They don't get it, until they get it

[hope for zen]

Thanks for starting this discussion beatrice. Good topic!

I do think that every situation is different, though I think that the LBS level of detachment and setting boundries are more important than the relationship with the OW.

If the fear of losing the WS keeps you from setting and maintaining your boundries a reconciliation is doomed IMO.

Personally, I have a long way to go before my boundries are strong enough to survive a reconciliation. Not really an issue for me right now though. H is not interested in coming home.

[kissak]

You know A, My h seemed to find a woman at every place he was involved in. The fdept/ems, at work, even at my son's tkd classes. There always seemed to be a woman somewhere miserable with her sitch and was willing to give into my H because he knew how to make them feel better. Even had one woman that had planned to leave her H because she thought my H could give her what she wanted, even though he really didnt want her. Im just saying there is always someone somewhere that will be that woman to a married man. There are more out there than we think. I try to see the good in people too, I never wanted to believe that my H would be with all these different women, I trusted most of these women because they themselves were married or involved with Other people....

Good for you to be moving forward with your life. I think my problem is just missing who I thought my H was.

[beatrice]

It is true that every sitch is different, but there are also many similarities.

Many MLCers pave the way to the affair by becoming involved in pornography at some level - not necessarily hard core, but unrealistic stuff that draws them away from a loving monogamous relationship, to put it mildly. I also see it as a profound spiritual crisis. I don't 'blame' the OP - after all it was our spouses' choice to hook up with them, but many of them are very very disturbed people that most people would avoid getting heavily involved with.

I am tempted to say that the craziness of the OP is an index of the severity of the MLC . . . if they are with a real loony tune they have a really bad case! But then a few MLCers do not have affairs at all . . . .

[Augtan]

K- you are so right, there are tons of those people, imo, more women than men who will be attracted to a married man and wants to and is willing to listen to his lies and cheat with him. But, it also depends on the type of man, my XH just isn't the type that a ton of women are going to go after or pursue, he just isn't a chick magnent at all. So, while I know those women are out there, they are looking for something better than what they have (majority of them), not my XH who isn't going to be that. It would take all day to explain why and how my XH ended up with the OW he did, but I am confident he wouldn't have found another one anytime soon, at least while he was still living with me and trying to be in our marriage. Had he really gone looking, hunting and pursuing, maybe, but not in his personality to do that. He has no "game" so to speak.

And, what Beatrice says is true imo too, the worse/crazy the OP's are the more severe the MLC, the OW's in my XH's life (the second one is post D, but still considered an OW to me since he was coming and going from me when they were together) are just god-awful, horrible, immoral, lost custody of their kids, whores!! But, my XH choses them, because they are so awful and don't make him feel so bad about what he has done or is doing to his own family.

Of course every single situation is different, but many have so many things in common we can draw together and help each other!! I am taking Abnormal Psy. right now in college, went back Winter quarter, would love to be able to find enough in print to do a research paper on MLC, but not sure there is enough, it is truly a mental illness, imo!!

I know.. I miss my old H so much it is nuts. He had to have lost his marbles, he loved me so much, he looked at me with such loving eyes and gave me his loving heart for over 20 years!! I can pinpoint the moment in time that he changed and if he hadn't changed dramaticlly at that time I would have never been able to pin it down to a near exact time!! So sad, and even sadder for our kids who he was an incredible father to until he lost it.

That is what keeps me stuck at times too, believe me, I can say I am moving on, but I am mearly walking down the hall with the door open behind me! Stole that from another post...

A

[beatrice]

sorry you are hurting so much - like you I can pin point the start of this almost ot the minute. He changed on a dime. I accept it may well have been brewing for a very long time, but the change when it came was like a dam breaking.

You will feel better, but it takes more time - I am more than 5 years post bomb, almost 6 to the behaviour change point, and it is only in the last few months that I am really moving on, instead of going through the motions. BUT going through the motions is important, faking it until you make it gets you there in the end. It is a different time scale for all of us, but from what I have seen around here, it isn't uncommon for it to take 5 years to truly be able to move on, from a long and happy marriage.

I am now looking forward to my future life without my h. Not the future we hoped for and planned, but a different and full and rich one. After all, he might have got run over by a truck.

[kissak]

You know B, I am getting good at faking it until I make it! I am now 4 years into this. Of course my H has been back and forth so many times, its like I have to start over every few months. I often wonder where I would have been if I had never took him back the first time.

[AntoniaB]

This is a good topic. I understand every person on these forums who is in a place where they are trying to renegotiate a rel. with the WAS when the WAS is still with the OW but seeming to come out of it. I can see every reason why we'd want to do so emotionally. But my heart breaks every time I see that not working out too or even backfiring, because I feel the person who decided to try to reconcile when the OW or OM was in the picture must be beating himself/herself up now for trying or being sucked in, in addition to the rejection they are dealing with.

I haven't been in the position they've been in and doubt I ever will be, so I don't have to make that very difficult decision about whether to let logic or emotion control my actions.

But I do think that in general, the OW/OM is not the problem but a symptom of the larger issues of the marriage, and even more than that, the larger issues of the WAS who is running/not willing to face his/her demons. Therefore, I think until the WAS is able him or herself to understand that the OM/OW was a symptom, there isn't much hope for true reconciliation. They have to get to a point where they, like us, see the affair as the symptom of something greater. As long as they hold on to that affair as being "true love", even should that affair break up because THEY get dumped or cheated on, they are never going to "get it" and until they get it, any relationship we have with them is bound to fall apart. That's my 2 cents ;-)

[sarahani]

Hi can someone help me figure out what signs to look for in MLC? My husband is 32 but much of what I've read and his actions are making me lean towards MLC.

Any input would be greatly appreciate.

[MrBond]

Basically an MLC or life change is triggered by some kind of shake up in their life. Death of a family member, divorce, job change/loss, birth of child, retirement, etc. From there, there is a shedding of the old persona and a new one emerges.

[dolphin_05]

Sarahani, in Divorce remedy there is a chapter on MLC. I'm sure you would find this chapter very helpful in your understanding of MLC.