I was wondering, what should I do next with my SITCH? Living apart from my W. Hardly any contact. W says she misses me everyday. But that's all she says.
Should I just let things be? I did go dark for the most part. Except for a brief email saying happy new year on December 30th.
I wouldn't know what to say or how to proceed anyway. Besides W knows how I feel.
Sandi, sgt, truegritter, dbmod, grocery any advice? In spite of you people never addressing my SITCH, I have gotten alot out of what you have told other people.
well HRT i will jump on hear since i have successfully DBd before but am back 3 years later. From what im told and read, the emails are pursuing as well. going dark is going dark. No contact. like you turn off the light, in a room with no windows you cant do anything. Hope you understand what im saying. I made all those mistakes the first time. Then there was absolutely NC for 3.5 months. One day she called me up and said she didnt want to be 39 and divorced with a child. lets goto counseling etc. We did, then we had a baby 22 months ago and here i am again, i guess the baby got in the way of me keeping myself straight. I got the following from a old friend on here dont know if hes still registered but it is a success story.
After a long series of fights and some significant disillusion on my wife’s part regarding our marriage, we separated Oct. 29th of 2005. Married for 5 years with one young daughter. Regrettably, I moved out and as far as my wife was concerned, our marriage was over. Like so many of you out there, I was devastated. Fortunately, after the first few weeks, I found this website and Michelle’s book. Without a doubt, the advice and experiences that I gleaned from both the book and this board saved my marriage and gave me some sanity during my separation. After 5 long months, my wife and I have reconciled and our marriage is stronger than ever. We still have some healing to do, but I am back home with my wife and daughter. I thought it would be fitting to share what I have learned during the process, and reiterate some key elements of Michelle’s program that I found critical.
Before doing so, I should point out that my situation may be different than some. For one, there was not another man in the picture and my wife remained celibate during our separation as did I. The breakdown of my marriage stemmed from her anger and hurt that resulted mostly from my behavior. Biggies included: 1) an addiction to online pornography, 2) working too much, 3) partying too much and 4) not meeting her emotional needs. So some of you may be in a slightly different situation, particularly if there is an EA or PA in the works. Either of these adds another layer of complexity to a marriage breakdown. Also, at times I thought for sure my marriage was over. I was on the proverbial rollercoaster, and heard those terrible words after everything seemed to be going ok: “I don’t want any contact from this point forward, you will hear from me in about a month to work out the details…my decision is final. I wish you luck…” blah, blah, blah…..A month and half later I moved back home. BUT, some of you will not, and I have been through it once already, and you have to remember that you will heal and there will be a future, and it might be a lot better than the past.
Regardless, below are the most important things I learned and applied from DBing:
1. Buy Divorce Busting and the books and read them five times, and them read five more times.
2. Give her space and don’t pressure: This - my friends - is numero uno. If you cannot do this, you WILL surely end your marriage or at minimum prolong emotional and physical distance between you and your spouse indefinitely. Don’t believe me? Then keep doing it and see what happens. I know it is hard, and yes, it was unbelievably frustrating for me. At first I did not succeed, and it really pissed her off. To you such behavior may seem as if you are showing your commitment and love, but to her, you are being selfish and disrespectful. My wife told me recently that one of the most important things I did during our separation was to back off and let her think. She needed to MISS ME. Last Christmas she went home to her parents (who by the way despise me and still do) and I drove across the country to see my family. I did not call or email for two weeks. Guess who started to call and email me saying she missed me within a week or so? SO, this means stop calling, stop emailing, stop text messaging, stop asking for dates/time together etc. etc. If you want her back, LEAVE HER ALONE. Pressure speaks volumes about desperation and weakness – something women find incredibly unattractive. Women want someone who is strong, silent and dependable. Begging, pleading, crying, manipulating and trying to convince her to change her mind will only make you repulsive and WILL push her out the door faster than anything else! You have to be strong and cool. This does not mean you should ignore her completely. But in general, let her contact you, and if she won’t, DON’T pick up the phone or email. Let her know occasionally that you are her friend and you are there for her or your kids (if you have any) if they/she need anything. And I mean, a one or two sentence email or voicemail, and don’t tell her you love her and miss her, and don’t use this as an excuse to get her on the phone and start blabbering about how much you love her, want a second chance, will change, want to make it work…blah blah blah, because all that she hears is exactly that - “blah, blah, blah, whine, whine, whine moan, moan, moan.” She hears a pathetic, frightened man (which we all are when we going through this) but don’t let her see it. Who wants to live with and depend upon someone like this? I wouldn’t. So, for God’s sake people, IF YOU WANT HER BACK LEAVE HER ALONE. She is driving this train, and you have to accept that. Patience is your indispensable ally. Cloying attempts at affection and desperation are your enemies. There is nothing you can say or do to change her mind. If she does change her mind, it will be on her terms and her schedule – period. No pressure also means NO ULTIMATIUMS such as “you have one month to make a decision, or I am going to file for divorce.” This is a very bad idea. You will likely get it. Keep your mouth shut and back off.
3. When you are together ALWAYS AGREE, keep your mouth shut and LISTEN intently to every word she says: When you do get chance to talk to her or spend time with her – and you will – ALWAYS try your hardest to be upbeat, positive, friendly, considerate and DON’T get angry or talk about your feelings and what YOU WANT. Stay positive and don’t bring up the relationship unless she does, and when she does, keep your trap shut and listen to everything she says. Want to stay out of trouble? Listen. Want to get back in the house? Listen. Want to have a long loving relationship? Listen. My God, listen till the blood drips from your ears; listen till you want to scream out a solution; listen until she has nothing left to say and when she’s done, shut up and listen some more. Women are the caregivers and if you want her to give, you’d better do some caring. Not only should you listen, but when you do speak, always AGREE. Validate what she says, and don’t argue. For example, “you were a complete jerk, you hurt me, you never spent time with our family, you’re selfish, you have two heads, the moon is made of chocolate etc etc…” I don’t care what she says, just say…”You’re right…I was a jerk, I am sorry and I screwed up…and your right the moon is made of chocolate and I have two heads. If you want me to leave, I understand, your right, maybe it would never work, but I do love you and I’ll always be here for you and the kids if you need anything.” It works people. When she starts talking about your failures and why the marriage was so horrible, much of which is probably true, she is waiting for you to react in anger, hurt, frustration, and let you say horrible things to her, blame her for everything and storm out of the house because this is the type of behavior that validates her thoughts, expectations and rationalizations for walking away. Such behavior will make her feel better. When you DON’T act like this, it will throw her for a loop and she will be completely bewildered. Try it. But you have to be consistent. As aside, this doesn’t mean you should be a doormat. This simply means listening and validating her feelings, thoughts and emotions regarding you, her and the marriage. It does not mean that you have to accept ridiculous requests regarding things such as financial or property issues. If these come up, respectfully and calmly disagree. In fact, you can use them to buy time. For example, you might say: “that is not acceptable to me at this point, and it is something we can negotiate or work out in a few weeks, but I am sure we can find an amiable middle ground. I don’t want you and the kids to be a bad position. Remember I am your best friend regardless of what happens.”
4. Change (do the 180s) and don’t tell her you have or are changing: Now this one is actually as important as the first one because if don’t make some changes, then you will be back in the same boat soon enough. Also, the changes will make you happier. In my case, I had to do some serious soul searching and self analyzing that included counseling and joining a support group for sexual addiction (i.e., online pornography). Both have helped me immensely. Now…you cannot tell your wife that you are or have changed. Words don’t mean sh** especially to our estranged spouses. Actions speak louder than words, and make sure the changes and self realizations are genuine. She will be watching even if you don’t realize it; and your behavior will be scrutinized very closely. She is examining everything under a microscope under high magnification, and please don’t try and B.S. or manipulate her. Women hate it when they perceive that they are being manipulated in a relationship. She will see right through it like panes of glass…trust me on this one. In some cases, they will get really pissed when you start making changes and start cater wallowing about why you didn’t do these things before you separated and cause everyone so much pain…etc. etc. “why did it take this for you to realize you needed some help.” Let them say it….respond with something like “men are insulated and sometimes it takes something really devastating before we realize our shortcomings” and this is true of course.
5. “Get a life” (GAL) or at least act like you are getting a life and doing “just fine:” Go to the gym, go hiking, take trips, go for a walk, take classes. You get the idea. They are not going to want to come back to you until they can see that you are strong enough to survive without them, and anyway, doing things might make you feel better. In my case, only the trips really helped and in general I felt pretty crappy regardless of what I was doing. BUT, don’t let them know this. Don’t show it. Fake it if you have to. If you are doing fun and interesting things, they will wonder about it, and probably wish they were doing them with you. However, as is the case with your 180s, it may piss them off. I remember my wife saying something like “oh, now you are having fun and doing all these wonderful and positive things that you would never do with me...guess my love wasn’t enough.” Let them say it, shut up and keep doing what you are doing because it is getting their attention. If anything, say something like “you would love for them to join you but are not going to push because you are respecting their need for space and time.” What about “going dark?” You have to be careful with this one because it can backfire depending upon your situation. In mine, it was delicate because one of her complaints was that I was too distant in our marriage. So I had to be careful here, but it does help somewhat. However, when she called or emailed during dark periods, I was always there to answer the phone or respond to the email ASAP.
Hope this helps and good luck to you all. I know it [censored], but hang in there. Things will get better regardless of what happens with your current situation. The most important thing I learned was to back off, give her space, detach whatever you want to call it without appear to abandon her or my child. This is the hardest thing to do, but it is absolutely necessary if you want success.
M - 42 W - 41 Married 9 years July 24, 2010 WAW moved out 8-9-10 2nd Marriage for Both S 2 SS 13 from W first Marriage
Pleased to hear that many have helped you during this time, myself inlcuded, but please also keep in mind that this is a board, and not everyone is on all the time, so they may not have even seen your posts until now..which was true in my case. Pretend for a second like you're laying for dead by the side of the road and many people keep seeing you and just driving by....that's not the case here...some of us just haven't been driving down the road you're on.
It sounds like you've been at this a long time, especially since you say you've been dating over last summer. Sounds like she has a made a pretty good effort to try to fix things too...(I know that sounds ridiculous because how good of an effort can she really be making with XH), BUT, I think she was trying almost as good as any WAW I've ever heard described on these boards. I don't think there's anything you can do directly right now...I would stay dark and keep your hope alive. You really do love her, I can tell because I have NEVER seen a post this long, particularly to a board that you that wasn't responding to you. It's good of you to do that though, that's what the board is for and more details are always more helpful than fewer.
Seems as if you just need to do whatever you can to detach. Yes, I know, you see it all the time on here and sometimes I think it becomes such a common term that people overlook its importance. There's a reason why DB tells you to detach. Because it puts your mind in the best position to deal with this. It allows you you to step back....and look at the big picture. Right now, you're still focusing on your every move with regard to HER. Why not focus on your every move with regard to YOU. Try harder than you ever have to live for you this year, or at least maybe this winter as a baby step.
I think her telling you she misses you everyday is a way for her to keep a tie to you, it's like a daily "feeler" to see how you feel.. I think she actually would be quite upset if she truly sensed you'd detached enough to be a confident guy without her. Just a gut feel.
Actions speak louder than words...and you obviously need more than just "I miss you." I think you need to let these words be your HOPE only, not your focus. Ya know, like I hope I win the lottery or my stock portfolio explodes, but realistically, my focus is on doing the right things to support myself and not expecting a miracle.
I would advise you not to give up here, because that's what DBing is. You've simply got to try to see this whole thing from a detached and distant point of view.
I wish you well.
M-34 XW-32 D-7 Found OM's presence 4/09 Separated 12/09 Divorced 8/10 GREAT relationship as coparents since 8/10
Detatching has been the hardest thing I have ever done. You are right, I kid myself into thinking I have detatched. But everything is still done with her in mind. Not for myself.
Maybe I am demented? I don't know. I took all W pictures off of FB (so I didn't look at them) but I log onto Myspace at least every other day to look at the pics of her/us. That doesn't even make sense to me.
I will have a day where I think F her. Than the next day I'll miss her like crazy. Sometimes I go through these emotions several times in the SAME day.
A couple weeks ago I came up with the idea to make a profile on POF. After making a profile, posting pics I was talking with a couple women. I realized real fast that I wasn't being honest or fair to myself or these other women because I was/am nowhere near ready to take that step. How could I be when my thoughts are consumed with my W and wanting to be with her. So I deleted the profile.
I really hate the fact that I feel like my life is just put on hold. Waiting for her. I guess that's where GAL comes into play. I am trying, I really am.
I do love her GCM. Sometimes I wonder why? And wish that I didn't, it would be easier. I even try to trick myself into thinking I don't, but I know that I do.
Thanks for taking the time to read my SITCH. This is really tough.
I get it Ruikee. I am so aware of how long it has been since I last emailed her its rediculous. I wish I could just turn it off. Tks for taking the time to reply to me.
Actions speak louder than words...and you obviously need more than just "I miss you." I think you need to let these words be your HOPE only, not your focus. Ya know, like I hope I win the lottery or my stock portfolio explodes, but realistically, my focus is on doing the right things to support myself and not expecting a miracle.
I have read your response several times today GCM It makes alot of sense to me. Especially this paragraph here. I guess that sometimes hope is all that you have...but do it without expectations.
I have also been doing alot of thinking about the detatching thing. I like someones analogy about dropping the rope. So hard for something that seems like it would be easy when living apart. Detatching that is. Thanks again for your advice. It's sorely needed.
