My continuing saga...

[25yearsmlc]

Show her that you have changed or she'll never believe that marriage between you two can be better than before, and even you must realize it needs to be better, right?

She says the other country represents more than OM to her. Believe her. Are there other ways she can meet some of the needs it provides without going there? (Cuisine? Similar topagraphy or religion or whatever??)

I respectfully disagree 25,
he should NOT show her anything.
He has nothing to prove to her.
She had an affair with another man, not him.
Proving to her, or attempting to prove to her that he has "changed" does nothing but show pursuing, clinging behavior.

It doesn't work.
It will never work.

Robx,

I don't disagree as much as you may think. She is confused but...well, so what? My point is he has to be a different man to her, or the reasons she has/gave or thinks exist for leaving him, ARE no longer applicable. I suspect following most of your advice will impress upon her the changes without "impressing" them upon her, meaning, don't bother showing her. And as for the country and OM, first off, I don't think future should pursue. Sorry if that's confusing but my comment was for later, down the road IF AND WHEN applicable, if she's sincere, then fine, take a cooking class or whatever. This is not a "do now" item at all. It's just a long term suggestion if Future ever gets there. But as later posters said, if she's "still got him" what's to miss?

Dating OW (if your kids are protected and you're honest with the OW)...well, it sure seems to get noticed by WAS's. Sounds high schoolish, and it IS. IF it works, do it. IF it helps you heal, do it. And if you have the fear that dating OWs will somehow "let her off the hook", AND OR give her a reason "now" to REALLY divorce you, wake up. First, she's already let herself off the hook. and Guilt seemed to be there but it was not enough to get her home. Second, she IS divorcing you or at least not coming home. How can this hurt the R/M?
Take Robx's advice b/c it doesn't vary with my main point--you are a different man today. All your good qualities remain but now there are additional ones you are developing. Give her something to miss and no one misses what they know they can have.
LONG TERM-- if you get there--is that she'll have to know it's humanly possible to recover from this. And that's not easy. A lot of LBSers think the long term problem is the WAS cheating again but I know some couples who might have healed if the LBSer had been able to stop obsessing and GAL... it happens. But when I say lose the anger, I mean lose the lectures and angry arguments you find so persuasive. They're not. Anger, if controlled and justified, is not a turn off. That means you can't keep ranting and think she'll slap her forehead and say "OMG, NOW I GET IT" and come home. And If she fears you, you're out of luck But do something different, please.



She told him in their little coffee date that the reason why it didn't work out with the OM was because he wouldn't move to this country. She is telling him direct and to the point, that if he had moved here, she would be with the OM. The only reason she wants to be with Future is because he is the 2nd option, the backup plan if the affair with the OM didn't work out.

I've mentioned this scenario a million times on this site,
NEVER BE THE 2ND OPTION, NEVER BE THE BACK UP PLAN to a cheating spouse, to a spouse having an affair. Doing so communicates you have no real value, you're only good enough if the preferred plans don't work out. Who in their right mind would want to be someone's 2nd option?

Robx, I didn't find her comments nearly that clear on that point. She said something about "other reasons" for not being with him or for wanting to be with future BUT you;re right as far as her and the main point--she has NOT chosen to be with Future, and that's what counts, no matter what she "Feels"...2nd place? NO THANKS...


(and I always make a point of telling people to stand up for themselves and to stand up to WAS's "crap behavior") Definitely. Respect is a big part of love. You have to expect/demand it or walk out.

I'm glad you agreed with the divorce.
The more you resist, the more it persists. Besides, legally the most you can do is slow things down (gone are the days where a spouse "gave" the other a divorce) but you do not control whether a divorce is granted. It will be.

Now go out on a few dates,
I don't care if they're platonic, friendly only dates, just go out with a few different women. Start making yourself unavailable.

Up until this point, she hasn't had to fear losing you.
You've been there, proof of this, she knew you would be open to reconciliation after her stint with the OM.
In her mind she probably thought....
"It's ok if I screw around on Future, he's a nice guy, dependable, he'll always be there for me, he doesn't have any opinions of his own, he doesn't stand up for himself, he just takes what i give him, he's not very exciting, always agreeing with me but at least he's.... safe and he isn't going anywhere."

You really want her back,
give her the feeling that you're DONE with her.
A real feeling, nothing fake will work.

100% AGREEMENT
You won't get her back by showing her that you've changed.
You've changed?! Really?

THIS IS A CHANGE!! BUT IT'S NOT FOR HER, WHICH IS PART OF WHAT'S NEW...

I hear no mention of HER changes, hmmmm.... none whatsoever.
Because she's perfect as is, even if she cheats on you, openly admits that the reason she considers coming back is because the OM wouldn't move to this country, lies to you by telling you she loves the OM's country, she doesn't/didn't go there because of him (ummm.... please don't ever believe this, it's a lie, plain and simple, she's used to saying things to you and you just accepting it as truth).

IF the day comes that she clearly wants back in, THEN Future will have to set and enforce boundaries for recon. He has nothing to tell her on that issue now as he can rightly assume she's off with SOME OM and not worth his time and effort b/c he;s a great catch. Robx, if I'm not mistaken you wrote some suggestions for this scenario some time back, (wasn't it you??) and that may help down the road. (AS in specific Examples, etc.) And future, remember to be the best dad you can be as much as you can be and that's not a tactic, it's key to you and your kids' healthy R's in the future. They need you now more than ever. THey're watching you so show them what real men do when they get a blow to their heart. Dignity, strength and honor...(which HAPPEN to be attractive but are not the point...)

You need to stop talking to her,
you can let her contact you when necessary but you need to stop making first contact. Keep it about the kids, start going out, not just thinking about it, DOING IT! Go out on friendly dates, "social interactions" with other women, whatever you have to call it, just do it.

Yep...why not?

Read BTM's thread, the guy was in the same situation 4 years ago, on this board 4 years ago, his wife moved out, basically told him she wasn't coming back, he didn't confirm an affair but she lives on her own and he has the kids living with him. He spent several months and several hundred posts telling us he did things to show her he changed, and on top of that he kissed her butt every step of the way, trips, dinners, gifts, calling often, relationship talk, pursuing, needy, clingy behavior, you name it, he did and guess what, wife wasn't interested at all. He finally reaches his own personal threshold of how far he was willing to go, the switch inside his head finally gets flipped and he gives up on her (finally!), he accepts that she's gone, stops calling, stops pursuing, starts to get a real life, goes out with his friends, goes shopping, taking care of himself, starts dating and she finds out and all of a sudden, wonder o wonders, her feelings start to change, she shows jealousy, she compliments his look, she feels "gipped" that he's moving on, that some other woman is now going to get the "better" BTM, (she enjoyed the situation when she was the one moving on, when he finally accepted the situation and he really moved on, things changed), she felt dumped, she felt bitter, she now shows signs that she wants him back, she contacts him, and he continues acting as if it's over.

Future your wife kept pursuing the OM and still thinks about the OM because.... he dumped her several times. Gucci commented on this as well. That is reality, that is what works. Showing your wife that you've "changed" is not going to bring her back, you're going to have several more months of her crap cheating behavior if you're going to pursue her and show her you changed. You want to show her you've changed? If you really want to show her you've changed, show her for real that you've changed by moving on and leaving her behind and showing her that you won't accept this treatment from her anymore, showing her you have a mindset of abundance, there's a 1000 other women out there for you and there is only one YOU! That would be showing her you've changed, that would be showing her that you understand how she feels and that you now share the same feelings.

That's the only way you have a chance of this working,
you won't get her back by competing with the OM for her, that never works, you will always lose in that situation because you lose before the competition even begins.

Good luck bro, I hope you understand this and internalize this and make this your new reality.

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Semantics. Do as he says Future, I say, Change for YOU. If she comes back, deal with it. If not, so what? You'll have healed that much faster, thank GOD. Be the best man you can be and leave the results up to the big guy.