Hi to all of you who remember me and my husband ceberon and our success story in 2003. And hi to all the new people who have come over the years.
I can go over all the history another time but in 2003 I successfully used DB techniques to win back the H after he had left the M and through both his and my infidelity. We continued for what I thought were another 7 successful years. How wrong was I?
I mentioned over the years that I wish we had more passion - and I mean that in the sex and desire category. He agreed but neither of us knew what to do. For me, this was important yet not worth destroying the M over so we continued with it for some time. We finally decided to go to counseling over it about a year to a year and a half ago. We went through perhaps 4 to 5 sessions total (2 of those were individual) which is when he started talking about perhaps ending the marriage because of it. I thought we were in counseling to make a good marriage better, not decide whether we should be together at all - and so I was frightened when we started talking about D again. He agreed that it was getting past what we intended and we stopped counseling with a renewed sense of the M. (btw this is currently point of contention between us as to what actually happened) We never even tried anything the counselor wanted us to do.
After that he decided we should have kids. Further proof to me thinking that everything was just fine. I did get pregnant but miscarried within the first trimester. We started trying again after everything healed properly.
So we're going along a normal Saturday. He went with me to my personal trainer and liked it, so signed up for more sessions - I moved my training schedule to times he could make it after work so we could do personal training together. We went through a good day, going out to eat and spending time together etc. We go to bed, I'm almost asleep when he asks, 'Are you awake?'. Boy do I wish I'd not answered now. And then he drops the bomb that he wants a D. He says he's been thinking about the missing passion for months.. for years now.. and it's an important enough part of the relationship that if it's missing, our relationship isn't working. He's not happy, etc etc etc. He wants to do this amicably, he wants to get it over fast and all the usual commentary.
It's only been 3 days but he finds every excuse to be out of the house. He can't stand to be here because it's painful, awkward and stressful. He says he sees my pain and it makes it worse. Yes so far I've been talking to him and pressing things because I'm just so blindsided at the moment and reeling, trying to understand what happened. I got him to agree to a counseling session with the counselor we saw a year ago and he did but he's dead-set against the process, fully convinced it will do no good even though he admits we did not really try.
I know I should go dark, I know I should stop pressing it. I know forcing counseling isn't going to work. I know all of these things from last time. I know how to do this and how hard I have to work to save this M again. The problem I have is ... do I want to DB all over again? How many times do I have to be the one to DB this M? When is it time to just give up?
I'll explain some background on the passion issue. Most couples get together and have a spark or some chemistry that fades over time as the trials of life and whatnot occur. My H and I never had that. We were best of friends from the beginning and we grew to love each other. We had pretty minimal attraction on both sides but we are so very good together in every other way. We were that 'old married couple' from the beginning. I've never seen a couple get so many compliments on their R over the years... about how good they are together. We constantly get people saying that to us. But in the bedroom we lack chemistry, desire for each other, etc. It's hard to rekindle something when you never had it to begin with. Unfortunately we both assumed it was impossible when we never even tried anything the counselor suggested. We have both read The Sex Starved Marriage in the past, I'll probably re-read that today. As we both recalled, the predominant theory behind it was 'just do it' and well, we tried without a lot of success. I'd also like to point out that it's not just sex but that entire realm of emotions that goes with it - the desire, the need to be wanted that way by another human, wanting someone that way along with the sex itself.
Anyways, thanks for the read. I know it was a long one. Look forward to your responses.
Are you both in a shape that is attractive to the other?
Not exactly. When we first met, I was in good shape and now I'm overweight. He brought this up in the counseling and said as horrible as it sounded, it might help if I lost weight. I've been working with a personal trainer in the past and started up again along with diet etc. This was January before any issues were brought up again. Maybe not as fast as he wanted to see it happen but I am trying. For him, he's gotten better looking as he has aged. We moved a few years ago from Chicago to Seattle and he started making exercise a huge part of his life, losing a lot of weight and getting in great shape. I don't melt, get weak in the knees and he's not necessarily my type but he's not unattractive either. I don't know how to explain it other than that and I don't know what he could change. However I would say that for me, sexual desire is usually a lot more about attitude and the mental side of things than the visual. I know guys are more visual.
Originally Posted By: Jack_Three_Beans
Quote:
Unfortunately we both assumed it was impossible when we never even tried anything the counselor suggested.
That baffles me. Why not? Let's pay good money and not try any of the excercises?
Yeah, like I said I'm probably just as much to blame on this one. She wanted us first to fill out a huge questionnaire about love, emotions, sexual attitudes and other things but the kicker was that we were supposed to ask our parents all these questions. I think both of us were just too uncomfortable with that. Then the first assignment was about going on a 'date'. Fair enough this was supposed to be a special, dress-up, meet at the place don't go together event but we go out all the time, we didn't really see what it was going to do for us. You bet for sure that now I wish we'd tried it, changed our attitudes about it and maybe that was what was supposed to change, not the event itself. And combined with that, we decided (or so I thought) that we were ok and we had our own things we wanted to try. We left counseling with all intentions of sparking things backup.
[quote=Jack_Three_Beans] Have you tried changing things up in the bedroom? Do you have the opportunity to try? Or Kitchen, or living room or car. [quote]
Kinda, not enough though. He says now that nothing we tried did it for him.
I doubt I have the opportunity to work on it at this point since I'm pretty much in the other room and he's avoiding me as much as possible.
I thinjk I'd balk at the parents part too...but strangely I'm proof that they had sex, at least once.
Cal,
I think given an opportunity right now you'd have to seize it or do your best too.
Yes, guys are more visual and women can be more mental. That cuts both ways.
You have done this path before, anything going on that is dinging your suspiscions?
I also get the feeling that you and I share a problem in common, and if so...comfort food is a viscious cycle. Maybe I am wrong about that, but maybe I'm right. If I am right, get a new pick me up, ok?
Intentions are great; actions are much better.
Experience is a brutal teacher, but you learn. My God, do you learn. - C.S. Lewis
Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B. - Jack3Beans
Listen without defending; Speak without offending - FaithinAK
kind of have the same problem in my marriage. the phyical attraction was great in the beginning but kind of got to where it just dies down. This would be my fault. My H works 2nd shifts and I have a day job. Im home alseep, tired when he would come home. My H does bodybuilding and gets down to zero body fat...I dont find that attractive when he gets that thin. Also I wasnt raised in a very affection home like he was..not use to all the PDA. Has caused problems and then when someone is on you constintly about no affection, that doesnt really make you want to be in the mood either. Hang in there Cal, it almost sounds like you two are best friends just living together which is good & bad, you need to find that passion. "I don't melt, get weak in the knees and he's not necessarily my type but he's not unattractive either." This comment does concern me...keep up with your counseling even if its just for yourself to help you with answers.
W 37 H 34 No Children Married 04/23/2010 Together Since 11/2009 Seperated 03/10/2011 Not Yet Filed/Kind of expecting them anyday.
Almost done with the Sex Starved Marriage after a few hours of reading over the past 2 days. Three things have popped out at me so far though the rest is interesting...
1. Trying a little acceptance. Sometimes the problems in the marriage are small in comparison to all the good things. No R is perfect. Unfortunately this is the route I took that didn't really work with the H.
2. Little sparks. This one was an eye opener. As you can see how I said before there was no attraction even from the beginning but if I look for little sparks, they were sure there. And as I start to look at the issue from a more positive light, there were bigger attractions in the beginning too - no matter how short-lived that time was. Hmm..
3. Men bond through action. This is a side-note to the issues in our R about attraction/passion. He has wanted me to be more active and more interested in the things he does - specifically physical activities. While I'm getting there, I could have tried harder in this department and I understand why it's important to him now.
Sorry for the double post but seems I can't edit the last one.
In other news, we went to the C and it was a big failure. She pretty much said well sounds like H doesn't want to work on anything and he's got his mind made up. So you have to decide if you want to be the only one in the boat and it's a desperate and sad place, I would encourage you to not stay there. Ouch! Guess she's not pro-marriage... won't make that mistake again.
He still hasn't lifted a finger to file the paperwork so that's promising but he's so busy at work that I don't know if it's a sign of anything, to be honest.
He's still avoiding the house. I'm going to my parents for 2 weeks to go dark, get the heck out of here, heal emotionally and whatever else I need to do. He agreed to drive me to the airport (we only have one vehicle and he doesn't want it sitting in an airport parking lot). So we'll see how it goes from here.
Hi cal, sorry to read you here and welcome back...
I'm new enough here and since you successfully DB'd, I feel a bit out of place offering help, but support I can give.
I'd re-ask J3B's question, although maybe it was just me that saw the question... moved three years ago and he got into a "health kick"? ummm... OW...?
I wonder how a marriage that had no real passion or sex drive suddenly be a failure because there's no passion or sex drive.
Unless your H is feeling some unfamiliar "strains" and you aren't the reason.
Maybe I missed it, but was the prior reason for having come here? How did you DB and what worked for you? Have you tried it again? Have you tried something new?
Your focus on sex seems not to be his focus. There sounds like there's something else, and maybe he's doing the "bait and switch" with you. My W said she didn't have "the passion" any more. Claimed it was across the board. That was before I knew about EA and OM.
I can give you a million reasons why I don't think there is an OW. The main reason is because I was the one with the affair last time and he was really hurt, he knows how devastating that can be. He's not really that kind of guy in general. I'm not sure how he would find the time. Lastly, I brought it up a couple different times and he denied it saying he knew that was no option based on our past experiences.
Now even with all that, can we ever really know for sure? No.
His family is very active and he has felt bad his entire life that he wasn't as active. He took the move to Seattle as a way to change his life, his interests, his friends and everything.
I'm trying what worked last time. Namely - written communication that challenges his current thought processes, going dark and trying to remove me pressuring him and... time I guess. I'll see how it goes. I wrote him a long email that laid out everything and asked him to read and process, not to respond right away. H e agreed. Then I left for my parents and have plans to not talk to him. Getting me out of the house will allow him to relax and de-stress because he can't do it with me there.
He definitely does have insane amounts of stress at work. He often thinks about changing jobs, he works at work and at home and on weekends and all hours of the day. He looks at jobs in other countries, thinks about moving and just talks about making changes in general because he feels so trapped at work. I brought up the fact that I thought it might have something to do with the decision to D but he doesn't feel it is contributing. (I really don't know how that's possible but all I can do is plant the seed.)
It may be a bait and switch, that's an interesting thought.
The threads were passed around for years here since I actually got ceberon to log on here and interact with me towards the end of my DB'ing. Alot of people found it useful and got to ask him questions to get the WAH point of view.
He left me one day because he was unhappy in the R and it got to the point where he had to do something about it - get out and get a D. (Hmm does this sound familiar?) He ran to a mutual friend who knew that I was having an affair. She told him and became the OW in his life. He basically lived with her while I tried to patch things together from afar. What worked? Going dark and no pressure communications. Apologizing. Taking responsibility for my mistakes in the relationship. Being his friend again. Letting him feel like he had control over his life and his decisions. Respecting his choices. Periodically sending long, thoughtful emails about the situation and making sure he knew that I was still there fighting for us.
Eventually I gambled on showing him this forum. He is a very computer oriented person so he absorbed this and information from the books. The reason he came home is because he realized that there were tools out there that could help us work through it.
I just want to throw the caveat out there that this won't work for everyone. The key for me was that I figured out my spouse enough as to how he processed information, how he preferred to communicate and what made him feel comfortable. I then used that information in ways that I thought made sense.
Writing this has really helped me. I think we let things slide over the 7 years since patching it back together and forgot/stopped using alot of the things we learned here. Thanks for the opportunity to go through all this again guys.
