Question about the Men that left

[PEI]

Scylla ...

Every poster here has heard some variation of all the same things ...

I'm done.
I don't love you, and I don't think I ever did.
It's all your fault.
If you had ...
It won't matter what you do/say, it's too late.
I never should have married you.
You never ...
You always ...
I need to be free.
I need space.
I'm never coming back.

... and the list goes on ...

My point here, is that if Jack, HB, Butterflymom, Coach, imLin, BND or Lotus, to name a few (not to mention the entire community on the piecing board), had made their decisions based on the words they were hearing from their WAS/MLCers they would have had much different outcomes.

Just because he says it, doesn’t make it your truth. It doesn’t even necessarily make it his truth for more than the moment he says it in. And yes, I know you’ve been hearing it for years.

Running out to replace H makes the new R about the R not about the person you are with. If I promised you that if you were patient your marriage would be restored and, with work, be better than ever ... would you be interested? Of course I can't make those promises ... but your answers should tell you something.

Peace
PEI

[Queen_of_Swords]

Scylla ...
Hi PEImom!

Every poster here has heard some variation of all the same things ...

I'm done.
I don't love you, and I don't think I ever did.
It's all your fault.
If you had ...
It won't matter what you do/say, it's too late.
I never should have married you.
You never ...
You always ...
I need to be free.
I need space.
I'm never coming back.

... and the list goes on ...

Yes that's very true.

My point here, is that if Jack, HB, Butterflymom, Coach, imLin, BND or Lotus, to name a few (not to mention the entire community on the piecing board), had made their decisions based on the words they were hearing from their WAS/MLCers they would have had much different outcomes.

That too is true.

Just because he says it, doesn’t make it your truth. It doesn’t even necessarily make it his truth for more than the moment he says it in. And yes, I know you’ve been hearing it for years.
Actually I haven't heard it for years. It was more his parting shot, but I get you.

Running out to replace H makes the new R about the R not about the person you are with.
Not entirely sure what you mean here. Do you mean that I wouldn't value the person, just the having of a relationship - any relationship?

If I promised you that if you were patient your marriage would be restored and, with work, be better than ever ... would you be interested? Of course I can't make those promises ... but your answers should tell you something.

Point taken, thanks for the 2X4 .

My religious g/f says that God can be our father and our husband in times of need. So far.....um can't say I have experienced that.

Peace
PEI

[LauraOh]

Hi SC, I too encourage you not to be too quick to jump into another R.

I took a Divorce and Support Care Class (affiliated with my church) and the reasons were very sound why it's such a bad idea.

First of all, there is way too much emotion in you at this point--and proving that you are desirable and wanted is going to be WAAAAY more important than the person you are with. You could easily end up with the WRONG person. (And it's pretty unfair to do this to someone--but honestly, the right person wouldn't touch you with a 10 foot pole now anyway).

And get this--when that R doesn't work out either? People SWORE it was WORSE than the ending of their marriage! Because they were SOOO needy and SOOO vulnerable, the feelings were WORSE!

I was SOOO glad to have found that class when I did. I had been told pretty much the usual horrible things---I am selfish, I am lazy, he shouldn't have married me, etc. I was feeling lower than dirt.

I had a guy come out of the woodwork who showed interest in me and I did ALL the absolute WRONG things--first of all, the guy was MARRIED and I didn't even care. He said the right things! I was beautiful! I was the most giving person he ever knew!! my H was nuts!

You know what? a month later he was GONE. Thank GOD I never got physical with him!! And I was DEVESTATED!! It hurt SOOOO bad. But...DUH!! What a mistake that was!

Now I am taking a Boundaries class, am getting myself back in school, and am focusing on gettin myself healthy first before I go down any R path with anyone. I have learned my lesson.

I have good friends and I am having a BALL doing things that interest me. My H IS nuts, but I don't need anyone else to tell me this--I feel it in my BONES that he will kick himself that he let me go. I had my flaws, but I have made it my mission to ferret them out and deal with them. Yeah me! I am a person that can grow and change and be better for the experience!!

Him, not so much.lol.

[Queen_of_Swords]

Hi SC, I too encourage you not to be too quick to jump into another R.

Hi Laura, thanks for your response.

I took a Divorce and Support Care Class (affiliated with my church) and the reasons were very sound why it's such a bad idea.

First of all, there is way too much emotion in you at this point--and proving that you are desirable and wanted is going to be WAAAAY more important than the person you are with. You could easily end up with the WRONG person. (And it's pretty unfair to do this to someone--but honestly, the right person wouldn't touch you with a 10 foot pole now anyway).

Probably true. Right person? , is there such an individual?
Mr. Right vs. Mr. Right now?

And get this--when that R doesn't work out either? People SWORE it was WORSE than the ending of their marriage! Because they were SOOO needy and SOOO vulnerable, the feelings were WORSE!

I can see that.

I was SOOO glad to have found that class when I did. I had been told pretty much the usual horrible things---I am selfish, I am lazy, he shouldn't have married me, etc. I was feeling lower than dirt.

I had a guy come out of the woodwork who showed interest in me and I did ALL the absolute WRONG things--first of all, the guy was MARRIED and I didn't even care. He said the right things! I was beautiful! I was the most giving person he ever knew!! my H was nuts!

You know what? a month later he was GONE. Thank GOD I never got physical with him!! And I was DEVESTATED!! It hurt SOOOO bad. But...DUH!! What a mistake that was!

I am sorry a predator got wind of you and thought you were easy prey, that bites.

Now I am taking a Boundaries class, am getting myself back in school, and am focusing on gettin myself healthy first before I go down any R path with anyone. I have learned my lesson.

I have good friends and I am having a BALL doing things that interest me. My H IS nuts, but I don't need anyone else to tell me this--I feel it in my BONES that he will kick himself that he let me go. I had my flaws, but I have made it my mission to ferret them out and deal with them. Yeah me! I am a person that can grow and change and be better for the experience!!

Him, not so much.lol.

I don't know that my H will kick himself. In some ways I don't care because of my own hurt.

In others I love the guy enough to hope and pray he has an awakening and soon, and not for me but for himself. Inside that man whom I care so much for is a very injured and bleeding little kid.

Seems he's very happy living alone in his little one bedroom apartment in the middle of town and throwing himself into his work ( far as I know there is no OW, I have no way of knowing either way). It doesn't really matter what he does, that's not in my control.

I have changed a great deal and in a way am grateful for the breakdown in our marriage. It got me to a really good place and program to address my issues and I am doing just that. It's made me a wiser, more compassionate, less volatile , calmer person on the whole. Except for the occassional emotional meltdowns I still have, but they serve a purpose now and are just not wasted emotion. When I have them I know there is something there that needs to be looked at on a deeper level.

Backsliding is expected as long as the main momentum is still forward.

I certainly have enough to keep me busy, and I'm having a bit more fun in letting my wild streak out to play.

I thank you for relating your experience to me here. I will keep it in mind. Easiest mistakes not to make are those made by others, if you know about them!

[LauraOh]

Thanks SC for listening--you have already made a lot of strides here in a short amount of time!! You go girl!!

Another reason that I forgot to mention is that your kids need you to be present for them right now. When my "predator" (good word!!!) was around for that month, I was completely absorbed in him--being what he wanted, thinking about him (oh, whole scenarios played like a movie in my head!!), updating my look and wardrobe for him--ugh. I am SOOOOO embarassed now that I did that!! He was a nobody!!

And my R with my S15? What R!! I was "gone" in lala land. I can see how the "other person" can be sooo addictive. Even if they are so, so wrong.

My H too doesn't have anyone (yet) and is across town now renting a place. I have to be very careful not to mindread. It is a HUGE workout for me to get a grip on my emotions.

So every time you start to think about H and what he is thinking, STOP. You can't know. It is a waste of time. Think about you--and like you said--you are changing and it is ALL GOOD!! Are your friends/family/children going to benefit from the calmer, more patient, WISER you?? YOU BET!!!

Oh, and that little wild streak that is coming out? There is something about going through this process--you just, I don't know, DON'T CARE!! And you let her out and she's a BLAST!! Oh, have I had fun with discovering this!

Focus on the positives you have. The more you do this, the more you'll discover. When I start to mindread about my H, I make myself stop as soon as I can and think about things that make me happy--things from the past, the present, the future--there are SO MANY positives now!!--I didn't even REALIZE before how much time I wasted with my negative thinking. And how it affected me in so many ways and on so many levels.

I have truly started to, dare I say it?? enjoy this journey. I have a LOT of scary things happening at this point, including a violent H, but by focusing on the things that are positive and make me happy, I have got back a level of control in this that I never thought I could.

I hope this makes sense. It's hard to explain to the brand-new beginners--but I think you are coming along enough so that you can see this. And you aren't afraid of your backsliding any longer--GOOD!! You are using it to dig in deeper!!

I have been around long enough to see that this is true: The more you focus on yourself, the more you generate interest and curiousity in them. Your face is going to change--the calm, the focusing on the positives, the little smile when your "wild child" thinks of something naughty...

It's a lot of work, but Oh, soooo worth it!!

[Queen_of_Swords]

I already see what you're talking about LauraOh, and I thank you for elaborating on what you've learned. I see a lot of those processes in my self.

Often it's an uphill climb. I really miss my H in some ways. alothough my day to day life hasn't changed all that much without him.
In other ways I don't know why I put up with the level of neglect from him that I did. I often wonder lately, if I was loved, or just convienent.

Well that's not true, I do know why I put up with neglect. I was neglected by my Dad, it's what I knew, it was what was familiar, it was "normal".

Drawing appropriate boundaries and getting my needs met ( not accepting neglect as "normal") is going to be the real challenge for me. I have to have an in your bones understanding of what love/attention looks like for my brain to understand and apply so I don't allow myself to be mistreated in that way again.

As for the wild child...well she's really naughty!

[LauraOh]

That is why I'm taking the boundaries class. And doing a LOT of work on myself. I, too, have childhood issues. And deep, deep deep down? I always felt unworthy of my H.

He is gorgeous, smart, driven, ambitious, funny...

He also has many issues. I didn't know until I started this journey just how many he had. He is HUGELY insecure for some reason.

Many of us have these similarities--we've accepted a level of care from our S's that is really below standard.

Why???

The answer to this is IMPORTANT!! This is OUR TIME to find out!

I honestly think that I may have trained my H to treat me this way. My H started to truly disrespect me. But here it is--I think I let it all happen.

All of it.

When our boundaries are crossed, there is anger. Anger at them, anger at ourselves for letting it happen, etc. The trick, and boy, is it ever tricky, is to realize that we LET them cross our boundaries and not get angry at either ourself, or them, but just go back and calmly put the boundary back up. Calmly state how you will be treated.

It's actually pretty simple! But since we probably didn't have it modeled for us, we don't know what it looks like--at least I certainly didn't.

Boundaries provide safety--people know who you are. My H doesn't know who I am right now. He thinks our 15 years together was a lie. I know why he thinks that now. I didn't state clearly who I am and now he doesn't have a clue.

Having good boundaries, and knowing how to handle what you will do when they are crossed...soooo important!

I am fascinated by my own journey, can you tell?lol. I welcome the knowledge of how I contributed to this. I want it all--the good, the bad, the ugly!! lol.

[Queen_of_Swords]

I am pleased for you Laura that you've found a way to work through the mess.
I'm kind of down today. Feeling my situation is hopeless.
17 months is a long time for a separation, I feel, that the situation is permanent on some levels, and I will be raising my kids alone.
Yes I will be a better person in the end with all this reading, working and discovery about myself. Yes that is a valuable end in itself.
He77 of a price to pay for it.

[LauraOh]

I know it's tough SC. Hang in there. These days come and while they do stink, they are opportunities to work through things.

Every day is a new day. Every day you are here you are learning. Every time you post and get feedback you are heading in the right direction.

Every time.

Your mind is a muscle and it's going to get a workout. Your emotions will follow. Feelings are not fact.

It gets easier. But it is challenging at first.

You have some major positives in my mind. No OW, children, and your H is not happy in his little room working more. He's miserable.lol

He wishes he had the way to fix this, but...he doesn't. He doesn't have a slew of internet R and MLC experts helping him.

But you do.

Be good to yourself today!!! Promise?!!

[Queen_of_Swords]

You have some major positives in my mind. No OW, children, and your H is not happy in his little room working more. He's miserable.lol

This brought something to mind. I notice H is "hard" in his attitude lately. That's very different from what he used to be.
I don't know quite how to put it. It's like he's wearing an emotional exoskeleton of sorts. He has this steely look now where he didn't before. A mental resistance.

This isn't the person I knew.

He volunteers almost nothing about his life beyond work. I don't ask.
The chasm between us, seems to be widening, from my POV.

Laura he has the knowledge of the resources avaialable to help him fix himself and our R. H has chosen to ignore them.

This is part of my hopeless feeling. He knows, but chooses to do exactly what he's done in the past. Save see a divorced cognitive therapist that has written us, as a couple, off.


I will treat myself well today. Although all I want to do is sleep and make the world disappear for while.