Slowly building again.

[Harrier]

Oh Lord.

Why am I so horrible at taking advice. Everyone is screaming at me the same thing BE PATIENT, and I am for the most part, but not 100%. I don't know what to do about it because sometimes it comes out.

Last night, yet another R talk. I was kinda up and down and she ask me if I wanted to talk about it. I was hesitant really because I said I didn't want to cheese her off....which is exactly what happened.
I started by saying "I'm frustrated." Wrong thing to say. What she told me was that when I say that I'm really saying I can't be patient and I'm not respecting her feelings or need to take things slow. I def could see that point of view.

So it boiled down to the fact that she is having trouble getting over some stuff. She said that she is going to find an IC to help her with these issues. Basically she has a lot of anger at me and the situation. These issues are holding us back and she acknowledged that.

She goes back and forth. In one breath she says that what happened wasn't really my "fault" because the way depression works. She said I need to stop thinking about the past.
But then she can't let go of that when she interacts with the me I am now.

Also we talked about her feelings. She explicitly said she's not going to tell me she loves me any time soon and she might not ever because actions speak louder than words. She basically said that she doesn't love me know and is just starting to think about a friendship. Way behind where I am. She doesn't want me to initiate any physical touches or say ILY. I can show her how I love her by doing the things she needs - giving her space, giving her time and working on me. She spent a lot of time saying that we just need to work on ourselves first. I understand that, but we don't live in a vacuum.

So that was a kick in the gut. Some truth. But she did say she was really committed to working on things and did hope that we could get back to an R.
But then said it could take 5-8 YEARS to get back to where she feels 100% with me. WOW. I don't know if this really is the case.

She emphasize that she is still here, didn't walk and is willing to work on the marriage. For now, it should be enough for me. Then she went to bed and said as she was going up stairs, "Don't worry, it will all work out.

Okay, so I took what she said as she doesn't love me and barely tolerates me as a friend. I mean how, else could I feel.

So this morning, I was really mad about the situation. I mean really who wants to be in a relationship where the love is one sided. She asked me why I was grouchy. I said, "Really? My wife doesn't love me and barely tolerates me as a friend."
Then she gets really mad and says. "That's not what I said," "All I said was to be patient." Well, it certainly sounded like what she said.

she then added that if I can't handle it, she's not going to be honest with me.

So what is wrong with me. I can't go a week without pouting that things aren't going fast enough. I doesn't matter if I don't feel that way 99% of the time, because the 1% comes out. Darn it.
I'm really struggling with this piecing things. I know we are in the early stages of it. I will talk to my IC about this tomorrow.

I don't know what we will talk about in MC on friday. Honestly, I don't see a point other than to rehash this.

Sigh

[Jack_Three_Beans]

"Don't worry, it will all work out."

I'd take that as a good sign Harrier.

At the beginning of my marriage problems, my wife wrote:
"Have Faith" to me. Its become a sort of catch phrase like an I love you now.

Not feeding you crap here, not intending this to be an attack, only posting with good intentions, because this part is so very hard.

When she said it might take 5-8 years to get back to 100%, I can see how that would hurt, possibly even taking it as meaning she is going to be at 0% until 5-8 year pass. I'm not sure I'd take it that way, rather I'd take it as building up over that course from 25% today to 45% in a few months, 65% around Christmas...as an example. Not 0%-100%.

99% of the time your doing great and the 1% is when you think things go down hill. When your feeling that way, learn to STFU, just analyze it, see if it goes away, see if you can control it, if you cannot then bring it up.

Patience is a hard thing to aquire, and it's one of the things she needs from you.

Most people would walk through hell for their wife. But how many would do so not knowing if their wife would follow them out.

"But's"
I know...but...
But is just an excuse a justification.
If you really know something you should do your best to avoid the but.

Advice, are just words, comes from our good and bad experience, until your experience gives you insight, they'll just be words. When that does happen, hopefully the advice can help you color within the lines you establish for yourself.

[Harrier]

Jack

I keep thinking about the quote on the bottom of your posts. I mean I know what I need to do and for the most part it's not that hard. I honestly believe that she will come around a lot quicker than she thinks. I think the 5-8 year stuff is all of the stuff she's trying to deal with including family issues
Yet (no but) I just have a hug problem doing it. The other side to that is that I am able to get past those moments and move on. When she catches me in a moment it's trouble

She went out of her way this morning to profusely apologize for getting mad this morning.

The issue I struggle with is that I cannot have expectations. However, she gets to have them all the time - about me and the things I'm doing.

I see why some people just give up on the marriage though, because it can seem like you are at the bottom of a mountain, then when you climb a little you slip back.

I am also greatly concerned about the long-term effects of what's going on in our marriage. Not to be glib, but I wonder if the people who have gone through it can shed some light.

I mean this is a person who loved me more than anything in the world and now they are just trying to get to a point where the like me. I know my W is in that mode too -she can't understand how me, a person who loved her more than anyone else, could change like I did.

I know what happened with my W when that love was questioned. It lead her to the point she's at. I don't want to reverse roles over the next few years.

[Harrier]

God bless wikipedia.

Patience is the state of endurance under difficult circumstances, which can mean persevering in the face of delay or provocation without acting on annoyance/anger in a negative way.

I had a thought while reading this entry. Humans are hard wired NOT to be patient. I mean if you give a person a choice between a large reward in the future or a small reward now. Most will take the small reward now, even if it's not in their best interest.

Note- I'm not using this as an excuse. Just something for me to mull over.

[Jack_Three_Beans]

The issue I struggle with is that I cannot have expectations. However, she gets to have them all the time - about me and the things I'm doing.

A few thoughts on that.

First, you're here, she isn't. Meaning you came here to learn new things, some of it is just 'cowboy up' if you will. It currently is not fair, but I don't know of too much in life that is fair.

You can address her expecations, you can even use the term 'unfair' but I try to avoid it, certain words can be fighting words.
"I'm trying hard here, I'd like the benefit of doubt."

I don't think you're being glib.
I think you know that I am still married.
If I had to sum it up, I am glad for all the (censored) we went through, everything we learned, because without it, our marriage wouldn't be as amazing and strong as it is today, stronger than yesterday.

You don't appreciate something until you lose it.

If you (both) can get past the hurt and anger and appreciate the effort each of you puts in?

You'll be preaching here too.

I mean this is a person who loved me more than anything in the world and now they are just trying to get to a point where the like me. I know my W is in that mode too -she can't understand how me, a person who loved her more than anyone else, could change like I did.

I was there too, I understand.

She says she needs patience from you, seems to be a big item for her. Its not something you can rush, force or substitue.

[Harrier]

Jack

Thanks from the bottom of my heart. I hope to reach a point with my W that is better than it was. I will pass it on here for sure.

The thing is I know I can be patient. I mean I don't know if I told you but I'm a runner. I've ran 5 marathons and training for a 6th (Boston). I know you have to work over time for results. You have to be patient with marathon training. I don't expect results overnight and there are no shortcuts (sound familiar.) The only way to get results is work and time. Sometimes over years. I need to apply that attitude to piecing.

[Jack_Three_Beans]

For me,

I could see all the good things we had going or were doing, but (hah) one bad thing would totally upset or destory all the good.

I had to learn to back away from my initial reaction to the bad, figure out if I was over-reacting, if it really was that bad?

Communication was also a major hurdle for us, sometimes what she said, or what I said was not heard the way it was intended.

Unfortuneately, alot of this burden is your, simply because your the one posting here. I'd be saying the same thing to your wife, if she had been the one to come here.

Your marathon analogy, perfect. Time and effort...and later being proud of what you have accomplished.

[Harrier]

Met with my IC today. Gave me some good advice about addressing issues with my wife.
He said I can say things to my wife, but she needs some assurances when I do that.
Basically take ownership of the issue and say "It's really my problem that I have to work though and that's why I'm upset. " I'm not saying your feelings are wrong and I respect them. He wanted to be able to bring up issues without provoking her. Which makes sense.

Funny I got a weird vibe from my W the other night during our fight/talk. I got the feeling that she is way more optimistic about us than I am. I mean I want to get to a great marriage and she seems to think it's just a matter of working through things (time and effort) for me I'm not as sure. I wonder if it's because I don't feel the traditional love from her or it's because she dropped the bomb on me.

right now I'm a tad sick an W Texted me to ask how I was feeling and she was trying to get me to go home early. I used to think this was some grand sign. Now I realize she's not a robot and you can have compassion for someone you don't necessarily love romantically.

[MrBond]

""It's really my problem that I have to work though and that's why I'm upset. " I'm not saying your feelings are wrong and I respect them. He wanted to be able to bring up issues without provoking her. Which makes sense."

This is a perfect example of validating your spouse.

It's the anxiety of having the bomb dropped on you that makes you hesitate. Happens to many in piecing. You're also just being cautious because you don't want the bomb to be dropped again.

[Concerned_Listener]

Funny I got a weird vibe from my W the other night during our fight/talk. I got the feeling that she is way more optimistic about us than I am. I mean I want to get to a great marriage and she seems to think it's just a matter of working through things (time and effort) for me I'm not as sure. I wonder if it's because I don't feel the traditional love from her or it's because she dropped the bomb on me.

I think the fear and other emotions you're experiencing is natural. It feels terrible when the one we've been close to is distant from us. I like your signature line about patience. Enjoy the connection your W is willing to share with you.

CL