MLC or just an EA?

[angel61]

Oh well. So I did a little snooping, saw the emails.
He indeed was bluffing at first. How well I know my H.
OW said OK, she will do it, but in a "non-OW manner" business like but friendly. My respect for her went up a notch.
When I got home, house was empty without D, but sooo peaceful. H was out, went to supermarket, came back, asked if I wanted to go to gym with him, I said no (one of the few times I refused).
He cooked dinner, we did not talk much but our convo was light. He was not upbeat (which actually I found more comforting, as it seemd like he was more accepting, not fighting, the situation) but at least he was not withdrawn. And when he slept, he seemd to let go more and did not do the "cling to the end ofthe mattress" thing which he does when he is uptight, but leaned against me most of the night.
Its funny how I notice those little things now. The DR book really made me open my eyes and ears and hear all the little nuances of conversation, etc. I thought it was intuition but I think its more of discernment.

[BeingMe]

Yeah, I agree Angel ... we do pick up on all those little things when in crisis mode. Our ears are geared for any hint in the voices of WAS's, or expression (facial or bodily) they may show. Once you truly step back, drop the rope, then it gets to be more normal.

I wonder what your H would do if you decided to withdraw ... as in sleep in another room, only speak if spoken to, etc., play hard to get. LRT, I think it's called ... last resort technique. I only wonder because it seems he thinks he has you as a back-up, but is still pursuing the OW. Is it possible that if the OW decided to get with him again, he will be gone? Are you comfortable with that scenario? And, is that the case, do you think?

Just throwing ideas and thoughts out there.

[angel61]

About me being there as a back up:

He always told me that "friendship" OW would not last. He said it was one sided, unrequited. I did not believe then but now I do. I think she was attracted but not too much.

There were times he wished it were over, but he was too weak to resist or be the one to cut it off, until she showed him that she no longer wanted to continue .

He felt that A was only a facet of the problem, he knows he has MLC. He has not closed the door to reconciliation, as he said to therapist. He still is committed to taking care of me and D, He said this all in front of therapist, to make sure a third party knows.

I felt at that point that he wanted me to be patient with him, to wait for him. He was asking me to be a back up. He asked for space to figure himself out.

I could not understand at first of course, was angry, could not see why he was asking that of me. But after reading the DR book, I decided to make Carol my model. So I quit all the pursuing activities, and concentrated on having a friendly atmosphere at home.

I did LRT in other words, but not fully: not bringing up R, or M, or OW, trying not to speak to him first unless its about D, or logistical issue (cars, house, money, food). At that time, prior to OW breakup, we had lots of activities (joint bday party, relatives visiting, planning for Thanksgiving, planning for Christmas) and had fun moments, esepcially with D11, so it hard to be completely detached.

For now:

My strategy:
During the depression period, I will make him feel safe by being around and available, helping with the household.

Before he broke up with her, he told me that he was glad to see that I was getting stronger (at least he did see that in me), healing and recovering from the wounds he inflicted. He told me how he was the one going down, getting depressed, and how he was happy that I could be the strong one for now to hold up the family. Maybe he got the strength to break up with her from me? He used to worry that if both if us went down, got depressed or crazy, what would happen to D? He himself said that seeing me weak actually made him want to leave more, was pushing him away.

Come to think of it, what attracted him to me when we were starting? My strength? My guidance? but at the ssme time, our capability to have fun, our level of comfort with each other? I am 5 years older, but also, professionally, I was his mentor. I taught him a lot of what he now knows and applies in his work. I think I was always the stronger one, but impulsive, and he is the more controlling one, ambitious and driven and obsessive.

Sorry, I seem to be using this post to brainstorm, but I get to think of things when I write.....

[BeingMe]

So, you are already in semi-LRT, and you seem to be doing well with that. I am also 5 years older than my H ... and sometimes I felt I was a mother figure for him. Careful of that. Although, he is the breadwinner, and very much the passive-aggressive type. I am stronger than him, I think, as was proved during my illness in the last 2 years.

There are so many variations, and dynamics within a R. Sometimes, we seem similar on bb, but in essence, our R's are all very unique. We can only throw in ideas, and thoughts for the person on the other side of the keyboard to gnaw over. This is a good place to brainstorm. I have done so many, many times over the years.

[angel61]

Thanks BM! I sometimes get guilty writing so much but when someone like you reads and understands, it feels good!

My H also in the last 3 years has come into his own - now has a higher position than I have and earns much more. Maybe that is a factor? He is like a child growing into adulthood and wanting his freedom?

[angel61]

We had a "talk" this AM. Upon awakening, H asked me how I can stand it (our sitch)
I did not answer right away, I was not sure how to approach.
He said he was going crazy already, cracking up.
He said that he even finds himself getting short tempered to D11, who prevously could get away with anything with him.
I told him that he was not being himself, that time would change things.
He scoffed at that.
He asked me why I did not answer how I could stand it.
I said I don't know, maybe prayer, maybe by taking it a day at a time.
He said that in January, he was thinking of asking our renter to vacate our other house (5 mins away from where we live) and living there. I did not say anything.
He said D11 was used to him going on trips anyway. I said what matters to her is that our family is not broken. He said it does not mean we are, it mioght even make things better. He will wake up early, come over to the house, prepare breakfast for us, then go back there to sleep maybe 3 days a week. I asked if he needed alone time. He said yes. I asked if his being close to me is the reason he is that way, he said no, but that he also was hurting me and it was unfair.
I did not respond to that, even if I wanted to say that I could take it.
After our talk, he was talkative like he has not been since OW NC. We talked about work, as I am helping him analyze some data for a publication, and he was more animated and he even talked about what we will do later tonight.
I of course am trying to analyze.
Good points: he is starting to consider other peoples feeling again. he is starting to reach out.
Bad: if he oves out in january (will it be?) plus it also does not make financial sense, but I did not point that out to him, I think he will figure it out later. Especially as he blames me for the financial mess we are in, I don't want to make decisions regarding money right now.
Any thoughts out there?

[angel61]

Anybody out there had a "trial separation?" in times when H is depressed, being hurtful, needs alone time, will a separation be better for us all?

[BeingMe]

Just a thought, but could it be possible that OW told him she's not interested until he gets his life in order? In our sitch, we never really separated ... except different bedrooms. So, can't comment on any experience there. My H was very much in a hurry to get us to this city ... I couldn't understand why until I found out OW was living a short distance away. He swears it had nothing to do with it. Uh huh!?

I believe in the notion of they will lie before they tell the truth. If their lips are moving, they are lying, unless there is absolute proof.

He also swears they're not in contact. I checked to see if she had a FB account, and she did. All of H's old school friends on his FB had her as a 'friend' except him. I told him, "hey, no problem if you're seeing her ... we're separating anyway ... I notice she's not looking well in one of her pics, so maybe your getting in contact will make her feel better?" Next day, her FB was gone. I haven't said anything about that to him. It just makes me wonder.

I guess all you can do is wait and see, while taking it one day at a time. I know that is such a cliche comment, but it's true.

[angel61]

Who knows? Anything can happen. But I have a feeling that she did not say that.... that all she said was that she will not be guilty of breaking us up. PLus I don't think that she is that into him - I think she was flattered at first, as H is quite accomplished and very intelligent, plus she was thankful and appreciative of all he did for her (got her a good post-doctoral fellowship in a well known US institution where H has clout).I actually read an email where she was thanking him profusely for everyting and emphasizing that she was glad they were "friends".

But in H mind, I think he is still hoping or fantasizing that if he were free, OW will fall for him!

[angel61]

H remained upbeat yesterday. He has been calling me more often at work, to talk about work but he lingers and chats more. I try to be the one to cut it off, but I have to admit, it makes my day. Hard to detach from good stuff, but NEED it for the bad.

He brought up needing to send money to the employee in OW's home country. Pretended to ask for suggestions, so I said Fedex, etc. I think he was hoping I would suggest OW, so he won't be guilty about breaking contact! No way!

He brought up talking to our rental manager/real estate person regarding rental. I think the idea of having an a place to go to when he needs space appeals to him. I surprisingly did not feel bad about it....I'm thinking that we can even alternate using the house as our "escape". Who knows, the time apart could lead to a better relationship.