Sandi's Place

[sandi2]

Hi Mike, I'll try to answer your questions as best that I can.

How did you view your love for your husband before, during, and after your EA?

My H and I had not been intimate for years. We had become that couple I said we never would be... We wouldn't fight but we would say things that sounded pretty cross & grouchy. The kids began to notice it b/c we didn't do that before. I thought we were like an old pair of houseshoes.....comfortable and too old to change. We were steadily drifting apart. There were many things (family stuff) that put so much stress on us and right before my EA, we had our D and her son staying with us. I felt like I had to escape some way or lose my mind. That's when I started playing online games.

You have to try to understand that once a woman gets into this stage of fantasy with OM......that's really all she thinks about. She might go through the motions of a day, but she's thinking about the next time she can contact OM. Sadly, I didn't have much thought about my love for my H. If anything, I felt like I was empty. I have said it before, that I felt so dead that when OM begin to say things that caused me to feel again....I was excited about that.

When my H confronted me about the EA and all the bad stuff came to a blow....my feelings for him was anything but loving. I saw a stranger in him, and he certainly saw one in me. Neither of us liked what we saw. I did not think there was much hope in ever feeling good about him again. I didn't even want the people on the board to tell me that the loving feelings would return!

Did you really ever stop being in love with him? Or was your love for him always there but covered up deep down...masked by your feelings for the OM and/or long standing issues within your marriage?

Well, I did not feel like I was in love with him. My emotioanl & intimate needs had been neglected for a very long time (as did his). Before, during and after the EA, I was very depressed and on medicine that made me feel like a zombie. Put that with a bad M and it's not a good situation. I really looked at my H as if it were a love you'd have for a relative, but I did not feel one ounce of sexual attraction for him. One reason was I had lost some respect for him and that plays on a woman's attraction factor. We had had long standing issues in our M and I knew those issues would never be resolved. B/c most of it were things that happened in the past and nothing could change that. A lot of wear and tear on us. Yes, I loved him ...like I didn't want to hurt him b/c he was a good man.....but I was not attracted to him. That part would not come until I broke off with OM and made a decision to either do something about my MR or just sit here miserable until I died. It took a long time for me to get to the place where I began to feel like my old self again. Thank God,my H is a very patient man.

Did you ever think/believe that the love you once had for your husband was impossible to regain?

Yes. When I was in so deep and allowing the fog to over-take me. But, here's the thing I want to point out....it was more of a rebellion with me. I didn't "want" to feel in love with him b/c I was in that messed up mind that a WAW in an A has. I felt anger toward him and the more he tried to pursue me...the more anger I felt.

You may be refering to after I dropped OM and if I thought I'd ever be able to love H again......I felt so hopeless and tired. I was very, very tired and sick. I had a lot of physical junk that was attacking my body on top of all the M problems. It's kind of hard now to look back and remember exactly what I thought about. I know that sounds crazy but I want to answer your questions as honestly as I can. I was so depressed that I had to take a day at a time. I had to deal with trying to forgive myself, etc. I think I would have to say that I didn't think I would love my H like I had when we were younger.

What things helped get you to the point of being willing to work on your marriage?

My H backed off and did not put any pressure on me. He was sooooo patient. I could sense my H's support and I saw him trying without over-kill. That must be hard for the LBH, but he did it very well. He is not a big man on action....so I guess it fit his style (lol). Mostly, it took time for me to get myself together. When I finally found the right anti-depression meds, that helped me so much. I stopped feeling like a zombie. Shortly afterwards, I was put on thyroid and hormone replacement meds. That helped put some "want to" in my blood. People just don't realize how it affects a person when those natural things are not being produced in the body! That's why I usually tell the W or even the H to get a good check up and see if any of this is lacking.

After deciding to work on your marriage, what type of things were necessary to rekindle the love you once had for your husband?

Again, something might have been different for another couple, but for me....just getting back to "normal" was what I needed. Being around family, going to church, etc. I had stopped doing any of those things. I had withdrawn from everyone. At first, it was very uncomfortable for me, but my H acted like nothing ever happened, so that was a blessing.

From your perspective, can you comment on feeling before doing, vs. doing before feeling? Is that something you struggled with?

If I'm understanding your question....I would have to say that I had to make decisions to "do" based on knowing it was the right thing....even if I didn't have the feelings at the time. Michele is correct when she says that the feelings will follow what we do. That's hard for a WAW b/c everything has been about "feelings" for her. Yes, I struggled with it a lot.

Once it was all said-and-done, how do you compare your marriage now, to the marriage you had before everything started?

I'm not sure just how to answer that. I would say that something very special has been lost b/c of what I did. There may always be that "spot" that won't go away. Like right now....I can hardly see to type b/c of the tears. The most valuable thing we had in our MR was trust....and I broke that. So, in spite of all that has been accomplished in the R, I can't say it is quite like it use to be. But, I look at it the way I felt when I lost my father. When he died, it took away something from my life and I know won't ever be the same again. But, I can work to make the most of life or I can waste it away in sorrow. That's how it is in my M.

If all the right steps are taken (time/effort) by both husband and wife, do you feel like they have a pretty good chance at reconciling and achieving a loving marriage again?

OH YES! A thousand times yes, Mike. I am so grateful that I had a chance to keep my M. I was given an opportunity to love again....and to be loved. I may not have answered any of your questions very well, but this last one.....I want you to know that it is so worth working to have that MR again.

My best wishes to you, Mike.

[sandi2]

Time, one thing that made you feel so alive with OM was that it fed your ego! Think about a man 20 yrs younger than you....wow! That has to make a girl feel like she's still got it. There is something about a man's attention (who isn't our H) that makes us feel good. Unless the man's a creep! Am I right? We get used to our H complimenting us,etc., but for a stranger to think we're beautiful (or whatever)? Being in the frame of mind that we were in....made us very vulnerable. That's why we have to find the strength to pull out of it. You can do this, Time.

Another thing is that one of your love language is probably words of affirmation. And all those sweet things he said and your hanging on to them for dear life. You deleted everything from the computer and the memory of his words is all you have left......so you keep them going over & over.

Don't you see that everything you were getting from this EA was feeding your ego? Who doesn't like to have their self esteem shot up once in a while? But you & I got hooked on the ego food. We didn't want anyone to take that away from us b/c it felt so good.

Drug addicts are the same way. Anyone who is addicted feels the same way. "Don't take it away from me! I have to have it!" The withdrawls are a have-to in order to get over it. As I said before,coming here to this board instead of contacting OM was one of my main ways of getting through the withdrawls.

[FindingMyVoice]

So then, for example, if this were my experience and I was journaling what I'm needing to feel loved in my M, I'd write:

1) Words sweet, wonderful things; (love stuff).
2) I would like OM to chase after me.

I'd expand on the 'chase after me' a bit - what exactly does that mean to you - what kind of behaviors would you have to see in your H to feel that he's chasing after you? Then add more stuff - whatever it is that the other man did that gave you those butterflies. Then ask your H to do the same. The feelings of love come from behaviors: communication, touching, eye contact... it's actually very tangible. I know that likely sounds very unromantic, but I believe it's very true.

FMV... Did you and your H have SSM?

Yes, we have. For oh, about (surprise surprise) 10 years. Since I've been doing the work with my IC, and asking my H for what I need that is slowly turning around. But emotional connection comes first. Physical, last. That takes the longest - we're still working on that but we've had a couple...uh... encounters in the last while that make me feel the tide is turning! The frequency is improving but still not great. But the passion each time is getting stronger. Which is interesting; I thought the frequency would increase first. Huh. Learned something new again. Anyways, again, I've had to specifically ask him for what I needed. And ask more than a couple times before it's really been starting to get through.

Crazy as it sounds, I was better w/H BEFORE I started trying to break it off w/ OM. Now I'm just acting like a crazy woman with everybody!!!

That actually doesn't sound crazy to me at all. When you still connecting with OM, you were getting some needs met. Now that you're pulling away from OM, those needs are going unfulfilled. That's why I'm saying it's so important to figure out exactly what those needs are. Then if they're needs you can fulfill yourself then find a way to do so; or if they're needs of your H, you can communicate how important those needs are to you and ask him if he's able to fulfill them for you (eg, the loving words, the chasing).

I know this likely sounds weird, like making a shopping list or a 'things-to-do-list' for you H. But honest to God, it's the truth of what I did to reconnect with my H, and let go of my attraction to the OM, and it worked.

[FindingMyVoice]

Darn 'no edit' button! Sorry, #2 on the 'list' would be more like... "I would like to be chased."

[Mike.4545]

Sandi,

Thank you so much for taking the time to answer those questions for me based on your experience.

You're words are encouraging and uplifting to me...I just wish there was something that could lift my wife's spirits the same way. Something that could help her imagine that there's a possibility for her to regain love for me and have a wonderful marriage...if she would just work at it with me instead of sitting around waiting for something positive to happen.

Right now though, I don't think she's ready. It's been a little over four months since she stopped communication with the OM, and while our interactions are light-hearted and friendly...they happen quite infrequently and she still seems distant a good portion of the time.

I think what I need to focus on is to continue being patient, and not pressuring her about anything. This whole ordeal has been going on for around 7 months now though, and to be honest, I'm getting worried about how much longer I can hold on without seeing some positive sign from her.

In any case...Thank you again so very much. You're a very caring person and an absolute asset to many hurting folks!

-Mike =O)

[sandi2]

Mike, I can only imagine how hard it must be for the LBH. It took four months of hard "mourning" over loss of the EA. It sounds so awful to use that term, but it describes what your W is going through. I'm sure you want to boost her out of this state and be on with living life. It is painfully slow, but I think she has to feel this pain she's in so that she can come through it and heal. It's part of the healing.

My advise is to not bring up the subject of R or the OM or anything like that. Try to be upbeat and as lively as possible when you're around her. Bring home funny movies to watch and joke or whatever you do to make her laught. If you use to play & pick at her, then try that. Just don't over-kill on any of it. If she tells you to leave her alone or if she's not in the mood....then back off and don't push it.

Time....Mike.....time.

I'll talk with you later and see how you're doing.

[Mike.4545]

Thanks for the additional advice Sandi!

I don't know if it makes a difference or not, but my wife actually moved out of our home at the beginning of our ordeal. I usually only communicate with her via email/phone/text maybe 1-2 times per week...and have only interacted with her in-person maybe once a month since she moved out.

Because of this, it's very hard for her to see any of the changes I've been working on for myself, hard for me to exude confidence, positivity, or hopefulness on any regular basis that could help brighten her attitude, and very hard for me to understand how we could ever move forward if we live basically as strangers in separate lives now.

It's what I struggle with the most. How much and what kind of contact is not enough, and what is too much/too pursuing? Just very hard to know when or in what way to reach out to her to maintain at least some path of light back to our marriage.

I don't know if anyone could really ever answer that for me though.

[New Life]

Took sleeping pill, but still awake... Fortunately has dulled my feelings/responses. Hanging on and trying to follow each and every suggestion GW, FMV, and Sandi. Sandi, Sandi, Sandi... Is there a silverlining to this cloud??? You are so on target about so much... FMV, oh yes 10years... I can relate!!! Your gameplan was useful... I'll try to get one.

Drugs for drugs... Just to get me through the night and ready for 7am school function. Need to override the endorphin rush...

[sandi2]

There most certainly be a silver lining. Focus on that.

Do you feel the endorphines about the time you would have been on computer with OM? You may have to retrain your body. Being up this late and having to get your kids off to school in the morning.......wow, that's gonna hurt!

[gutwrenching]

Sandi - wow, you got quite a thread going here all wrapped around the same topic from different perspectives. Timing is great. I'm asking for help now, perspective, advice from you or FMV. It feels like we are really heading downhill fast right now. Its all about her feelings for OM. It feels like I am losing her...and I told W that. She replied that she was very sad that she was making me feel that way and was sorry. Key though, she didn't say I was wrong. I mentioned that. Then I got the same kind of thing that she is trying to deal with all this right now, to let her deal with it.

And a comment about the financial obligations we have ourselves in now that we were piecing, how she couldn’t get her mind around the financial security aspect of things before, there is no way she could get her mind wrapped around it now. Then she said great, now you are thinking if it wasn’t for this house, then I’d be leaving. I admitted that had crossed my mind. I validated her feelings, that they were hers and I couldn’t change them and that they are important but that I was having trouble understanding how drastically they had changed since Aug.

The anger inside me wants to just how her the financial situation and say here’s how we would do it and give her the get out of the M card that I wonder if she is looking for. Oh, and FMV, no date night tonight. Couldn’t find a sitter for the kids and that almost led to an argument because I was still calling around and W said its too late now, we have to cancel it.
And a reminder, on Sunday she leaves for a week for business trip. So what now? Do I continue to try to re-ignite the spark and fill her love tanks with her LLs? Do I start to go distant and just give space? Or?