TAMF's Christmas Miracle?

[TAMF]

Happy Little Friday to you too!!!!

[PEI]

OMG ... I didn't even realize it was LF ... Happy Little Friday!

[Albuquerque]

What I will tell you is not to slip back into old habits. Make sure the changes you made in you and for you remain intact.

That is SO true. It's very easy to slip back into old routines when you are faced with an old and familiar situation. I found myself barking directions at H while driving the other day. As soon as I did it it was like I was hearing myself for the first time. Needless to say, I've refrained from doing it since even when H took a wrong turn that took us onto a 10 minute long bridge. I kept my mouth shut and let him lead the way. It was funny and he eventually realized his mistake. Not sure that's ALWAYS what I should do but I need to find a happy medium I suppose. Stay strong and stay focused on YOU. Not your R.

[Lotus]

TAMF,

That is all well and good, except for the part about how he is going to minimize her pain. BS. There is no way to end it with someone without hurting them (unless they want to end it too). So drawing it out is just another word for cake eating. I'm glad he wants to spend time with you and the kids, and you are having a great time doing it. But unless he really ends it and doesn't look back, you are only getting half a husband.

Again, I recommend you look into Retrouvaille. If he agrees to go there with you, they will call both of you and check to see that there are no 3rd parties involved. They will tell him he has to end it before you go. You see? You won't have to tell him, they will.

[angel61]

Hi TAMF,

Yes, you seem such a good candidate for retrouvaille. I am wishing I could do that with my H but I don't think he is prepared yet.

I'll be praying for you. Hope the miracle keeps on going through the New Year!

The hard part will come, once the crisis mode is over. Don't let thoughts of OW create resentment in you.

[TAMF]

update - a lot has happened in the last 3 days. Pain and hope. This is going to be long, so bare with me.

On NYE I KNEW my H was with the OW. No text messages, no calls and I knew he wasnt at work. I had plans with our friends for the evening. I sent him a text that said:

I know you are with her, I can feel it. my heart is breaking, and funny thing is I didn't think my heart could break any more. please don't text me and tell me to relax. I am calm, not tears no emotion.

He immediately called me. He admitted that he had been with her during the day, but wasn't with her now. I asked him if he broke it off with her like he said he would, and he said no. I started crying and I was furious. I hung up on him. he called me back and I said that I didn't want to see him until he broke it off with her. He said, "I can't come over tomorrow like we planned?" I said something like - what do you want me to do? I can't do this anymore. You are killing me all over again.

While we were talking, I was driving in freezing rain. It was horrible. My H said he was on his way to the house, and I said don't bother, I am already on my way to friends house. He was intantly worried because I was so upset. He asked me to pull over, and I did. I pulled into a gas station. He said that he had told me this was going to be really hard but he WAS going to break it off and he promised not to drag it out. I didn't say anything for a long time. and he said, "TAMF, I LOVE YOU" Emphasizing each word. I started to ball and mumbled that I loved him so much. He then said that he wanted to come over and see me the next day and we would talk. I said ok.

At this point, I could have easily caved to my misery, but I didn't. I went into the bathroom at the gas station. Cleaned my face up and went to my friends house determined not to let him ruin my New Years Eve.

I had a blast that night with all of my friends. I put him out of my mind and had a wonderful time.

Saturday H came over to the house at 6am. The girls had spent the night at a hotel with my brother and his family. We talked and held each other for a long time. We watched tv and cuddled. We talked about our future and the steps we would put in place to make our relationship work. We talked about communication, trust issues, priorities, the girls, finances. We talked about how difficult it was going to be when he broke it off with the OW. The withdrawl he would have to go through and it wasn't going to be pleasant for either of us. He told me that he would talk to his mom on his birthday (which was the next day)! He has not spoken to his mom since he found out about his real father. This was a BIG step for him. All of it so incredible. He just asked me to be a little more patient with him. This was really difficult for him, but he was determined.

He spent the night on Saturday, slept out on the couch with on our youngest D. In the middle of the night he came into the bedroom and just cuddled with me for about an hour (no sex, I swear)and then he kissed me and said he needed to get back out to the couch so our D wouldn't know he was gone.

Sunday was his birthday. I had gotten him really nice presents. wrapped them in birthday wrapping paper (not Christmas paper like he normally gets from everyone). My H and I went downstairs and lifted wieghts and exercised together. Then he wanted to go to the bluff to go hiking, but I didn't want to go because of the ice. He came back to the house 2 hours later.

He needed something at his apartment, and I asked if I could go with him. He said absolutely. I have never seen his apt. We took a nice long backroads drive to his apt. and talked again about plans for the future. He was so positive and so SANE. This was my Husband again, yet better.

I grilled new york strips and made crap stuffed mushrooms for dinner. We watched our beloved Chicago Bears loose to the stupid Green Bay Packers.

After the game, I asked him if he was spending the night. He said yes. He fell asleep on the lazy boy. I went into my bedroom to put some laundry away.

This is when my world collapsed again.

He had put his cell phone in a tennis shoe in his closet. I heard it vibrate with a text message. I picked it up and read his text messages...

From his text messages to the OW I realized he had gone to the bar where she worked after he had hiked the bluff. He had said to her that he was sorry he didn't get to see her for very long but that he was glad he got to see her. Then in another message he said - I love you baby.

I crashed to the floor and started crying. I then got up, went into the family room woke him up and gave him his cell phone and told him that he had a text message. I walked away and went into my room - slammed the door. He followed me. I was hysterical. I started hitting him on the chest(not hard, and mind you he is frigging HUGE so I couldn't hurt him if I tried)I said, "after everything that we talked about this weekend, everything that has been said, you text her that you love her?!" He was holding me up I was in such horrible shape. He kept saying, "where am I right now? where am I right now? I am here with you. I will end this with her. It is over. Look at me! It is over." Then he kept saying how sorry he was. This was so hard for him, but he knows what he wants to do and he will end it with her and then it will just be me and him and the girls. He started crying too. A man I have seen cry 3 times in 20 years.

He was holding me tightly while I was crying when the girls came into the bedroom to say goodnight. I couldn't lift my head out of H's chest, I couldn't let them see me like that. They were really worried and upset. They left the room. A little later, after I calmed down, I went and took a shower. both girls came into the bathroom so very worried about me. I told them that sometimes it was just hard but I was okay. They said okay but were skeptical.

I went into my room and my H was still in the bed. He said he couldn't leave me and was going to stay with me. He held me tightly all night long. niether one of us slept at all. I would turn away from him and he would grab me and pull me to his chest and say that he needed to hold me. He kept whispering that he loved me and would gently kiss my face and lips. He just kept saying how sorry he was for hurting me. That we are ALMOST THERE, just hold on a little bit more. Please don't give up now when we are so close. He would end it - he promised.

So here I am, so heartbroken, yet still hopeful. Am I stupid? am I doing the right thing? Should I be kicking his butt all the way to the lawyer? I don't think I have ever been so confused in this whole time. I WANT TO BELEIVE HIM. But the text messages don't lie. He had told me since July that he loved her. I knew this, but to text it to her after a day that we had together that I thought was so special...

I guess I will stay still for a moment longer - do nothing for a moment longer.

But my moment won't last very long.

[AntoniaB]

((((HUGS))))) I'm sorry for the pain you're in right now. The comment about him killing you again hit me at the core. I dreamed the other night that my H and I were back together a year or so from now only to find out he was still seeing OW on the side. I had a dream sequence very similar to your real-life one and THAT left me shaken in the morning, so I'm stunned to read your real-life experience.

There is a lot to process there, and I do think that the best thing for you to do is sit back right now and do nothing as you say you will other than to go back to your place of stability for yourself and your kids.

One thing that bugs me is that if I'm reading this correctly, you were going to go out hiking with him and did not because of ice, and it seems like the second you didn't do something with him that he wanted to do, he immediately contacted/saw her, like it seemed to come so easily to him to just go right back into it with her. There is no sense of him even beginning to give her signs that he is breaking it off, either, from those texts. Clearly on that day he held both of you to him in a loving relationship. How can someone do that? How can someone feel the same thing for two different people? But you know, a friend of mine started an affair and then ended it before it got out of control, and she said she would compartmentalize her relationships with her H and her soon-to-be-lover. She said that it was possible to just shut off the feelings for one when around the other.

My advice is that you have to stop allowing him all this contact till OW is out of the picture and you can be reasonably sure of that. Somehow he has to prove that to you. He can have contact with his kids but he can't be hugging you and holding you and cuddling. That's only messing with your head. I can see why you let him in to that level. His words to you sound very convincing, and couple that with the body language, the look in his eye, all that stuff, I can see why you got sucked in, but you're getting burned already. You have to be strong enough to stop him from setting that fire.

[warriorshadow]

TAMF,

I am so sorry that this is happening to you like this. It has

to be extremely difficult. When you started this thread, I wanted

to post to you to be careful and could not get myself to do it.

I figured if your H is not in MLC, then this could be the real

deal for him to come back.

Now it is even harder to post to you because if he is MLC, he

is still in replay most likely.

This is where TAMF is really going to dig in and not have any

expectations. That is a concept that is so hard right now with

what you have experienced in last several days/weeks.

PEI went through some of this too and I know she can relate to

what is going on in your life right now.

The positive movement forward from your H seems promising for now

but the more your urge to have expectations comes back, the

tougher this is going to be for you no matter which way this

goes.

A lot of us have been right where you are now and had

expectations cause it would be the normal thing for anyone

especially us LBS's.

BUT THIS STUFF IS SO FAR FROM NORMAL!

I think you can't lose if you just keep up with the DB'ing but

with no expectations.

Remember believe none of what they say and half of what they do.

He does appear to be trying but is finding himself stuck.

That is a fight he must face and if he doesn't, he is not

done with MLC. If he is not done with MLC, even if he does come

back, the fears he must face will resurface later. YOU don't

want that either. YOU want him back when he is done with the

crisis. Then some real incredible work will have to begin and

both of you will have to do that incredible work.


Thinking about this more, he does not want to keep a strong

relationship with the OW but can't get himself to quite let

go yet. That says to me RED FLAG, he is not ready.

I would hate to see you get caught up in this just like PEI did

because the strength you will need is huge.

It seems to me that the since the BD was on 7/3/10 not enough

time has gone by yet. That would make one superfast MLC.

So again TAMF,

It is time for you to step back and watch a little.

Keep venting here, keep reading here.

I do feel your pain though because it is tougher for me

to post to you now, but I wanted to give you at least some

perspective of what I am seeing.

I have no doubt that you are up to the challenge and you

are being tested.

WS

[TAMF]

WS - Thank you for the post. Is he out of MLC, I don't think so but I do see a REAL HUGE difference in him. The change from 6 months ago is unbelievable. Also, I am possitive that his MLC started over a year ago. He told me he started feeling this way in July/August of 09. The OW came into the picture in March 10.

He is misserable today. He has called me at least 4 times already this morning. He had noticed that I had left my cell at home and offered to bring it to my work (20 minutes away). He just dropped it off. He looked so very sad, I would assume that it is a mirror image of my own face today. He asked if I was okay. I shrugged my shoulders and said okay. I told him I am trying to be strong. He said that he needs me to be cause he is going to have to talk to me constantly in order to get through this.

I said that I need to set a time boundry for myself for how long I am willing to wait until he tells her it is over and if it isn't done by that time, I will go completely dark. No contact until he can prove that it is done.

I know that this may seem like I am trying to control the situation, but I HAVE to protect myself. I cannot continue to go on like this for a long period of time. He told me that he was going to end it last week. He didn't.

He understood and said that he wasn't going to wait. It would be soon.

Soon to him, and soon to me are 2 different things. we need to establish what "soon" is so we are clear.

He just called me again. He said that he was just out driving around. Said that we have a game plan now for our life together and we just need to execute (this is the football/basketball man talking). I like it when he talks like this because it is familiar and it has been a LONG time since I have heard him talk like the take charge athlete/coach that he is. He said that he is going to need me to be strong and be his rock while he goes through this. He will take care of it. he asked if I was with him? I said yes. He replied, "cause I am going to need you like I have never needed anyone in my life".

While he was saying this, I swear he was all choked up with emotion.

[ericmsant2]

TAMF,

Are you sitting down? Cause, this ain’t gonna be pleasant but I think it is what YOU need right now.

Did you think this was gonna be easy? Did you think that his WORDS meant that he was over HIS crisis? Did you think that a little love making would bring his as* out of his crisis? Did you think that dinner, time with the girls would change him?

Don’t say NO….cause I know you well enough to know that your answer to the above should be YES…especially if you are honest with yourself. Fu*k being honest with me or anyone else on these damn boards. You had an expectation and YOU know it. You believed HIS WORDS….cause HIS ACTIONS are saying something else.

As a man, when you WANT a women YOU GO AFTER IT. Like a bull after a bone. You don’t waffle – NO you chase it and chase it hard. Look this is a man that KNOWS that you have been with someone else. As a dude, I’d be all over your chit and would have cut the whore (sorry I mean OW) off immediately.

TAMF, your H is still in a crisis. Is all lost? NO F*CKING WAY! Does this mean it is over for YOU? NO F*CKING WAY. Get your big girl panties on and get back on the f*cking horse. And by horse I do not mean the…save your M horse – NO I mean the find who the HELL TAMF really is horse!

REAL HUGE difference in him

I have been telling you this for a while. F*ck the “huge differences in HIM”…look at the differences in YOU!

Also, I am possitive that his MLC started over a year ago

So ya think the crisis is over in a year? You know better than that.

He is misserable today.

He should be he got caught! You know what…YOU SHOULD NOT FEEL BAD FOR HIS CHEATING A**! Sorry, maybe you wanted some hugs and soft chit…not today and not from me. You could do better! And I know it. Damn, if YOU could only see what I see IN YOU!

He has called me at least 4 times already this morning

Hmmm…sounds to me like he is NOW worried….sounds to me like HE is SCARED that HE will need to make a CHOICE. Guess what? NONE OF HIS CHOICES should change or DRIVE YOURS! How many f*cking times am I gonna say…YOU CHOOSE. YOUR LIFE. YOU DECIDE. FTR, I am NOT telling you to quit, to give up, to not stand. ON the contrary, I am telling YOU to STAND FOR WHAT YOU BELIEVE IN! DO YOU LOVE THIS MAN TAMF? Would you walk thru fire for his as*? Would you give your right lung so that he can live? 6 months ain’t chit IMO – nothing. It is a walk in the park.

He asked if I was okay. I shrugged my shoulders and said okay.

He’s lucky he did not ask me….I would have told HIM that I was busy on the phone with the other guy, since he decided not to value his own word, well then I am moving on with what I feel is best for me (and NO TAMF I am not suggesting that you say this).

I told him I am trying to be strong.

STOP TELLING HIM CHIT! SHOW him. Okay, so how do you show him?

What does a strong women do who knows her H is fu*king someone else? FTR, there is NO right or wrong answer here. It is what TAMF, the strong women that she is must do. In short, she must do for HER. In short, she must do what SHE feels she needs to do but do it with NO and I mean NO….I really mean NO…regrets! Until she can, she should stop talking and acting strong!

I said that I need to set a time boundry for myself for how long I am willing to wait until he tells her it is over and if it isn't done by that time, I will go completely dark. No contact until he can prove that it is done.

I wish I could tell YOU just how many times I tried this type of action with my W. Do you think they really give a chit? Do you think that THESE words are all of sudden going to change him? Do you know what this tells me TAMF…..your still afraid. Your still worried about what he gonna say or do. Your still think that this little form of manipulation and or guilt will scare him towards you. I can tell you that IMO, it will not.

You set a boundary for YOU and YOU alone. FTR, the boundary for my STBXW is pretty simple…she gets nothing from me emotionally – NADA, NOTHING. I do not have to say a f*cking word to her…MY ACTIONS are speaking. Guess what, the past few days….especially since I took back my bed room…she seems to be “softer” – GUESS what? I DO NOT GIVE A CHIT. So please TAMF, set the boundary when you really are ready to.

I HAVE to protect myself

YES YOU DO. Hey let me give you a little hint, since I know that he makes more than you. He is F*cked. IF it goes the D route he will get screwed. Alimony, child support, abandonment….yeah he is screwed and don’t think for a second that he does not know this.

Just to beat a dead horse…..did you open the account for YOU….the one in JUST YOUR name? the one that will give you the sense of INDEPENDENCE that you want. Just asking…..

we need to establish what "soon" is so we are clear

“We”,…..no sorry TAMF…YOU need to establish what YOU need for YOU.

While he was saying this, I swear he was all choked up with emotion

He should be chocked up! He is losing YOU and YOU need to realize just how much of a keeper YOU are. I can’t make you feel it – no one can.

In closing I leave you with this…..

Are you smart?

Are you sexy?

Are you funny?

Are you a good partner?

Are you financially responsible?

Are you a good mom?

Are you a good wife?

Do you know how to communicate?

Do you stand for what you believe in?

Can you make a choice and stick with it?

Do you love and love deeply?

Do you believe in yourself?


Answer these questions for YOURSELF!

Oh…and I am not apologizing for the tone of this post. I know you can do better so DO IT!

God Bless,
Eric