Newbie Stuck Between LRT and a Hard Place

[Furball]

Hello everyone. I'll try to be as concise as possible as I could use all the support I can find (family not helpful in the least).

My wife dropped the bomb in May 2010 (I've lost respect for you, and I don't love you the same way) on me shortly after returning from a month long trip that was supposed to be business but ended up being mostly pleasure. Emails and calls during the trip from her were glowing and loving, until I realized the trip was really just jacking around a foreign country for a month. I was upset and jealous because I was working about 70 hours a week at the time. She's gone on several trips like this. She said me being supportive initially but then no longer after I found out it was all fun and games upset her. She said she's lost who she is with me, and that she's tired of being manipulated into cooking each night, staying up past 9 when I work late, and having sex more frequently than she wants. She's also started saying that nothing's ever been right or worked, etc. etc.

We tried to patch it up through counseling but I didn't feel that her heart was in it. She would not contribute very much except for name-calling. She would not do the assigned homework or talk about anything we were assigned to talk about during the week between our appointments. She also quit touching me physically and saying I love you, which really hurts because these are my two most significant love languages (physical affection and kind words). She said this was because she feels I don't respect her and value her equally. I desparately want to and I would hate to be in a relationship where I felt that way, but she has not ever said what specifically that looks like when I do/did respect her and what it looks like when I don't. This has me flabbergasted. I feel like I have always been supportive and considerate of her needs and dreams (I'm a codependent. I know. I cared more about her dreams than my own.)

In the interim, I often accused her of cheating and resorted to snooping, because, well, I'm insecure. She has always vehemently denied it, and denied it to her girlfriends. Every relationship I've been in has ended with the girl cheating. My mom cheated on my dad. I'm kind of hard-wired to expect it. She has said that we can't work on our "real" problems until I start trusting her. I'm on week 3 of not asking her about if there's someone else, and day 1 of knowing I don't deserve it if there was.

She moved out on Labor Day saying she didn't feel safe with all the accusations. (I never threatened to or would ever harm her.) I thought we were done for. However, she told me that she wanted to have a weekly dinner date while she was moving out, I was pretty happy and thought it could be my way back in. However, for the exception of our first dinner, she has been sullen and extremely introverted for each one of our dinners. I have been as polite and as thoughtful and as witty as I can possibly be, in the end, I just keep feeling frustrated as I can tell she does not care about this as much as I do, and we end up talking about our relationship, which is never good.

So as for now, I'm trying to GAL. (I'm learning the acronyms slowly.) I'm actually enjoying cooking more often for myself and being totally responsible for everything, and while I would hope that she would see that that neediness is gone, I'm not about to penalize myself for having other needs. Mainly:

• Affectionate and guilt-free sex. She says I'm desparate for wanting it more than once a month.
• Companionship: Let's go on vacation together, be outside together, go to family events together.
• Conversation. She never seems interested in anything I have to say.

All that being said, I've done as suggested in DR and ask for what I needed, all met with a resounding no. She has asked for quality time, which I've tried to give her, but I don't understand how quality time can be being in the same place but staring at each other, saying nothing. It's mind-numbingly frustrating.

So, all in all, should I really start the LRT in earnest, and accept some dinner invitations but not all until I feel like there's a give and take, or should I just go and continue to be frustrated at her lack of interest in anything? Also, is it normal to wonder why I am fighting so hard for this anyway? I am piecing back together my self-esteem but I feel like a fool sometimes for wanting to carry on with someone who appears to want much less to do with me. Is it possible for her to have an EA with herself? How do I convey the respect that she wants and needs?

Thanks for reading this novel. I'm 29. She's 27. No kids (although I would like to have some.) And please let me know if I'm being a jerk in all of this.

[Furball]

I wanted to bump this as I think it's lost in the shuffle. Can anyone offer advice?

[pinhead]

So, all in all, should I really start the LRT in earnest, and accept some dinner invitations but not all until I feel like there's a give and take, or should I just go and continue to be frustrated at her lack of interest in anything? Also, is it normal to wonder why I am fighting so hard for this anyway? I am piecing back together my self-esteem but I feel like a fool sometimes for wanting to carry on with someone who appears to want much less to do with me. Is it possible for her to have an EA with herself? How do I convey the respect that she wants and needs?

Thanks for reading this novel. I'm 29. She's 27. No kids (although I would like to have some.) And please let me know if I'm being a jerk in all of this.

Fur,

Welcome to the board. Things are a bit slower lately due to some board drama, but you'll find some help here.

1. She's moved out. Has she said anything about a lawyer? Have you consulted with one yet? How long have you been together/married? Are you sharing finances?

2. Your needs are your needs. Don't feel like you need to defend them. Wanting sex more than once a month sure as hell isn't "desparate." Nor are the other two points.

3. When you two date, don't talk about the R. Never bring up the R if you can, and if she does, just listen to her. Really listen and try to validate what she feels.

4. Keep up with your GAL activities.

5. Stuff she says about the past, take with a grain of salt. Rewriting history (intentionally and unintentionally) is common.

You're not a jerk, and you're not acting like a jerk. When you go on dates, do you just go to a restaurant, eat, stare at each other, then feel uncomfortable? Or are you doing fun, engaging things? Things out of the ordinary? Things that'll break her out of her boredom...

I'm not sure there's an OM involved, since she's still willing to see you. But she could also just be keeping you around til she finds Mr. Right.

Could she have been taking the trip to be with someone? A coworker since the trip was advertised ostensibly as "business?"

[Furball]

Pin,

Thanks for the welcome and encouraging/thought-provoking words.

1. I found out that right after she moved out she had contacted a lawyer on the advice of her family to determine if there were any ramifications to her move. I also found notes related to what she is entitled to upon divorce, but when I asked her about it, she said that she wanted to use all the time that she paid for and her goal is to move back in eventually. I haven't consulted with a lawyer, part of me feels like it's tempting bad things to happen to go see one. But I'm conflicted about it. Maybe I should. We've been together for 7 years, married for 4. We are still sharing finances. We are fortunate financially, but we have been paying expenses through our credit cards during this separation and then paying the bill in full out of our main account.

2. Thanks--sometimes a person starts to believe they're being unrealistic after being told it so many times.

3. She teased me with asking if she should attend my brother's wedding this past week. I told her I would like to have her there but I can understand if it is uncomfortable. She initially agreed and then said "I just can't do it." So, it's like she brings up R sometimes, should I just say, "I prefer to enjoy your company. Let's not talk about the R?"

For right now we're just going to restaurants we haven't been to before but always wanted to try. Our first date was a really good step but we have had our anniversary and this wedding in between which have triggered a lot of confusion. Any ideas on fun, engaging things? I've thought about going to an apple orchard, see the bald eagles, the zoo, stuff like that. I don't know what would engage her, a lot of her hobbies are so isolating (running long distances, reading mystery novels, books on tape) that I never can tell what moves her heart.

Currently, we are dark. She said she needed space on the night of our anniversary two weeks ago and we haven't talked since then. I'm trying to be strong. I haven't contacted her at all since that night. She said that night she wanted to find another marriage counselor, but I haven't heard back from her on that. Perhaps it is an empty repair attempt. It's all been very Jekyll and Hyde..."I want to work on this, No I don't" "I will eventually move back, wait, I'm kind of comfortable on my own."

The trip was with a well known international organization and organized with several young men and young women on it. The trip was supposed to help them learning diverse ideas and work practices in their chosen professions to bring back to the states, but it ended up being tours of a lot of civic organizations and frequent drinking. Perhaps something happened there in the heat of the moment or against her will that she hasn't come to terms with, I dunno. I've alleged that the potential OM was on that trip, which she has denied and I can find no other record of him during my snooping. I think it's more of a quarter life crisis, perhaps? I want to have kids and put roots down, she's talking about moving across country to get her phD. I'm all for her aspirations but if it comes at the expense of our marriage, then I'm not for it.

My biggest fear right now is that all my hard earned progress of being my own man, detaching from her, etc. will come crashing down if/when we meet again if she is not hospitable. She just seems so in her own world. I know I have been co-dependent in the past becuase that's how I've been taught, but I feel that she doesn't even want to be interdependent, she just wants to live with someone to stave off loneliness.

[gucci loafer]

Textbook case of her having an affair or interested in someone else...

Classic..

I have been observing these things for twenty plus years and RARELY are they NOT interested in someone or having an affair..

Most men that I observe almost always deny there is an affair.

This is how women act when they find someone else that has their thoughts and hearts.

You need to find out who it is before you can get the best gameplan. You will be wasting your time like so many other do on this site until you find out the truth. She is lying. Women don't just leave without something to fall back on. Bank on it.

[TimeHeals]

I also found notes related to what she is entitled to upon divorce

I haven't consulted with a lawyer, part of me feels like it's tempting bad things to happen to go see one.

"I feel exactly the same way about seat belts: they just cause bad things to happen".

Sincerely,

Crash Test Dummy

[Starsky309]

I also found notes related to what she is entitled to upon divorce

I haven't consulted with a lawyer, part of me feels like it's tempting bad things to happen to go see one.

"I feel exactly the same way about seat belts: they just cause bad things to happen".

Sincerely,

Crash Test Dummy

LOL!

[40andsadintexas]

Maybe you should have plans on your next date night give her something to think about. I think that when a woman walks it's a safe bet there is someone else, or in my case she's working on a baseball team.

[gutwrenching]

Read Gucci's post again...its the first thing I thought of when reading yours. I know it sucks to hear, but chances are very high that your W is having an affair of some sort.

Is she secretive about computers, phones? Spend a lot of time on either? Go out alone a lot? Dressing different, etc?

Look for the clues, but don't ask her or accuse her, she will deny, deny, deny...

[idontunderstand]

I think that when a woman walks it's a safe bet there is someone else, or in my case she's working on a baseball team.

Humor is a wonderful thing, ain't it!