DB'ing but it's a daily struggle - need support.

[ScaredinCanada]

Hey Scared. Just want to give you a couple of thoughts on your convo with your W last night. First, let me say that it sounds like you are doing a really good job of working towards detachment. Better than me in that area I suspect.

Now maybe a little criticism? I think that Habit is right. I think that much of what you are doing in the past few days is pursuing. This convo last night included. It's not pursuing bc you are telling them that you miss them, or that you want to have sex with them... it IS pursuing bc you are putting pressure on them. What kind of pressure? Every time you ask them how they feel about you, do they miss being physical in M, do they love you, has it been hard to be distant or cold towards you, you REMIND THEM how they don't want to be with you.

Look at your convo last night. You asked her if it had been hard for her to treat you the way that she has. What did she say? She sometimes but not usually bc she doesn't want to be M to you. You asked her about sex with you, and how did she respond? She told you that she doesn't want to be physical with you and hasn't for a while. You questioning her on these things isn't going to change how she feels. You are looking for validation for YOURSELF when you ask these questions. You want a particular answer. You wanted her to say "yes of course it's been hard to treat you the way that I have". You wanted her to say, "of course I miss the hugging, the kissing, the ML". All you did was let her mind organize her present thoughts about how she feels about you to be able to vocalize an answer to you. Remember, the more that we think and say things, the more we begin to believe them. So we don't want to remind our W's how they feel about us right now. They are doing plenty of that themselves. We want to give our W's something else to think about so that those thoughts fade away. Thus 180's and GAL.

Also, I'm not sure that your answer to your W's question about whether you had gone on a date was good or not. In all honesty, I'm pretty sure that I would have answered it exactly the same way that you did. Especially if I hadn't planned my answer ahead of time. In fact, I think that I did answer a similar question in a similar fashion with my W right before xmas.

But thinking about it, I MAY have answered it a bit differently though. Mainly to throw a little fuel on what is clearly her curiosity. I may have considered telling W that bc we are separated and bc we are not working on our M, that I don't feel comfortable answering those types of questions from her right now. If she pressed, I might have elaborated by saying that "I am behaving like a married man, which I am." and left it at that.

Maybe others can weigh in here on how the question that Scared's wife posed to him last night after he went out?

Ya I realize some of the things I said were likely considered pursuing but to be honest I'm just trying to enagage in the conversation and get some sort "update" on where's she's at emotionally with regards to the R or the M.

The answers essentially weren't good, but I still see the struggle in her - she doesn't know what she really wants and she's not sure if leaving me is a good idea. I can see it and that's good enough for me.

Now I will be detached again and I might try to work on being a little more distant and thus make her more curious.

Heck I bought a new kind of deoderant (just cause it was cheaper) and she was all puzzled by that...so funny.

Maybe I should try switching cereals or shaving cream and really f*&k with her head? LOL

[MrBond]

The fact that she asked if you went out on a date is very telling. She's still curious. When you go out, even if it's by yourself, dress great and smell great. Just mention you're going out and then leave.

When you come back, look very happy. If there was something funny that happened, casually mention it to her but don't engage too much.

Go out and do your own thing and be happy about it.

I don't know if I had ever sent you this link before, but read through the thread. It may give you some good ideas.

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...291#Post2033291

[habitacker]

I have also lost weight, 30 pounds, I hate it when people that don't know my sitch ask why. They ask if I am sick or something.

lol, I also have different deoderant. Went with that axe dark body spray. I guess I want to be that chocolate dude on the commercials.

[lostinscared]

Oh my goodness, I think I'm going to be sick from laughter. That's awesome, Habit!

[habitacker]

I will have to add that to my 180. My W likes chocolate.

[Denver_2010]

Ya I realize some of the things I said were likely considered pursuing but to be honest I'm just trying to enagage in the conversation and get some sort "update" on where's she's at emotionally with regards to the R or the M.

The answers essentially weren't good, but I still see the struggle in her - she doesn't know what she really wants and she's not sure if leaving me is a good idea. I can see it and that's good enough for me.

Now I will be detached again and I might try to work on being a little more distant and thus make her more curious.

Yes, continue to do things that will make her curious and don't give her much info when she asks.

If you see some of the things that you are doing as pursuing, then why do them? Now, if you read my thread at all, you see that I've done it too. But we should really try to not do things that are not going to help our situations. It's much easier for me to say this type of thing to you than to actually apply to myself.

But when you do this, you're not really getting an update. You are trying to fill an emotional need for yourself. Validation that things will be ok. Remember one of the first things that is preached here is to believe ZERO of what WAS says and 50% of what you see. So if she answers a question that you pose, are you applying that? If so, then you can't believe her answer anyway. So not only are you pursuing her, hearing stuff that only hurts your own emotional well being, but also wasting your time! You're also reminding her of the negative feelings that she has about you and M right now. And probably also annoying her. Leave her alone for a while.

Besides, I think that I can answer the question about whether your W is confused and wondering if D is the right decision... SHE IS! So now you don't need to ask any more.

[Sad_but_happy]

All, I agree being mysterious is good but a word of caution...

I went to the movies alone a few months ago. All dressed up and smelling good. When I got home my W said the following:

"Please let me know if you're seeing someone else. If you are I want to be able to do the same thing."

Of course I said I'm not. If your W is still in a position of feeling guilty of an A then this action COULD take that guilt away on push them to OP.

Especially if they are not invested in the M and looking for an excuse to leave.

Tust a thought.

[MrBond]

People who have been in an affair will believe that their spouse will be doing the same because that's how they were. And they believe that everyone is like them. They don't realize that when you learn as much as we have, we don't necessarily NEED someone to make us happy.

If she does say something like "Please let me know if you're seeing someone else. If you are I want to be able to do the same thing." Then just respond, "will do". And walk off happy.

Your answer to her doesn't matter. She will do what she wants to do and will come up with whatever excuses she wants to justify it. They think that since they were dishonest and cheated, then their spouse is the same way. With that knowledge, turn it into an advantage. They're going to think what they want anyway.

It's not manipulative. You're just being honest.

They don't need a "reason" to go to the OP. They already go before there even was a reason. And let's face it, there is NO REASON to ever get into an affair. EVER. That's just WAS gibberish.

[ScaredinCanada]

If you see some of the things that you are doing as pursuing, then why do them? Now, if you read my thread at all, you see that I've done it too. But we should really try to not do things that are not going to help our situations. It's much easier for me to say this type of thing to you than to actually apply to myself.

But when you do this, you're not really getting an update. You are trying to fill an emotional need for yourself. Validation that things will be ok. Remember one of the first things that is preached here is to believe ZERO of what WAS says and 50% of what you see. So if she answers a question that you pose, are you applying that? If so, then you can't believe her answer anyway. So not only are you pursuing her, hearing stuff that only hurts your own emotional well being, but also wasting your time! You're also reminding her of the negative feelings that she has about you and M right now. And probably also annoying her. Leave her alone for a while.

Besides, I think that I can answer the question about whether your W is confused and wondering if D is the right decision... SHE IS! So now you don't need to ask any more.

Thanks Denver. What I was getting at was I realize after the fact the those things were likely pursuing, but I didn't realize that in the moment. I also agree that there is really no value in trying to get an update on where she's at. I know she's thinking about the sitch, but it doesn't annoys me to think that she's planning her escape when we could actually be working together to try and solve the issues.

She also trying to validate what she's doing because when she asked me if I had gone out on a date, she said "It's fine if you did, I'm ok with that". Again I think she is hoping that she can just stay sitting on the f*%king fence and eventually I'll make the decision to leave and then she won't be the bad person.

D5's birthday dinner last night was ok, some tough moments with the W. Just trying to make small talk with her and she seemed pissed off that I was?! D5 was so happy so it's all good as far as I am concerned.

[Sad_but_happy]

I agree Bond... But if the tables were turned, I can see myself that I might go back to OW if I THOUGHT that my W started seeing someone else. I think they need to keep the guilt.

I'm not saying it's right bit guilt is a tool, IMHO.

It IS a game we are playing. Looking good and smelling good IS for us but let's not kid ourselves. We ARE doing it to get a reaction from our S.