Shine on you crazy diamond...

[Firstlove]

Dixie

All good advice. I am on the opposite end of that conundrum in my sitch - I have written to my W those letters until my fingers cannot move anymore, I have sat in front of her and cried in apology until there are no tears left, I have travelled down the river of sorrow and been drenched by all of the rapids in that river, and she knows it. There has not been on tear from her in 5 months, not one. She has left and is not coming back no matter what I say or do and absolutely refuses to talk to me and has said so in no uncertain terms. When you W says to you -I am NOT talking to you don't bring anything up -that is a hard one to ignore.

So my only recourse is to show my love and devotion to her by my consistent actions and not by my words. I can only be her best friend and greatest supporter in all the I do. It is not an easy road to be on when the one you love rejects all that you do and refuses to talk to you for even 5 minutes after 33 years together - that my friends on here is a hard day.

I offer this from the words of someone who knew tenacity.

"Never Never Never Never - give up"
- Winston Churchill

and some words of wisdom from a pretty smart guy

"When you think you have exhausted all possibilities remember this - you haven't"
- Thomas Edison

FL

[Firstlove]

Lotus - I feel your pain about only hearing a few times from your H in 31 years of marriage that he is sorry for something.

I have been in a 33 year marriage and this is NOT an exaggeration when I say this. Know how many times I have heard my W come to me and say that she is sorry for doing something, or admits that she might have been wrong, or that she will work on some changes - ZERO - I have never heard that from my W even on time in 33 years of marriage. The reason I have never heard that is because she truly truly believes that she is incapable of being wrong on anything - its stunning actually. Just wanted to put that out there because most people think that is is just the men who take that kind of attitude - believe me - it is not - it goes both ways with men and women.

On forgiveness - it is one of the most difficult things anyone can do, for many, its literally impossible. I heard this in church the other week and it hit me like a ton of bricks. This was written by a man who saw his entire family murdered infront of him in the Nazi concentration camps in WWII. This is what he said about forgiveness.

"The true power in forgiveness is forgiving the unforgiveable"

For many, forgiving the unforgivable is simply impossible - they cannot do it and will not ever do it - and they will live in that prison of anger they build themselves and they throw the key away themselves. Love and unforgiveness cannot exist in the same space as each other. Until your spouse can forgive you, love cannot exist - love and hate cannot occupy the same space at the same time its that simple. Shakespeare said it well in the Taming of the Shrew

"Stoke not a fire for thine enemy so HOT that thy might singe thyself"

That is actually scriptural if you want to look it up see - Daniel 3:22

Love is the most powerful weapon on earth - learn to wield it mightly.

FL

[FellOnBlackDays]

Lotus, Denver, Fig, Pickle,
Thank you. I do appreciate the input. I am so happy I found this sight. I think the best things in life are free.

Lotus,
I would like to get back to your post. I want you to know that I want to apologize to you for all the bad husbands out there. You are correct. Men have this horrible tendency to avoid an apology. Yes, that too was me and I do appreciate you calling me on it. Why? Because I honestly want to change. No one ever changes when everyone is walking up to them, patting them on the back and telling them, "good job." Lotus, your post was a 2x4 to the face and I actually thank you for it. I am so very sorry for all the crap I put my W through. And, if I am ever given the chance to make amends, I will make it my life's work, HONEST!

It's just that my W is still holding a ton of anger right now. She plays nice with me when we are together, but she flies off the handle the minute something doesn't go according to her plan. She smiles at me, but there is some serious anger just under the surface. Her smiles right now are more like an oil slick on water. You can see it, but only in the right light and you can tell it is razor thin compared to what lies below.

I want to apologize. I rehearse an apology in the mirror every day. But, I just don't think she would accept it right now. But, maybe you guys are right. Maybe I just offer the apology and walk away not worrying about the consequences. I will give this some thought. Thank you, Lotus. Your feedback is always welcomed!

FOBD

[2stepboogie]

M “ I just wanted to call you and let you know that I am sorry for the way I have hurt you. You did your part on the M and I failed you. You were a great W and a great friend to me and I stopped being your friend and for that, I am sorry. I would have walked through the gates of hell for you. Never believe you are not a great woman because you are. I hope that I always see you the way I see you today. That is all I wanted to say. I hope you have a good night and a great week”

This was my apology to my W just this last week. At the point I said I was prepared to hang up, you saw the result.

It's just that my W is still holding a ton of anger right now.

They all are, if they weren’t none of us would have met. Anger is a temporary emotion and this too shall pass in the mean time FOBD continue to recognize and improve you because in reality that is all we can do. As the anger fades the only thing remaining is her evaluation of the new you. I have ZERO doubt if I was in OK and was able to see my W on occasion we would be piecing right now. ZERO doubt. You can use your interactions to display the new and improved FOBD. Lotus is 100% right, you can ask for forgiveness but you can’t demand it. She chooses to forgive or not but if you are truly making changes for yourself then I guess it really doesn’t matter which one she chooses.

[FellOnBlackDays]

BITS,
I am having a rough morning. It is 11:00 a.m. and I am still in bed. This hasn't happened in some time. I read Lost's post this morning and started to cry. It has been five days since I have shed one tear. Last night as I tried to sleep, all I could think about was Denver and what has been tossed into his lap. Denver, you are a better man than me. I just don't know if I would stand up to that kind of pressure. It is amazing to watch you work though. You are an inspiration whether you feel that way or not. I am so proud to call all of you my friends.

I am just down today because this "purgatory" I am in seems to be never-ending. Each day I come here and read about the awesome progress made by 2step, Lost, Bolt and Denver. Meanwhile, I have nothing to report. Nothing. I sit here and wave to you guys as you go by me. In my heart I am truly happy for you, but I can't help but be jealous at the same time. I hope you guys don't think less of me for this, please?

It has been a rough morning. I had three dreams about my W last night. I can't seem to stop them lately. In the last one, we were in our bed talking. We were laying a few inches apart and not touching. In the dream, I reached for her to snuggle with me and she accepted my advance. As I was reaching in to touch her, my neighbor cranked up his leaf blower and woke me up. I was so upset. I was just about to touch her and I came out of the dream. It has been five months since I have held her in our bed. It seems like a lifetime. After so many good days, today there is only pain and longing for her.

I had an amazing moment yesterday with my C that I wanted to tell you all about, but I didn't want to post any heavy stuff yesterday while Denver was struggling. Yesterday was about him and him only. He is out there facing the worst by himself and he needed us. None the less, I can't hold this in because it is killing me.

Yesterday, my C and I had this conversation:

C: (name), you seem to be making wonderful progress. How do you feel?

Me: Wonderful and foolish. Wonderful because I never believed I had the power to do what I have done in the past four months. Foolish because it took my W leaving me to make it happen.

C: Do you honestly believe that?

Me: Which part?

C: The part where you think that you had to be left to change your bad habits and your world.

Me: (Very, very long pause while I reflected then...) Yes, in my heart I now realize that my W had to leave. I was a jack*ss and I was never going to change. She had to leave and I caused it. I will have to live with that for the rest of my life.

C: You know it takes two to destroy a marriage? Right?

Me: Yes, it does. But it only takes one to start the process and I was the one that did that. I deserve what has happened to me.

C: (name), I am so proud of you. I have been waiting for this moment to come. Now, you can truly start over and make things better.

Team, I am crying so hard right now I can barely see the screen. I now sleep each night in a coffin of my own making. I have hated her for so long for leaving and now reality has hit. I can't hate her. I pushed her out the door. She tried and tried to tell me something was wrong, but I dismissed it as PMS or other crap. I am a fool.

So, this is rock bottom. It is very cold and damp down here. There is not much light and nothing to sustain life on down here. I have made such a mess. Wife, please forgive me. I am a foolish, stupid man who was living a lie.

Denver, I want to deeply apologize to you for stealing your thunder. Your confession hit me hard yesterday because I realized that I needed to do the same even if it doesn't bring my W back. It is just that I had this break-through yesterday and then came home to read your words and it has ll been too much. Please accept my apology as your friend and a BITS.

Damn it. I have to go. I can't do this right now. I can't be your captain today. Hell, I can't even navigate my way out of bed right now...

FOBD

[Mach1]

FOBD,



OPS


(Other People's Schidt)


Don't apply it to you...or your situation



Find one reason to get up and take a step...ONE thing....

That step will lead to another...

[2stepboogie]

Each day I come here and read about the awesome progress made by 2step

My progress is far from awesome FOBD. As my W points out on occassion, "talking to you is nice, I enjoy it, but it is just talking. Doesn't change a thing" That is like a kick in the nuts everytime I hear it. Maybe it is true maybe it isn't I will prob never know.

In my heart I am truly happy for you, but I can't help but be jealous at the same time.

Perfectly natural reaction

Team, I am crying so hard right now I can barely see the screen. I now sleep each night in a coffin of my own making. I have hated her for so long for leaving and now reality has hit. I can't hate her. I pushed her out the door. She tried and tried to tell me something was wrong, but I dismissed it as PMS or other crap. I am a fool.

The truth is FOBD once you see what you have done and acknowledge your role it is really impossible to hate your spouse. This is when the real growth begins, because now you face your actions, own them, and recognize them for what they are. Real change can only come when you have reached this point. Will it change anything in your M? Who knows? I do promise you that you will feel better not worse. Your W too will face her demons and her role but only when she goes through the same thought process. It is not a coincidence that 80+% of people polled after their D has been final for over 2-3 years have said they regret the D. The difference you are seeing things now and you realize the down fall now, so what can you do? Kill the old you and let the new you be born.

So, this is rock bottom. It is very cold and damp down here. There is not much light and nothing to sustain life on down here. I have made such a mess

Only one way to go now.

Denver, I want to deeply apologize to you for stealing your thunder.

Maybe I am speaking out of turn here but I honestly don’t believe Denver minds all that much. Besides the BITS have been holding each other’s hands when we fall, I agree Denver has kind of become like the Sir Lancelot of the group but you started the BITS so doesn’t that make you King Arthur?

I can't be your captain today

You must lead for there is no one who will accept the job!

Oh I almost forgot with your blessing I invited WhatNext to join the club. So why don't we go out there and show him why being a BITS is the best club we have ever been a part of.

[Denver_2010]

BITS,
I am having a rough morning. It is 11:00 a.m. and I am still in bed. This hasn't happened in some time. I read Lost's post this morning and started to cry. It has been five days since I have shed one tear. Last night as I tried to sleep, all I could think about was Denver and what has been tossed into his lap. Denver, you are a better man than me. I just don't know if I would stand up to that kind of pressure. It is amazing to watch you work though. You are an inspiration whether you feel that way or not. I am so proud to call all of you my friends.

Man, I know what you are going through. There have been many, MANY, nights and mornings where I all I have thought about was my situation with my W and/or someone on this boards situation... or how someone here was dealing with something that I didn't THINK that I could ever possibly deal with.

The thing is, is that EVERY time something has happened, or NOT happened, in my situation, I have figured out a way to deal with it.

I am no better than any one else on this board for standing up to what I have dealt with over the last 48 hours or the last 3 months. And trust me, MUCH of that time has not been spent standing up. Much of it has been spent with me just letting myself collapse onto my bedroom floor and just bawling like a little kid.

These are trying times for each and every one of us here. We are ALL dealing with what we are going through with courage and dignity.

FOBD, you have dealt with your situation with this courage and dignity whether or not you realize it today. Every time that you have been dealt a blow by your W you have come up swinging... EVERY time!

It is okay to have rough days... today is one of yours. This does not make you weak. It makes you human.

I am just down today because this "purgatory" I am in seems to be never-ending. Each day I come here and read about the awesome progress made by 2step, Lost, Bolt and Denver. Meanwhile, I have nothing to report. Nothing. I sit here and wave to you guys as you go by me. In my heart I am truly happy for you, but I can't help but be jealous at the same time. I hope you guys don't think less of me for this, please?

Again, I completely understand. Completely. I have, and still do, read posts here that make me jealous. All of the time. It does not mean that I'm not happy for what is or isn't happening for that person. It just means that I want whatever that thing is for my own situation. I would venture to guess that everyone here has had those 'jealous' thoughts about each other here. But it is also very clear to me that everyone here truly cares about each other and wants each other to succeed.

I do not think less of you at all. I think the world of you. You are here on this board. Fighting for you M. Fighting for you W. Fighting for what is important to you. I don't need to meet you to know that you are a man of strong character. I know this from your words here.

I had an amazing moment yesterday with my C that I wanted to tell you all about, but I didn't want to post any heavy stuff yesterday while Denver was struggling. Yesterday was about him and him only. He is out there facing the worst by himself and he needed us. None the less, I can't hold this in because it is killing me.

Yesterday, my C and I had this conversation:

C: (name), you seem to be making wonderful progress. How do you feel?

Me: Wonderful and foolish. Wonderful because I never believed I had the power to do what I have done in the past four months. Foolish because it took my W leaving me to make it happen.

C: Do you honestly believe that?

Me: Which part?

C: The part where you think that you had to be left to change your bad habits and your world.

Me: (Very, very long pause while I reflected then...) Yes, in my heart I now realize that my W had to leave. I was a jack*ss and I was never going to change. She had to leave and I caused it. I will have to live with that for the rest of my life.

C: You know it takes two to destroy a marriage? Right?

Me: Yes, it does. But it only takes one to start the process and I was the one that did that. I deserve what has happened to me.

C: (name), I am so proud of you. I have been waiting for this moment to come. Now, you can truly start over and make things better.

Team, I am crying so hard right now I can barely see the screen. I now sleep each night in a coffin of my own making. I have hated her for so long for leaving and now reality has hit. I can't hate her. I pushed her out the door. She tried and tried to tell me something was wrong, but I dismissed it as PMS or other crap. I am a fool.

So, this is rock bottom. It is very cold and damp down here. There is not much light and nothing to sustain life on down here. I have made such a mess. Wife, please forgive me. I am a foolish, stupid man who was living a lie.

"But it only takes one to start the process and I was the one that did that. I deserve what has happened to me."

I think that it is important that you recognize this FOBD, if it is true. This is where you will learn. About yourself as a person and as a H. Someday, this will be your EXPERIENCE that will prevent you from repeating it... with your W or someone new.

"I can't hate her. I pushed her out the door. She tried and tried to tell me something was wrong"

I know very well the guilt that you are feeling here. It is my guilt. There is nothing wrong with allowing yourself to feel it. In fact, I believe that we need to feel it and face it head on. It is the only way that we can learn from what has happened...To truly gain that EXPERIENCE. But eventually, after you have recognized it and allowed yourself to feel it, it becomes an anchor. You will have to let it go.

We can't change the past. We can only learn from it and use it to create happier and healthier moments for our lives.

Denver, I want to deeply apologize to you for stealing your thunder. Your confession hit me hard yesterday because I realized that I needed to do the same even if it doesn't bring my W back. It is just that I had this break-through yesterday and then came home to read your words and it has ll been too much. Please accept my apology as your friend and a BITS.

You absolutely do NOT have to apologize to me FOBD. We are all here for the same reasons... unfortunately. I'm sorry that my post hit your so hard. But I do think that it is important for each of us to face the TRUE facts of what has led us here to this forum. I wasn't... at least not completely. But now I am, and I am moving forward. You can, and will, do the same man.

Now get your head up... put your walking boots on... and move forward!!

BITS!
Denver

[Denver_2010]

Maybe I am speaking out of turn here but I honestly don’t believe Denver minds all that much. Besides the BITS have been holding each other’s hands when we fall, I agree Denver has kind of become like the Sir Lancelot of the group but you started the BITS so doesn’t that make you King Arthur?

Did Sir Lancelot also receive gifts covered in sh!t?

[Jack_Three_Beans]

Staying in bed today makes it easier to stay in bed tomorrow.

Feeling bad is ok FOBD, for a little while.

BITS never WALK alone, right? Implies getting out of bed.