedays, it is an effort to be friends...
He is a guy
And I can be ultra girly (believe it or not)...
Those are days, that we sometimes step back a bit, sometimes try a little harder...depending on the frustration level...
Other days, most days, it is ultra easy, like it was before the R developed...
I don't know that you guys actually got back to the easy part...
I get the impression that that is part of what your XW is looking for...
I could be wrong...it has been known to happen
It might be a place to start though...
Just by being...
instead of all of the words...
"Acceptance doesn't mean resignation. It means understanding that something is what it is and there's got to be a way through it."--Michael J. Fox
"Me thinks thou doth protest too much"...even here. When you get all frustrated, try to remember she had reasons for leaving that you conceded they were valid. You say you worked on you. Got your mom out of the home...
So it will take MORE time for your w to believe your changes are real and not just tactics to get her back. (Are they real?) If this is really the new you, what's the hard part about this? Not letting you heal? Then tell her that.
OR better yet, don't talk. Just BE, as in BE upbeat, And GAL which means ending the conversations once you realize she's not in an emergency room, ( 3-5 min of pleasant conversation is enough) b/c you're so busy with your uber fun exciting life, and 180's. You get off the phone in a pleasant happy way as if a good friend called but you were on your way out the door to a concert you'll be late for...nothing rude or curt. Just busy!!
And focus on parenting your d, who has now lost a mother for the 2nd time?? Ouch. How is SHE doing?
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
[quote=25yearsmlc]isn't it possible she misses her step daughter and therefore stays in some contact b/c she feels guilt for abandoning her and or wants to maintain a R with her?
The short asnwer? No. I have a lot of threads and it is a lot of reading but I have documented almost every single convo I have had with XW in the past 4 months.
Yes you do. I spent over an hour yesterday trying to find your original situation. I could not keep up with each development but I spent enough time to get more than the gist.
Your w was, in her mind, badly neglected routinely and over time. The divorce is a rapid one, true. But that doesn't mean the R is ending simultaneously.
Bottom line is here's my "beef" with your attitude. If she weren't callling you at all, you'd be angrily posting here about that. You would demand to know how she wiped the slate clean, forgot about you and d, and how can she forget all the good times, and what about all the years together and vows she took, and how can she abandon d and start over and not even look back or have any mixed emotions and...blah blah blah...
instead, she calls you. And you are upset by that. This is b/c.....well, b/c WHY??
What do you want now, from her?
Knowing that will help us help you.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Wow I can tell this is going to be a long night for me just waiting for michelle to jump in here with a hammer and a hug
Originally Posted By: cat04
Yup, I am always around
I know you are and I am grateful even though sometimes it seems like I am fighting you tooth and nail
Originally Posted By: cat04
The lack of a clear goal, makes your choices harder.
Extremely Diffucult. It is hard to set any real goal under these conditions. My goals do not depend on her but my goals do change depending on whether I see a future with her or not. Meaning, do I hold on to hope or not. I know that depends on me and that is what I am trying to figure out.
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Actually, even now, I see her wanting contact with you, as a good thing...or a potentially good thing
Again depends and the part that is confusing.
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I read somewhere that a person who truly wants to end a M, ends it. Period.
I agree but I will let you answer this Cat.
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It is all very confusing
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My best friend, is also the man that I am in love with. We started as friends and that friendship has grown
We all started as friends Cat and I have been told by Michelle, Jody and some others not to be afraid of being friends first. There is a problem with this logic in my sitch though, while no one can argue that you must be friends first there are certain steps that I will be missing. Among them the reconnection/dating part. You do realize this step would be completely absent and very important.
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I get the impression that that is part of what your XW is looking for
And you know what? Most days I will agree with you on this statement the problem there lies with me more than her.
Originally Posted By: 25yearsmlc
"Me thinks thou doth protest too much"
Ok that is funny.
Originally Posted By: 25yearsmlc
When you get all frustrated, try to remember she had reasons for leaving that you conceded they were valid.
I have never argued that she had valid reasons. I do remember and that is the reason I have done what I have done. That is why I came here. That is why I read the books. That is why I have worked so very hard on changing things about myself that I feel contributed to the demise of the M. However no one walks away from this with clean hands and at some point I have to decide to either continue to have hope or completely move on. When I decide to completely move on I will not be considering any kind of reconciliation.
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Got your mom out of the home...
This was always an option. I did not ask her to move in. I wanted to move her 3 times. My mom approached XW on several occasions and asked her directly if she was the root cause of our problems. She denied it. She asked me on several occasion NOT to move her out.
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So it will take MORE time for your w to believe your changes are real and not just tactics to get her back. (Are they real?) If this is really the new you, what's the hard part about this?
Again I agree with this but I agreed with it much more say 3 months ago. Are my changes real? I assure you that they are, if they weren't I would not be having this discussion with you today because any connection I had with her would have been severed. The hard part is that I am fighting myself. I am getting to the point where I am doubting I want to travel this road any longer and I am undecided. XW has given many mixed signals. That much is clear in our convo's. Is there anyone who has followed my sitch that was NOT surprised at the news I got on April 1st? Not in the direction I thought we were going at all.
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better yet, don't talk. Just BE, as in BE upbeat
I was actually warned about this from my DB couch. I remember a convo we had back in Feb or late Jan that I was very upbeat and was talking about how great things were going. That day I felt really good. She became depressed in the convo. I asked my DB coach about this. She adviced me that I might want to turn down the "doing great" bit a little bit because for a person that felt she was replacesable and not needed all that did was validate that opinion. So I did. Instead of being so "life is great" I told her how much she was needed. Not a trick it was actually a lot closer to how I was feeling.
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And focus on parenting your d, who has now lost a mother for the 2nd time??
This is my one and only focus at this time. In Dec and Jan I was at my worst and I took from her because I could not cope on my own. I am ashamed and sadden by this but I have worked very hard since to help her cope and to be there for her. Recently her mother started to come back into the picture, after she found out about XW and me. So for the first time in 11 yrs her mother decided to be there for her D. I appreciate that and so does she.
Last night I spoke to her mother for a few minutes she told me she will try and be there more for D because she knows that she is going through a rough patch.
XW says she does not reach out often because she does not want to give her false hope and to protect herself. Is this right? No! You spend 10 yrs with a child and you put your own feelings aside and make sure you are there for that child. As I stated earlier the contact with D has been limited.
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Bottom line is here's my "beef" with your attitude. If she weren't callling you at all, you'd be angrily posting here about that. You would demand to know how she wiped the slate clean, forgot about you and d, and how can she forget all the good times, and what about all the years together and vows she took, and how can she abandon d and start over and not even look back or have any mixed emotions and...blah blah blah
hahaha Nah. I have already been down that road. That conversation was very early on. I don't wonder that anymore.
What I am trying to do is separate reality from fiction.
There is little doubt I have received mix signals from my XW.
She is done she is not done she is done she is not done he!! even my DB coach was shocked at the news of the D.
She wants to read 5LL
She has said she will do 3 sessions with my DB coach (already done 1)
She filed and never missed a beat about the turning in the paperwork.
She never hinted she had done so.
She is 1500 miles away
Our contact is 80/20 initiated by her
Those are just some of the facts as I see them.
It is very confusing to me. I have had a lot of distractions tonight while typing this post but I want to thank both of you for the insight and lively conversation.
By the way how do you get the letters different colors? That is pretty cool.
There is another piece of information I will not post about tonight that I believe adds to the sitch and the aggrevation on my part and feeling of moving on.
