who are you?

[marmie]

maybe this in infidelity? i posted in newcomers to though. hi everyone. my second post here.
i look at my h and wonder who i married ten years ago. we are both in our 30s have no kids, a good sex life and i thought things were going great. we both work and our weekends are free to do whatever we want. we take great vacations too.
sounds wonderful, right? well, i woke up in the middle of the night and he was at the computer looking at porn. and it was some that i never knew existed because i just don't know that much about that and i was so shocked and he was so embarrassed that i caught him.
he apologized and promised he'd nevr do it again. and well, guess what? he can't stop. he looks so ashamed and i feel bad that im making him feel bad but i don't see why i"m not enough for him.
who is the man i married? anyone who hs any advice is welcome to help me.
thank you.

[Walking]

he apologized and promised he'd nevr do it again. and well, guess what? he can't stop. he looks so ashamed and i feel bad that im making him feel bad but i don't see why i"m not enough for him.

Marmie I'm going to be straight up with you girl ... why did he have to apologise and promise never to look at porn again? Pornography, in the privacy of an intimate committed relationship, can be a legitimate adult entertainment that enhances your sexual relationship. It's not about you not being enough for him, it's about him having a sexual appetite that includes a variety of things including sex with his wife. It's kind of sad that it's a part of his sexual self that he hasn't felt safe sharing with you.

We women are raised to have quite narrow views about sex and sexuality. And we get married in our early 20s so we're not particularly sexually experienced when we get married. I don't know about you, but I always thought that it was ladylike to be sexually niave. My first husband and I had what I thought then was a "good" sex life ... in hindsight it was mediocre ... because I was so "ladylike". I would have been like you about porn ....

My point is, porn is pretty harmless. Talk to your husband about it, let it spice up your fantasy life, watch it with him. There's porn now that's produced by women, so it's still sexy, but a bit more tasteful than some of the hardcore mens stuff. Moving your sexual life to a new level of intimacy can breed a whole new level of emotionally intimacy.

Marmie this is a marriage saving board. There are dozens of women here who's husbands have sighted their mundane sex life as one of the reasons ILYBNILWYA. Men have different expectations of sex than women do. They use sex as a way to create intimacy and the deeper your intimate connection, the deeper the emotional connection can be. Don't be scared of that. Between a healthy couple that's a really valuable tool for keeping your love alive and your marriage strong.

You can make a big deal out of this and it will cleave a wedge in your relationship ... or you can explore if it's something your interested in and share it with him and create a new level of intimacy.

Of course if you are just completely ideologically or morally opposed to porn you have a problem. I would encourage you though to consider that just as you've a right to your values in relation to pornography, so too does your husband - and it's not like it's illegal (well not where I live anyway) ....

[DumpedforMIL]

Of course if you are just completely ideologically or morally opposed to porn you have a problem. I would encourage you though to consider that just as you've a right to your values in relation to pornography, so too does your husband - and it's not like it's illegal (well not where I live anyway) ....

you're not serious about this piece of advice are you?

[Walking]

I am absolutely serious. I know that different cultures and different parts of the world obviously have different levels of tolerance for adult material. Where I come from in middle class developed nation, looking at porn or reading adult literature is a legitimate adult activity. I'm assuming the OP is from a similar culture.

[marmie]

i'm so ashamed to post now. i'm hurting bad becasue the porn he watches is men who are women. i googled and came up with a term named shemales.
i look at my h and see a pervert now.
fact is, i can't barely stand to look at him at all because i feel like pukeing. no way can i watch this with him i am crying so hard right now.

[Clark_Kent]

Marmie I'm going to be straight up with you girl ... why did he have to apologise and promise never to look at porn again?

OK, I have some serious issues with this :

1. If you do something behind your spouse's back that you know they would be upset by - you apologize, preferably, before you get caught with your pants down (literaly)
2. If you wouldn't do something with your spouse there, and you wait til they are gone to do it - it's cheating - this is advice from Phil McGraw - a professional therapist. An a very easy line to identify in the fly.
3. Use of pornography in secret can lead to a serious addiction. In case you weren't in the loop Walking, addictions are harmful and destructive and not something to be taken lightly.. Certainly something that warrants an apology and some strict monitoring.
4. If you go outside your marriage in secret for something you should turn inside your marriage to your spouse for - it's a dangerous slope
5. Use of internet porn often leads to online realtime flirting, then to emotional affairs, and eventually to physical affairs - not always, but enough that this poor girl here has every right to be upset about
6. Spouses should be an open book to one another. Once you start keeping secrets you need to correct the behavior. This starts with honesty and an apology
7. He promises to not view porn again in order to allow his wife to feel safe in her own home. Discovering your spouse keeping intimate secrets like this makes a person feel violated. At the very least an apology is in order, and a promise to correct the behavior. Once that's offered.. THEN a conversation can happen.
8. Once you correct your wrong (lying and violating your marriage in secret), apologize for it, and are both honest with each other you can then talk about changing lifestyles together so no one feels neglected. This man's choice was a very destructive and hurtful one. It's often enough a slope to infidelity and its GOOD that his wife was KIND enough to catch him and confront him about it. She may have saved herself AND HIM some serious problems further down the road.

Pornography, in the privacy of an intimate committed relationship, can be a legitimate adult entertainment that enhances your sexual relationship. It's not about you not being enough for him, it's about him having a sexual appetite that includes a variety of things including sex with his wife. It's kind of sad that it's a part of his sexual self that he hasn't felt safe sharing with you.

1. It can be a legitimate entertainment if its done hoenstly and openly. This is not what he was or is doing... he was sneaking around and lying to his wife. He owes at the very least an "I'm sorry for lying". He is being terribly disrespectful to say the least
2. Not feeling safe to discuss something with your spouse is not an excuse to lie to your partner you claim to love. It is not a license to sneak around in secret and leave your spouse feeling neglected, confused, and ultimately betrayed and violated. Lies and betrayal was his behavior and it does not enhance any kind of relationship, sexual or otherwise.
3. I find it interesting that rather than admonishing the lying, you blame this poor poster for not creating a safe environment for her husband to speak up? What makes you think this was the poster here not allowing their spouse to feel safe? Maybe it was just her husband being cowardly and lying rather than behaving like a mature adult?

We women are raised to have quite narrow views about sex and sexuality. And we get married in our early 20s so we're not particularly sexually experienced when we get married. I don't know about you, but I always thought that it was ladylike to be sexually niave. My first husband and I had what I thought then was a "good" sex life ... in hindsight it was mediocre ... because I was so "ladylike". I would have been like you about porn ....

1. "We" is an assumption here... and an egregious stereotype.
2. You bypass the lies, the secrecy, and how violated this poor girl here feels and blame her for being naeieve? Wow
3. You really need to get some perspective here. This is a minor problem that can be dealt with, but ignoring the way your spouse handles a conflict isn't healthy... And you didn't address that at all... You just skipped it entirely and went on about how porn can enhance a sex life... What about honesty? That enhances a married life even MORE...
4. I dont know about you, but I was raised to challenge people when they lie, sneak around behind my back, and violate the intimacy of my relationships. I was also raised to cooperate with my family and hold them accountable when they don't reciprocate.

My point is, porn is pretty harmless. Talk to your husband about it, let it spice up your fantasy life, watch it with him. There's porn now that's produced by women, so it's still sexy, but a bit more tasteful than some of the hardcore mens stuff. Moving your sexual life to a new level of intimacy can breed a whole new level of emotionally intimacy.

1. Are you serious? There are hundreds of cases of internet porn addiction throughout the country... You really need to educate yourself here Walking... Seriously missed the mark on that one...
2. Use of pornography futher supports the porn industry as well. This is the same industry that sends some very unhealthy messages to men and women. You mentioned women's porn, but I seriously doubt that's what this guy was looking at... "Harmless" isn't anywhere near accurate. At its mildest pornography is seriously miseducative... At its most viscious, it can and has destroyed lives. Harmless? Not even close. It can enhance a marriage sex life if used safely and honestly... But again that's not the behavior he's deonstrating here is he?
3. Moving a hurtful lie and addictive behavior into something that is shared is a good idea. This being done without a very firm talk about NOT keeping secrets from your spouse and violating the marriage to satisfy one's libido is more in order here.
4. If you are doing something that hurts your spouse.. you STOP IT and talk about it. You don't just keep doing it and keep hurting your wife... you really are off base here... Maybe I am premature and you have a follow up planned to address all of this... But I don't see it yet... And that worries me... SO I am taking the lead and doing it for marmie here.. Someone should by now.

Marmie this is a marriage saving board. There are dozens of women here who's husbands have sighted their mundane sex life as one of the reasons ILYBNILWYA. Men have different expectations of sex than women do. They use sex as a way to create intimacy and the deeper your intimate connection, the deeper the emotional connection can be. Don't be scared of that. Between a healthy couple that's a really valuable tool for keeping your love alive and your marriage strong.

"Marriage saving board"... thats a bit insulting isn't it? You dont' think marmie knows that?

1. You forgot to mention there are hundreds of cases of infidelity that arrive on this forum every year
2. Many of them began online with flirting... and some with porn.. I know, i have consulted on those cases
3. While I support your suggestion that sex life is something spouses should share, I am to say the least shocked and even offended at your omission of the lying, the betrayal, and how violated this man left his wife.
4. And you further suggest he isnt even obligated to apologize?... Wow

A more valuable tool to keeping a marriage alive than exploring porn is being honest with your spouse, and this man clearly needs some lessons. Don't you think it warrants an apology that he bypassed that to satisfy himself?

If spouses here bypass honesty with their spouse to satisfy their libidio on the infidelity forum we usually call that selfish and hurtful, and deal with it that way. You seem to want to hand the guy a free pass and blame marmie here?

You can make a big deal out of this and it will cleave a wedge in your relationship ... or you can explore if it's something your interested in and share it with him and create a new level of intimacy.

Cleave a wedge? Sure, but it's more likely set a healthy boundary about not keeping secrets from your spouse. wow again...

Of course if you are just completely ideologically or morally opposed to porn you have a problem. I would encourage you though to consider that just as you've a right to your values in relation to pornography, so too does your husband - and it's not like it's illegal (well not where I live anyway) ....

AGAIN you miss the whole point of how dishonest and disrespectful this man is behaving towards his own wife... Do you not GET that?

Adultery isn't illegal in many states in the US... heck slavery used to be legal...

Something being legal does in no way suggest that it is harmless.

In short... I dont have issue with porn being used here, but I do take serious issue with HOW he was going about consuming it... And I take even more serious issue with you sidestepping his disrespecting marmie here... I am quite offended ...

I HOPE you planned a follow up to cover all of this.. if so, I offer my apologies in advance...

Marmie I will do a follow up on your note and see if I can find some pornography addiction resources for you...

Marmie, I am so sorry your husband violated your marriage behind your back this way.. Many of us do understand how terribly hutful that is... Many of us here do get it and we can help you.

[MrBond]

How long have you two been married? Are you fairly conservative or open? Has he had a "problem" with that before? I guess I'm trying to figure out what your tolerance is.

From your basic post, it didn't sound like he had an addiction. Just someone who was curious.

[marmie]

my first post says that we've been married for ten years. the porn he was watching was something called shemale porn. i am not a prude, if that is implied to you.

[Clark_Kent]

How long have you two been married? Are you fairly conservative or open? Has he had a "problem" with that before? I guess I'm trying to figure out what your tolerance is.

From your basic post, it didn't sound like he had an addiction. Just someone who was curious.

Bond.. she said he "can't STOP".. that's an addiction isnt' it? Do you actually expect a pornography addict to hold his hand up and say "Hey I'm an addict, just in case you were wondering..."

Did you MISS that little but important clue?

He apologized and promised he'd nevr do it again. and well, guess what? he can't stop. he looks so ashamed and i feel bad that im making him feel bad

Pornography addiction, or more broadly overuse of pornography, is excessive pornography use that interferes with daily life. There is no diagnosis of pornography addiction in the current Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM), and as with the broader proposed diagnosis of sexual addiction, there is debate as to whether or not the behaviors indicate a behavioral addiction.

Pornography addiction is diagnosed when an individual engages in the overuse or abuse of pornography to the extent that they experience negative consequences. In 1990 Aviel Goodman proposed a general definition of all types of addictions in order to extend the specific disorders included in the DSM-III-R. While not explicitly in the context of pornography, Goodman explains his criteria for addiction as a "process whereby a behavior, that can function both to produce pleasure and to provide escape from internal discomfort, [and] is employed in a pattern characterized by (1) failure to control the behavior (powerlessness) and (2) continuation of the behavior despite significant negative consequences (unmanageability)."

Pornography addiction is defined, by those who argue that it exists, as a dependence upon pornography, characterized by obsessive viewing, reading, and thinking about pornography and sexual themes to the detriment of other areas of ones own life.

Some psychologists and sex therapists (for example Kimberly Young, and Victor Cline) have proposed stages in pornography addiction. Rory C. Reid and Dan Gray note that the stages need not be sequential and not all individuals experience all stages.

Serial killer Ted Bundy stated that his pornography addiction went through stages. As a boy he reported seeing softcore pornography, and that he later viewed hardcore pornography and violent pornography. Ben Shapiro, in his book Porn Generation: How Social Liberalism Is Corrupting Our Future, claimed that this played an influencing role in Bundy's crimes. However, Alexander Barnes Dryer, in his review of the book for The New Republic states that it was difficult to cite just one flaw with the book, as there were so many.

In November 2004, a panel of experts testified before a US Senate subcommittee. Proponents of the addiction model argued that exposure to kinky sexual practices by means of pornography lead the watchers to "cross over". Skeptics disagreed with that conclusion, pointing to the lack of scientific evidence.

Psychologists who see pornography as addictive may consider online, often Internet, pornography more addictive than ordinary pornography because of its wide availability, explicit nature, and the privacy that online viewing offers. Some claim that "addicts" regularly spend extended periods of time searching the internet for new or increasingly hardcore pornography.

Some clinicians and support organizations recommend voluntary Internet filter (content control) use, internet monitoring, or both, to manage online pornography use.

Sex researcher Alvin Cooper and colleagues suggested several reasons for using filters as a therapeutic measure, including curbing accessibility that facilitates problematic behavior and encouraging clients to develop coping and relapse prevention strategies. Cognitive therapist Mary Anne Layden suggested that filters may be useful in maintaining environmental control. Internet behavior researcher David Delmonico noted that, despite their limitations, filters may serve as a "frontline of protection."

Dr. Patrick Carnes*, a pioneer in sexual addiction research, has outlined four core beliefs common in most sexual addicts. They usually result from growing up in a dysfunctional family, especially one with rigid rules, little warmth and affirmation, abandonment, and sexual or emotional abuse. The core beliefs are the following: I am basically a bad, unworthy person, No one would love me as I am, My needs are never going to be met if I have to depend upon others, Sex is my most important need. The root of sexual addiction usually begins in childhood. Carnes writes, "When a child's exploration of sexuality goes beyond discovery to routine self-comforting because of the lack of human care, there is potential for addiction. Sex becomes confused with comforting and nurturing. For example, a lonely and abused 13 year old finds comfort in masturbation and pornography. More and more, he or she uses that for solace. As years go by, the type of sexual acting out may change. It can involve promiscuity, affairs, visiting massage parlors or prostitutes, and even viewing child pornography."

Effective treatment for pornography addiction includes therapy, 12 step support groups, education and medication when needed for co-occurring anxiety or depression. How to overcome these addictions by using recovery programs, for example an effective method would be the use of online programs anonymously

[marmie]

ok, he may be addicted, but he won't stop or get help... what do you do if your spouse is addicted to something and won't stop?