Little things can fix it

[haphazard]

Hi everyone,

I thought I would start afresh because I am having some fresh thinking and also the other thread was getting bogged down with parenting issues.

What you read next is how I felt 2 days ago, and not how I feel now. It was something I wrote up in Word and was going to post but didn't get round to. Then 2 days later I feel totally different. So I just thought it might be useful to look at how come things changed.

I feel I can’t keep doing this anymore. I feel the R is just not worth it. H is being OK at the moment. Not too miserable about stuff. OK with me, says ILY everyday. I say ILY back but I don’t mean it, I just say it like you say good morning to someone who says good morning to you. I feel no warmth towards him whatsoever although I continue to act as if.

Somehow I don’t feel sure of that DB technique, I feel like I already acted as if too much in this M and that has been the problem.

My problems with H (S) are very mundane and have been the same all along in 12 long years of marriage.

He is boring
He is emotionally needy
He is not fun, he is a fun-squelcher. In other words fun and silliness to him are a problem because things aren’t being taken seriously and life needs to be taken seriously.
He is physically unfit and unattractive – although if he were fit he wouldn’t be too bad
He has quite a low sex drive. After the “honeymoon” period it quickly tailed off to a couple times a month. I am talking about when he was still in his twenties! He is generally a low energy person.
He has a very low self-esteem which needs constant bolstering. Nothing complimentary I say to him is ever accepted by him.
He smokes and although he has tried to give up several times he has always reverted, even after more than a year. The last time he went back to smoking I was bitterly upset. I had lived through hell with him when he had been giving up and the thought that it was all for nothing just floored me.
He drinks far too much and I feel that he is probably an alcoholic

So you ask why did I buy into this package? Well I needed someone at the time, I had just come out of a 7 year relationship. The break up upset me a great deal, my ex-bf (D) was a very intense person and being with him was a very intense experience, being in love with him was very intense and when he had an EA with another woman the intensity of the split up was also very extreme. I was in a state of shock. After living 7 years with such an intense person I needed a rest. S represented calm and peace as well as warmth and affection and that is what I needed. I told ex-bf that he drained people dry and then moved on. He reminded me of that about a year later and acknowledged that it was probably true. He complimented me on the fact that it had taken so long to drain me. The calm and peace I craved and found in S quite quickly became dullness. D’s words came to haunt me, he described S as a nonentity, this was a phrase that he used frequently about people but it didn’t take me long to feel the same way about S.

Our first year together was exciting because it was essentially an affair and secret. I was still living with D, although I had known for about a year that he was having (at least) an EA he continued to deny it. I remember however saying to a close friend that S was my parachute out of the relationship with D and I did not see it as a long term thing.

Our second year together was good because we went back-packing round South America so the experience of doing that was engaging and we were able to get along quite happily together. We decided to get married as soon as we got home. However I think I already had some inklings of possible problems ahead but somehow suppressed them. A couple of times I nearly split with him during this year but felt I couldn’t because I didn’t want to be on the road alone.

Our third year together (first year of marriage) was also happy. I guess as newly weds setting out on life’s path together there is a sense of optimism. Also S, I think, looked up to me (I am 6 years older then he is and also I had been his boss at work – that’s how we met). He seemed to worship me, I can remember feeling that it wasn’t healthy that he should worship me but I guess I enjoyed it.

I don’t really know what happened after that, gradually the sparkle went away. I can remember him turning on me angrily one time and I didn’t know where it had come from but the gist of what he said was that he had been worshipping me, that I had been lapping it up but giving nothing back and that he wasn’t going to do that anymore. His parents said to me before we were married that they never expected him to marry. They have said it quite a few times since and I never understood them at the time but gradually I started to. He needs alone time a lot. Too much for me. He is a workaholic and a loner there isn’t any room for a relationship. When he has burnt himself out through working too much his primary need is for time alone. I decided to have children partly because I needed more company around the house. People to engage with not just someone who I could describe as being little more than another animal presence in the house, he breathes, he eats, he is warm to snuggle up to.. conversation?

I have been coming to this position for a couple of months now. My Cainercast last month said something like: “You are reaching the light at the end of the tunnel, however that light is illuminating some dank corners that you have not wanted to look at until now”

We were at a party on Friday night, the people there were all S’s friends that he knows through diving. He was happy and in his element. We danced, I danced. But I knew that I will have to do something, that he is NOT the one for me that if I continue to pretend he is then I will be just miserable for the rest of my life. I look at the kids and I just want to cry. I desperately don’t want to split their mum and dad up but I know now that I cannot be happy in this M. That it should have ended long ago, long before they were born.

I have been cowardly, I know I have. I should have split up with S while we were back-packing. Or anytime after that when I knew the relationship shouldn’t have continued. I have been cruel to him. I have probably contributed an awful lot to his gloomy outlook on life by not really loving him back the way he deserved to be loved, just taking his love and using it. It was my guilt, I guess, that kept me here but it would have been a far better gift to give him back his freedom than to try to repay his love with something sham.


Now I feel happy and fine again, and a sense of hope that maybe we can make a go of it. How did that happen? Well on Saturday S was out all day at diving lectures. In the evening after kids were in bed he told me how great I looked at the party, how everyone at the lectures had been telling him what a looker I am etc. I have to say I had made an effort. The OW used to be in dive club so dive club people knew her and knew the sitch between S and her so no way was I going to show up looking like the woebegone frumpy little wife. I wanted to make sure the guys would think S is completely crazy to try to walk away from ME. LOL can you tell I have an EGO

Anyway I say to S, so why didn't you say anything last night. I made an effort and it seemed like you didn't even notice. He said he was just too stunned and full of pride at how great I looked and he's just a dumb guy cause all he could think was "Wow she looks great" but didn't actually say it - doh!

OK so now I am realising that some of the reason I felt pissy at the party was because he didn't seem to notice that I was dressed to kill.

We wake up on Sunday morning (which is normally my lie in morning). S groans and says he hasn't slept through worrying about work stuff. So I just get up and get on with it. But somehow (I don't know how) I am OK about it.

S is super grateful, tells me how great I am. We lock the door on the kids and get our rocks off Sorry that is the only way to describe it, having only about 2 mins till kids break the door down, kill each other whatever!

After kids and S get back from swimming I say - OK haircut time. S has not had a haircut in months and was looking terrible. I have not nagged about it but it was driving me nuts. Sometimes I do cut it for him but I am not a hairdreser or anything so it doesn't always turn out well. Anyway I sat him down, got the clippers out and did it and it turned out good. I also did S(4) while we were at it.

Suddenly I am looking at him in a whole new light, it is amazing how much it can improve his looks to just have a haircut.

Sunday PM we go to a restaurant for dinner with kids. Apart from initially slow service which had me a bit mad so I said something to the waiter, we had a great time, the kids behaved and we spent about 2 hours at the restaurant just hanging out together.

We talked about it later and how nice it was to be together as a family and be relaxed. S said he was glad he said something about me being pissy with the waiter because it got it off his chest and he could relax after that. To be honest I didn't care that he had done that so I reinforced this new behaviour by saying that's great you can do that, I can get over things quickly.
After kids went to bed we did too and ML properly this time

I also told him about how much the haircut thing means to me and how it depresses me to see him looking grungy, how I like to be able to look at him and see a cute looking guy.

So to sum it all up
I was feeling crap because
We hadn't ML in weeks
S was looking grungy
We weren't spending any time together
I was feeling unappreciated


I feel better because of
compliments
relaxed family time together
ML
feeling he is making efforts towards R

take care all

Fran

[haphazard]

S didn't go to work today, he went to the doctor's instead. He has just come back with a diagnosis of anxiety and depression. Coulda told you that these past 8 or 9 years

Fran

[nikatnight]

Fran,

I could totally see H thinking and writing the same letter about me. "We never should have gotten married, I had my doubts, etc..."

It was amazing to see how quickly your thoughts and feelings could change. Thank you so much for sharing.

It seems that H was meeting your needs and that is what changed your feelings. That was very encouraging to read. Great job. Hope H will take meds for depression/anxiety. My H was taking zoloft for a little while. I thought it really helped but he just thought it masked the problem and he stopped taking them. nik

[haphazard]

Hey Nik,
Yeah it is amazing how quickly things turned round. I am not so sure I want S to be taking meds. I agree with your H I think it will probably just mask the problem. I have a friend who has been taking ADs for a few years now and she is always wanting to come off them. Says she can't trust her emotions when she is on them, feels like she is just floating through life on autopilot etc. I agree with you that from the outside the person seems great when they are on meds but I guess it feels different on the inside. She says she just feels like she is on happy pills and they make her feel like she doesn't really care about anything much.

I think there are alot more things that S could do to make his life better. He could learn to be more assertive maybe do assertiveness training or something, so people at work don't just dump everything on him. He could do more exercise and maybe do yoga or meditation to relax better. He could quit drinking. All of these things, I believe, could help him out without needing to go on meds.

He has already quit drinking - I hope it lasts.

Fran

[haphazard]

here's my last thread btw

Some sun with scattered showers

[haphazard]

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaagggggggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!

I probably shouldn't be writing this now as I have just had the most stupid argument with S and am still feeling completely mad

He is on a hair trigger obviously, since his diagnosis. Huh, like maybe that is giving him an excuse to be on a hair trigger. He just got mad with me over the stupidest little thing, and as soon as I try to point out that maybe I could get mad over some stupid little things that he does but I don't, he goes into his you always have to be right routine. No I don't always have to be right, but I don't always have to be wrong either. Grrr!

I don't know if I can stand this anymore. Since he went to the doctor's on Monday, she signed him off work for a week and he has been hanging round the house doing not a lot. I made it clear to him at the start that it was fine with me, it was his week off and I had no expectations of him. OK so day 1 he decides to give up alcohol, this lasts 2 days. He decided (of his own accord) that he would spend the week cleaning the house so it would be nice for Christmas. None of this has happened. This morning he woke up saying he would clean the guest room (ready for his parents to stay) and tidy the office. Today he spent the entire day in front of the computer.

We were having dinner together and had a little spat over how to share out the last piece of chicken. Totally minor and when I left the subject alone and started to be light-hearted about other stuff he still looked annoyed and didn't join in my mood. He said, all serious, we should clear up. Which we did (except he went out for a smoke) came back and said he was off to bed. I still had to finish up.

The stupid argument was over the fact that I had left christmas cards I am writing on the bed and they were still there when he wanted to go to bed. He says "maybe it's a cultural thing, but why do you have to cover every single surface". OK maybe I do cover some surfaces but he is NOT IMMUNE to this ailment. And me pointing out the fact that he leaves HIS crap about the place is me "always having to be right".

Just a stupid nothing argument but it has got both of us so worked up.

Can anyone help? How do I deal with a depressed spouse?


Fran

[dragonflie]

I have been on meds for depression for 7+ years. Read what you can about it. I can tell you that depression makes one see things totally differently. Little things annoy me sometimes that would not other times. Sometimes it is noise. I can't stand any noise.
I too like some alone time. H didn't care for that.

There are so many things that I want to do and need to do, but when depressed, I just can't seem to. I will let the house go for weeks sometimes til it bothers me so bad I get upset!
Try to be patient with him as it may take several weeks for the Zoloft to help. He should not be drinking with this med.
If you think that his depression is affecting him in what he says and does, just try to ignore what he does, and do the affirming what he says thing.

I know it is hard living with a depressed person. Just try to be lovingly detached.

[Mfl]

Hi Fran

I haven't posted to you in a long time but I have been keeping up on your thread.

I'm pretty sure that my H was suffering drepression before the affair, and he still is, but he doesn't see it. Anyway, before the bomb I was walking on eggshells because he would go off at me about everything/nothing. Every time I made a comment about something or asked him a question he would contradict me. And he would complain or snipe about things I did saying "you ALWAYS do this" or "you NEVER do that".

I got pretty sick of the petty arguements over nothing every day. So when he would do this instead of taking the bait I would agree with him then change the subject or carry on with something else. I didn't defend myself. Basically I just refused to be drawn. I know this is tough, it's not right and it's not fair but it's probably your best course of action right now. That and choosing your battles? I mean, come on an agruement about chicken?? Sorry, don't mean to be flip. You know what I mean though? Unless I was actually starving I would have just said "actually I'm full up, why don't you have it darling?".

Living with a drepressed person definately is not easy. And yes sometimes after a doctor has diagnosed it people do act as if they have an excuse to be rude and arguementative for a bit. I know this because I have suffered in the past and did exactly that. Try and read a bit about depression if you have not already - I think Amazon have some good ones on living with a depressed partner. How about reading the Chapter in DR on depression again?

[haphazard]

Hey Yanni, hey Dragonflie,
Thanks for your posts, they did me good. I feel like I have in fact been dealing with a depressed partner for a long time and maybe now he has finally sought some help there could be some hope. Part of me is feeling down because it is hitting me that he could be like this for a long time and suffer recurring bouts, but part of me feels like he has finally accepted that that is his problem and he is now going to (slowly) start to work on it.

Anyway thanks again for your replies, boosted my PMA to know people out there care!

Fran

[haphazard]

Hi everyone,

A weird couple of weeks here. H was signed off work due to stress and depression. He spent the week mooching about the house promising himself (not me I never said a word) he would spring clean but didn't get round to any of it. I left well alone, didn't ask him about how he felt etc. He had already made it clear I could say nothing right so I said nothing.

I think I did do some detaching though and that was good. Went to TK Maxx and got a bargain basement pair of Calvin Klein jeans size 6 woo hoo! Caught myself skipping around the house in them and decided that was fine, I can skip if I want to skip and H can mooch if he wants to mooch.

I read a bit about depression and decided that vitamin B complex couldn't hurt. H agreed to take them! That is huge for him. So I have been bringing him coffee and toast and vit B every morning.

This depression thing is so letting him off the hook on everything but I have decided that I don't mind. He is a roommate that is a bit under the weather right now, I have no expectations of him at all and that is working for me at the moment.

We had some of the doors taken down and stripped a few months back and they never got put back up. They have been getting in the way sitting in an alcove where we normally keep coats so the coats have just been thrown on the banister rail - eugh! Anyway I decided I would try to move the doors out of the way - which was a stupid thing to do because I have an unstable pelvis since childbirth. The thing is H never said - you shouldn't have done that, you should have left it to me. He never said anything at all about it, even though I was wincing and telling myself off for moving them (no not in a hint hint way). He just gave me a poor old you look and left it at that. He seems disengaged with life at the moment but I guess that is how it is.

He told me I had been fabulous! Fabulous at what? Well because I left him to it basically. My only thought is that he may well come out of the tunnel at some point and be grateful. Meantime I have a lodger who pays all my bills and babysits now and again. Better than nowt.

Fran