Standing for my live-in MLC'er/WAS

[angel61]

No. none of her friends do it.

[cat04]

Angel,

I am sorry that your D has chosen this path of behavior.

I would definately let your H know what is going on with your D as well as seeking whatever help you need to get her, however, I would NOT give him that letter.

Tell him only the facts. That she is doing this.

The letter, was full of blame and manipulation.

I am not trying to 2x4 you Angel, but that letter, is only going to make a bad situation, worse.

If he wants to know the whys...he can ask her and she can tell him what she wants.

If he were to choose to stay, because of this, it is simply out of guilt and you will end up repeating much of this.

As far as your D, educate yourself on cutting. The whys, and all of that. Do your best to not leave her alone and keep talking to her.

Show her that you are ok. That life changes and we have to learn to adapt, find the positives, and grow. What other people choose to do with their lives, doesn't have to ruin ours. Make sure that she knows it isn't ok to do this. That she has to find a different way to release her pain.

Angel, these are the things we will face. And sometimes, even though it isn't how we envisioned it, we face them alone. Help your D. Put your focus there. Let your H choose for himeself what he is going to do.

Post and get your feelings out here.

(((hugs)))

[Grace_O]

Angel,

I am so sorry that your daughter is cutting. Unfortunately, I have more experience with this than I would like.

“I don’t like therapy, it is only for people who want to talk. It gives comfort, but it does not remove the pain. “

In being comforted, you have a space to brethe in. if you can breathe, you can think about other ways of dealing with things. My daughter has told me that the coping skills she learned in therapy have been a life saver with alot of things in here life.

Do Not give you H that letter. I think you have a big expectation for his response. I doubt it would be what you hoped. There is way too much finger pointing in the letter. Believe me I understand. I wish I didn't.

Get on the phone and get her into crisis counseling ASAP. Depending on your insurance, you may need to go out of pocket.
It took a couple of different C's before we found one that my D really connected with.

DO NOT leave her alone. If it means sleeping on the floor of your room or hers. At this stage being with friends doesn't really count as not being alone. They're kids too.

I know how frightening this is. This is where you find the high tensile steel you have in your veins.

Find me on the alt if you'd like.

HUGE HUGS

[Grace_O]

Angel,

One thing I wanted to add is that given her age and difficulty she is having with friends etc., you need to accept that this is no ones fault and it could have happened regardless of the dynamic between you and your H.

It isn't your fault either. You may have to dig deep to forgive yourself and your H so that you can help her.


Believe me when I say that I know you want it to be b/c of H's actions. That would make it easier wouldn't it? It would feel like there was an easy solution. Let me share a favorite quote with you:

"For every complex problem there is a simple solution... and it is wrong."

-H.L. Mencken

Always? Who knows. I sure don't. It's a favorite b/c it has turned out to be so true in my life.

This is the evidence that she doesn't have (yet) the coping skills for some of life's messes.

She needs you to show her the way.

[PEI]

Angel,

First of all, let me say that I am sorry. It is never easy to watch our children struggle. (((hugs)))

Now, I am going to say this in the best way I can ...

Your daughter is not cutting herself because of something your H has or has not done. PERIOD. She is cutting herself because she does not have the skills and tools to process the emotions she has running through her hormonally infused pre-teen body.

Yes, your H's actions have caused her pain. But learning how to deal and cope with pain is the true issue here. What if a friend had gotten killed by a drunk driver? What if a classmate committed suicide? Angel, your D will have to face challenges and the bigger and better the toolbox you help her accumulate, the better she will be able to.

I also want to ask you something ... since research shows that these types of actions are usually cries for attention, what are the changes that she may be attempting to manipulate the situation? I'm not blaming her. She's a 12 year old in a situation she has no control over. She's also, based on how you speak of her, a very intelligent and intuitive child. Please don't take that the wrong way, it may be something you want to discuss with her IC.

Now, on to you ...

Your fear about your D hurting herself has brought the "old Angel" screaming to the surface. The letter you wrote was designed to guilt and shame your H into reconciliation. You are desperate to control the situation, and have him realize that you are "right". It might have even worked for the short term (although I doubt it) ... and then what would you have?

A house of cards.

You can not "snap him out of it" or "make him see sense". In fact, that letter would more than likely p!ss him off royally, as it puts the entire blame directly on his shoulders ... something MLCers/WASs are NOT fond of.

Handle this Angel. Like the strong, capable, independant woman you can be. Your daughter could really use a stable, strong female role model right now and you do have what it takes to provide that for her. Give him facts, if he seeks more, he seeks more. If he doesn't, he doesn't. Those are his choices and he must live with the consequences of them, including a potentially damaged relationship with his daughter.

Walk your path Angel, keep on truckin'...

(((hugs)))

Peace
PEI

[Lorie1964]

Angel,

You have been given great advice. Do NOT give H the letter. Look within yourself and find all the strength you have and focus on D right now. She needs that from you. Continue counseling and if this therapist can't help find another. Find a support group for her and yourself. Talk to the counselors at school and see if they can give you some resources to help with D.

H will look at the letter as a manipulation tactic. He may even look at D as trying to manipulate him, even though that is not her intention. Just focus on D right now and be the strong mom she needs right now. She said something HUGE that I don't think you heard, and that was she didn't even trust you right now. Show her that she can trust you right now. Be the mom, not the friend. Make her go to counseling and tell her it is for her find ways to cope with what she is feeling.

(((HUGS)))

[angel61]

Dear friends,

Thank you.

I am reading up on self cutting. And I am astounded that my D was able to correctly identify why she felt the need to do so - the need to control her own pain - very much a classic textbook case. I will call her therapist, and I will make sure she is not left alone. I learned she did it when we got home from SD last moday, when H was left behind, and I went to the gym. Last night I slept with her. No wonder, she has been sleeping with both H and I lately. all three of us in our bed, like when she was little.

She did not want H to know, but she shared it with me because I too, have feelings about harming myself and she could see it. I know, my D has never really trusted me much, even before, as I have been always the "fun parent" but the weak one. Even before, when everything was OK, I was not consistent, my parenting skills were weak. My H always knew that, a couple of years back, he even said that I did turn out to be a better mom than he expected; he always thought I had no maternal instinct. I asked him then why he still married me inspite of that knowledge; he said he had enough paternal instinct to cover for my lack of it. And truly, he was a fantastic dad and still is in many ways.

That is what hurts my D the most; the parent she trusted most, the parent she even chose as a 6 year old to stay with when we had to separate for while due to work, is the one letting her down.

It is true though, that this is a manifestation of her inability to release her pain. At any age, this could happen. I see myself too as having that inability, just like her I tend to find ways to hurt myself more, not necessarily by giving myself physical pain, sometimes though I do hit myself too or attempt to harm myself but I am more of a coward. I never felt this much pain though in my life before.

I understand that the source of pain could have been other things, and whatever it is, she has to learn how to deal with it.

But isn't it that part of the responsibility of parenting is to help them, educate them on how to deal with pain and suffering they will meet later on in life, while keeping home a safe haven, instead of the source of pain?

YOu are all right though, that I want to blame H for all of this. I do see my role as well ....my weakness, not only at this point, but from the start. But I feel so much resentment, honestly, if I could, there was a point last night that I just wanted to go over to H

I like to write things as usually, whe I start speaking, I might not be able to control and all the manipulative things will start coming out of me. I may talk to therapist first and then roll the letter into one big explanation with all the facts. I did tell him last night a bit about what she is doing, and he was puzzled, and quiet. I have no idea how he is processing it, but I know he is.

This morning H was particularly gentle and attentive to both me and D. He was up early, smiling and sweet and made us breakfast, and served us.

Thank you again, all of you. You have taken the edge of my panic. I will keep posting.

[angel61]

oops, I see an unfinished sentence. Last night, I wanted to go over to H, and just do something to harm him too. Let him feel what D felt when she cut herself. I know he is in pain but he is so hell bent on getting is own happiness that he has forgotten to think of others along the way. He has forgotten that being an adult means to say that the hard choices are for us, not for the kids.

[PEI]

angel,

Please know that it is my nature to play devil's advocate and challenge ... I like to look at angles you might not consider or be able to see being so close to your own sitch. You know your D best, as a parent, sometimes our own gut instinct is all we have to go on.

I also know that a lot of parents (and I'm generalizing here) tend to only see the good their own kids. It can be hard to accept some things. The whole "not my kid" epidemic.

All I'm saying is that it would be really good to be very open minded when talking to the ICs. I get that she is hurting and has no idea how to process her own pain. Sha has also lived in a house full of manipulation and control and subconsiously picking up those behaviours would not be outside the realm of the possible. She could be doing to control her pain as well as hurt her father and attempt to use their once very close relationship as a guilt tool. I wonder about her not wanting him to know ...

She did not want H to know, but she shared it with me because I too, have feelings about harming myself and she could see it.

This scares the hell out of me angel. How could she see it?

I know, my D has never really trusted me much, even before, as I have been always the "fun parent" but the weak one. Even before, when everything was OK, I was not consistent, my parenting skills were weak. My H always knew that, a couple of years back, he even said that I did turn out to be a better mom than he expected; he always thought I had no maternal instinct. I asked him then why he still married me inspite of that knowledge; he said he had enough paternal instinct to cover for my lack of it.

Children need parents willing to be parents. Parenting isn't easy, nor does it make us popular. Your D needs you now. Don't let your H's preconceived ideas of your parenting abilities set your course.

That is what hurts my D the most; the parent she trusted most, the parent she even chose as a 6 year old to stay with when we had to separate for while due to work, is the one letting her down.

Unfortunately, life is full of disappointments and let downs. It's how we learn to handle them that makes the difference. One of the important points to remember/learn is that people don't let us down or disappoint us because we are not worth better, they don't let us down or disappoint us because they seek to hurt us ... the let us down or disappoint us because they too are human and a mixture of our expectations (rational and reasonable ... or not) and their inate lack of perfection set us up for it. Sometimes they're huge disappointments and sometimes they're small ... but they all pass ... with time and healing. Not all children of divorce end up devastated, so there are ways to navigate this difficult time that won't scar them beyond repair forever.

I see myself too as having that inability, just like her I tend to find ways to hurt myself more, not necessarily by giving myself physical pain, sometimes though I do hit myself too or attempt to harm myself but I am more of a coward. I never felt this much pain though in my life before.

Work here ^^^ angel.

I understand that the source of pain could have been other things, and whatever it is, she has to learn how to deal with it.

But isn't it that part of the responsibility of parenting is to help them, educate them on how to deal with pain and suffering they will meet later on in life, while keeping home a safe haven, instead of the source of pain?

Sure, in an ideal world. But ask those children who grow up in abusive, violent, alcoholic or neglectful homes how safe their haven was. The world can be ugly, it ain't fair ... and it's not right. But sometimes we just play the hand we're dealt. THAT was a concept much easier for me to talk about then apply for a long time.

YOu are all right though, that I want to blame H for all of this. I do see my role as well ....my weakness, not only at this point, but from the start.

The truth is that there really is no room for blame here. There are cutters in all kinds of household all over the country, some of them living the supposed two parent white picket fence dream ... she needs tools and skills. Do not villianize your H or yourself here, and do not martyr yourself or your D.

... then roll the letter into one big explanation with all the facts. I did tell him last night a bit about what she is doing, and he was puzzled, and quiet. I have no idea how he is processing it, but I know he is.

angel, you've told him what's going on. Keep him abreast of Dr's appt times. He doesn't need the big explanation. He's a grown man, and if he wants info he'll ask or google it.

(((hugs)))
Peace
PEI

[cat04]

I am reading up on self cutting. And I am astounded that my D was able to correctly identify why she felt the need to do so - the need to control her own pain - very much a classic textbook case.

Angel, this actually concerns me a bit.

Not too many 12 year olds could spell it out.

Keep that in mind as you are trying to deal with this.

But isn't it that part of the responsibility of parenting is to help them, educate them on how to deal with pain and suffering they will meet later on in life, while keeping home a safe haven, instead of the source of pain?

In an ideal world this might be the case.

We don't live in an ideal world.

Even at home, sometimes pain occurs. As a parent, it is up to us to teach our children the coping skills that they will need to get throught stuff.

I like to write things as usually, whe I start speaking, I might not be able to control and all the manipulative things will start coming out of me. I may talk to therapist first and then roll the letter into one big explanation with all the facts. I did tell him last night a bit about what she is doing, and he was puzzled, and quiet. I have no idea how he is processing it, but I know he is.

Angel,

You told him. Leave it alone.

Your H is MLC.

He is in his own world and that is where you need to leave him.

It is tempting to us to try to take situations with our children, or sometimes even ourselves and our families or our health and hope that it wakes our spouses up.

We may feel like we are doing the best thing for our kids, but somewhere inside, underneath, we have the small hope that THIS will make the difference.

That once they realize that they need to stick around, that we can begin to work through the real problems.

It isn't going to happen that way. It just doesn't work.

They may stick around for a while, but when the crisis is over, they are right back to their shenanigans.

Angel, your letter was manipulative. It may have been out of concern for your D, but it read as total manipulation.

You freely admit that when you talk you can become manipulative. And you admit to wanting to and actually hurting yourself at times.

Do you see the pattern here?

Take care of your D and work on you Angel. You both have some behaviors and patterns of coping that need to be examined.