Well my fellow BITS and all those who follow along. The weekend begins with an alert and a 2 hour conversation with my W. Before I get my 2x4 I will report that R/M was not initiated by me and it was more of a "soft talk" than it was a real heart to heart.
Before we get to the alert had my DB session this morning. I told Jody about the book and all the convo's W and I have had in the past few weeks. Also I asked about moving the convo along to asking for a trip. Another question I had was regarding getting out of the rut of talking about the M/R all the time. Here is what the DB coach informed me..
Asking for a visit: Not yet. You are not there yet. Take your time you are making good progress. Don't rush it! (this comment will earn me a 2x4 from all my BITS and Mach and Gritter and Michelle for sure.
The Book reading: Very interesting and very good progress. The fact that she read the book to begin with and the fact that she read it to you is very positive.
The Rut: Make the convo's shorter. Not every convo has to be 2 hours long. I think you think that the longer the better, not always. If she wants to talk then continue to listen but if you feel like it is getting stuck don't be afraid to cut it short and hang up. If she continues to talk R/M she has things to get off her chest let her. She is healing. Let her heal.
On taking the constant beating: This will happen. I think you need to listen and validate. If you feel you can correct the record gently try it but mostly listen.
About Ending up as friends and the fact that I don't want that: Every man shares the same fear. Leave it alone women need friendship. That is what you are aiming for right now.
Not mentioning the D papers: Very good. Don't!
Ok so that does it for the DB coach.......I think. Now to the good stuff. Ladies and gentlemen get your 2x4 ready.
W called small talk about work, movies, weather and life.
W "I am in so much debt because of these credit cards. I am not really sure how or when I'll ever get out of it. I am doing pretty good though I am starting to built a little savings and I am doing ok"
M "I think you will bounce back. It's too bad all this happened we were on a good road to get completely out of credit card this year. We had a plan and stuck to it pretty good"
W "yeah i know. I have some ideas on how to pay more and get out of debt. I tell you something I have learned. I sit around and think about how not to make the same mistakes again and one thing I would do is never have a joint account again or file my taxes with someone again"
M "why do you say that? I disagree with the account thing."
W "Because you always wanted to go out and I always went along with it. Sometimes we should of stayed in and saved the money. If I had my own account I would of handled my finances better"
M "Ok I get that but you know my way of thinking about that is if we are M we should not be hiding your finances or mine. We are 1 now if you were to say I am going to open up a separate account I will manage that account for our savings you are not allowed to touch it. I get that part. That makes sense to me"
W "yeah I can see that it is just simpler"
We talk a little more about debt and it started turning towards the M/R
M "You know you asked me a question last week and then again this week. You asked me why I was so mean. Why I did not value you? I've thought a lot about this and I think I know why."
W "Ok. Why?"
M "I didn’t do it because of you, I did it because I was not functioning well then I was in unchartered territory not knowing how give allegiances to my D my W and my M at the same time, and I screwed up. I chose to take away from the person that I felt the most secure with that gave me the most the person I took for the most granted and that was you. The person I felt the most security with is the person I took away from. I felt less secure with M and D so I over compensated by taking from you and given to them. I took it to the breaking point. I screwed up. I took advantage of my security with you I know to you if felt like I did not value the relationship but it was the opposite I felt so secure I let the R with you drop. You were the one really in my corner"
W "yeah but it should have never been a competition between anybody. I was......I am your W! If you were smart you would realize that you keep your W happy and everybody is happy. This is they I see it maybe I am wrong but it is how I feel It was a series of events happened between us. When I stopped talking to you because I felt like I couldn't this happened 1. Communication Lost 2. Friendship lost 3. Trust Lost 4. Intimacy Lost 5. Love lost This is how I see it. We interpret love differently. Talking is what matters to me"
M "Acts of service count for me. When you cooked my birthday dinner I loved you for it but if I would have done that for you I am sure you would of loved it but it would not have the same affect for you as it did for me"
W "Nope"
M "So I loved you the way I wanted to be loved. I bought nice things; we went on vacations anything you wanted was yours"
W "And I loved you the way I wanted to be loved. I talked"
M "yep. Commitment, Problem Solving Skills, Communication, and unconditional love that sustains a good M"
W "I agree. We lost those. When it was you and I life was great but then as our life changed we lost them"
We talked a few more minutes about this subject then she went off subject for a moment and talked about getting her mom a new door and a vacuum and wasn't sure how to pay for it.
M "You know W you could count on me if need be. No strings attached"
W "I know that H but I would have to be pretty hard up."
M "Pride"
W "yep. you would know"
She talked more about R/M
W "There are several things that really hurt me deep. 1. When we first moved to jersey we got that apartment and basically left me there to do all the work while I didn't have the bed set up yet. I didn't even have a place to sleep and you left (hope2011 sound familiar?) that really hurt. 2. When we were getting D you refused to talk to me about a plan. I was scared. 3. The night before deployment you went to get a tat and did not get home till 9PM I had left work at 1PM to see you before you left. You got home at 9PM 3.When I asked you to get another job in 08' and you flatly refused. I was doing it all"
M "Wow. You are so right."
W "I probably should not mention this to you but I like talking to you it's always nice but then I get sad. The sadness doesn't linger, but I get sad. Also I got the papers you sent me.....................I shouldn't tell you this either......you still feel comfortable. you are still comfortable to me"
Ok get the 2x4 ready....
M "W I would like to see you"
W "Wasn't expecting that"
M "I would."
W "I don't think I am ready to see you yet. I don't know how I would feel about seeing you"
M "I understand. I was just throwing it out there"
W "Why don't you hold on to that idea for right now. I am not ready to see you"
M "Ok. You know where I am at on that."
Then we started talking about other things. She will be cleaning the car out and we joked about how dirty it was. I also told her I would like for her to talk to Jody again. She did not respond to that because it was part of a statement not a stand alone request. She did say Jody was worth every penny from some of the stuff I have told her.
We left the convo on a good note but I gotta say this.
She is talking about future plans buying a car, switching jobs and she sees her future and it does not include me. That much I know. She also said she was not angry she was mostly sad we ended up this way.
W "I felt like you did not respect me or cared about anything I have to say. I don't feel that anymore but that is the way I felt. I feel like now you listen to me and now you do respect what I say. Like you respect me"
Otherwise, I don't think that anything was bad in that conversation.
You know, I'm making great progress with my W... I think... and she still makes little comments about future plans and they don't include her moving back into the home. I get a little sad about that, but then I remember that this is a process. Not only for us, but for them. We have to remember that they really did make the decision that they were done with the M. That is how the are/were moving forward with their lives. They are not ready to jump right back into the M... And I don't think that that is just words... it is where they are emotionally... It's going to take time to completely turn them around.
Patience.
BITS Denver
M 43 X 38 T 13 W moves out of home 11/2010 Roller coaster from hell 2/2011-5/2012 I request divorce 5/2012 W moves home 6/2012 Good time 7/2012 - 1/2015 I leave 3/2016 process of divorce
I know that I say this often, but your W and mine have very, very similar thoughts on us. They would have a lot to talk about.
BITS Denver
M 43 X 38 T 13 W moves out of home 11/2010 Roller coaster from hell 2/2011-5/2012 I request divorce 5/2012 W moves home 6/2012 Good time 7/2012 - 1/2015 I leave 3/2016 process of divorce
I know that I say this often, but your W and mine have very, very similar thoughts on us. They would have a lot to talk about.
BITS Denver
I don't know if you remember when I mentioned either last week or earlier this week about meeting someone who was going through the same thing as us. I told her his W has a lot of the same opinions about him that you have about me. Remember I mentioned that?
I was referring to you in that conversation.
I think if your W and mine meet they would prob talk for hours while you and I compare our level of a$$holeness at the bar!
