Well, I'm not a "vet" either, but I agree with everything Greek wrote (with the exception of one word, namely "should.")
Just because someone else breaks a vow does not give an excuse to do so oneself. To those with children, do you accept it when one justifies their behavior by saying "he did it first"? Breaking a vow is a black mark on one's integrity, imo.
When I had been separated for about 4 months, I did date someone. I was upfront about my status (separated, D filed), and believed that because of that there would be no problem. There was. I kept my heart pretty guarded (in retrospect) and evidently she did not. I also did not fully appreciate the extent to which my W still held claim to it. So when an opportunity reconciliation presented itself, I realized I had to break things off with this OW. She was heartbroken, and I still feel badly about it. I did something that stroked my own ego and "felt good" at the time - and wound up hurting someone very badly, betraying my marriage vows, and also adding yet one more thing that W & I had to work through (which we did, thankfully).
So I can personally attest to the veracity of Greek's point number 3.
Does the signed off divorce free your heart? Does an unsigned divorce trap it?
I would argue that even some divorced people are not emotionally available to begin another relationship, especially if they are not the instigator of the proceedings. And conversely, not all people who's divorces are not yet finalized are still emotionally tied to their spouse. Probably depends on how long it takes ...
You should not be starting a relationship with someone until you are emotionally ready to engage. Period. FTR, I agree with everything except implying that the actual legal divorce will ready someone to move on (or that without it they can't get there). I do conceed that it's certainly a good place to start for most
Holding onto anger to punish someone else, is like lighting yourself on fire to get smoke in their eyes ~ 25yearsmlc
I would argue that even some divorced people are not emotionally available to begin another relationship
This has been my observation as well. Completing the D is necessary, but not sufficient, for the chances of having a satisfying relationship post-D.
The statistics for D in second and subsequent marriages underscore that point. I think MWD mentions it in DR somewhere as well.
I have seen the rule of thumb of one year alone for every four years of marriage post-D to process. I have no idea where it comes from or why it is suggested. However, I do think it's a good idea to spend some time, ideally with a councilor, to process what happened in the M and why the D, and to formulate goals and an action plan.
According to the DB "Elites" WHO ARE with their spouses come in and tell you "Set Em Free" it makes me question WTF are we here for?
Why would the people who DB'd and are with their WAS again tell you to "set them free" ?
Seems there is a pattern here.
You can set them free without dating.
Originally Posted By: Coach
Why hold onto someone who doesn't want to be married. Take all the pressure off them and give them what they want - standing by, waiting for them to change, holding onto your vows, threatening them etc - it's all pressure. Put yourself in their shoes, what does it look like?
So "holding onto your vows" and your beliefs is not really pressuring them, correct?
this
Quote:
I believe doing just that is not presssuring or pursueing your WAS so long as you are NOT communicating to them what you are doing and conducting yourself in a self righteous manner.
M22,H45,W45 S21/18D12 Retain faith that you will prevail in the end, regardless of the difficulties and at the same time confront the most brutal facts of your current reality, whatever they might be.
Sure you are judging and this is a healthy debate. I did and have honored my vows. The woman I have dated all know my sitch and I am not delving into anything serious. It is just like going out with my male friends, but without razor stubble and the anatomy is a little different.
I truly believe that each sitch has it's own unique issues. My stbxw is gone...long gone! So what are my vows honoring a M on paper that is most like dead emotionally? I personally value myself more than a M that my stbxw does not value and I am DB'ing by making myself stronger, healthier and happier so that I am ready when the D hits the fan! I guess I can see my sitch with more clarity than other posters on this site.
Like I said in a previous post... I don't plan to hold a torch for years hoping and praying that my W sees it and comes running back to me. I value me too much! Sure I sound selfish, but the LBS who sits and waits entering their WAS's lives intermittingly only to be shunned or rejected is selfish as well they don't want to except the fact that they can live a happy fruitfull life without their spouse. I don't need to date, but it is a more entertaining life than going to a movie alone....
Nope, actually not judging you at all. That would make me a hypocrite.
I'm challenging your statements which IMO come across as contradictory in order to try to better understand your POV. I'm not injecting my own personal beliefs at all at this point.
Of course each sitch is unique as are it's issues. Frankly, I see my sitch very clearly as well.
Holding onto anger to punish someone else, is like lighting yourself on fire to get smoke in their eyes ~ 25yearsmlc
Nope, actually not judging you at all. That would make me a hypocrite.
I'm challenging your statements, which IMO come across as contradictory, in order to try to better understand your POV. I'm not injecting my own personal beliefs at all at this point.
Of course each sitch is unique as are it's issues. Frankly, I see my sitch very clearly as well.
If you and Billy-Bob go to a movie or have a drink do you call it a "date"? The fact that you call them dates and come right out and say that you are in fact looking for someone to have your next R with makes it very different from hanging out with your guy pals.
I'm curious as to how you plan on dealing with the emotional fallout during this process if you are detaching by distraction? Are you 100% sure that if your wife had a change of heart (yes I know she's long gone, but I'm playing devil's advocate here) and knocked on your door tomorrow that you would not be interested in exploring reconciliation? The women you are dating know your sitch, they know what you tell them, but I guarentee there is still possibility for someone to get hurt if you haven't explored the answers to some of these questions in depth. And I'm going to challenge you and say that I would be surprised if, based on your registration date, you've had the TIME to really examine some of this stuff. Especially if you've been GAling your buns off There is "done", and then there is "wait a minute, I thought I was done but I still have feelings I need to process and work to do on my own sense of self and self esteem so, oops ... sorry". Being on either end of that scenario sucks.
Just my 2 cents ... PEI
Holding onto anger to punish someone else, is like lighting yourself on fire to get smoke in their eyes ~ 25yearsmlc
I understand you POV and I was probably too hasty in stating that I am trying to find someone for my next R. If my W would come knocking on my door and again I have not thought about this in a long time I would want to know her motive for wanting to come back. I am know ones second choice! And if acceptable then she would have to prove beyond belief that she believes in this M. I don't want to hold onto false hope so I am moving on with my life via GAL'ing and detaching to the point of amnesia.
You can't ride two horses with one ass. Read Michele's blog at David and Patricia Arquette.
If you're in your in. Date if you're divorced. You dilute your heart and your mentality toward your relationship and internal growth goals by dating other people.
The purpose of this site is to save relationships. Then to support those who don't. To heal. If you want a chance with your marriage, don't date someone else, even if your spouse does. Take the high road.
sg Love is PATIENT, love is KIND, LOVE never fails / DB since 2001
There is "done", and then there is "wait a minute, I thought I was done but I still have feelings I need to process and work to do on my own sense of self and self esteem so, oops ... sorry". Being on either end of that scenario sucks.