Great points CG. I plan to go over all of theis with my L tomorrow. One of the things that W isn't understanding here is that this should all be worked out before we even get to court. Why should we let someone else decide for us? I don't want to have to make any more life altering decisions in 5 minutes.
She is crazy!!!
I think I am going to ask my attorney to file a motion to have the placement and resultant support changed to what was agreed-upon in mediation.
...She is crazy!!! ....I think I am going to ask my attorney to file a motion to have the placement and resultant support changed to what was agreed-upon in mediation.
This all sucks so much!!
Leading is tough. Keep doing the right thing.
No reason to let the crazy one lead......
"What is best for my kids is best for me" Amor Fati Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
Many people like the "let the judge decide for us" idea because the judge must rule based on the guidelines of the law. In most cases (in a no fault state which I think you are in?) it will result in a fairly even split. If your W feels what you are offering is not all she is entitled to it's not surprising she doesn't want to work with you.
If you had an agreement in place via mediation why wasn't it filed when the agreement was reached?
One of the things that W isn't understanding here is that this should all be worked out before we even get to court. Why should we let someone else decide for us?
My W and I are using a mediator too, but it is amazing how much misinformation she has been fed. I'll bet your W has had a good chunk of "support" from others also. So ya, we go to mediate, but because she thinks that she's going to get a bad deal from me, it is really hard to make those life-altering decisions that may not be permanent, but feel very permanent. I'd guess that when she saw your pool she may have also had a supportive friend or her own fears tell her that she'll be always short of cash/love/time/etc but that a court would be better for her.
I think that if my W had suggested mediation to me, she'd be more receptive. Since it was my idea, there may be that lingering thought that I wanted to mediate to save my own hide, not to make the best for us both (my goal).
Understanding the many reasons she is hesitant or flip flopping might help you go into your meetings with her and with your L in a more productive light. There's a Muslim phrase that says, "make 73 justifications for your brother". Justifications don't ignore facts, they just make it easier to work with them.
Actually, I should probably rephrase this a bit. Shortly after our first court order was finalized, I complained to her about how much support I had to pay to her and her response was, "I can't help it, that's just what the court decided. They do this every day and they know what the arrangements should be."
She doesn't want to be responsible for any of this.
CG, I am in a "No Fault" state and don't actually mind splitting what we have accumulated to this point 50/50. My feeling is that we earned whatever we have now together and she is entitled to 1/2 of it. I am more concerned about how to live moving forward.
Regarding mediation, we went to court first on 8/3/10 and agreed to a temporary order that laid out the split of the kids and the support I would pay. We were then ordered to go to mediation for placement of the kids and I got the earliest date possible, 8/23/10. In that meeting, W indicated she wanted primary placement, because she thought, and still thinks, that it would be best for the kids. Still, she agreed to placement of:
Mom: Sun night, Mon, Tue Dad: Wed, Thu, Alternate: Fri, Sat Sun days
I indicated agreement to this schedule on 9/2/10. I'm not sure how long it will take the mediator to file her report, but she indicated in the 8/23 meeting that if we could agree to an arrangement, we should start it right away.
I feel that I am trying to be "fair" with her and have been more than fair by agreeing to let her have the kids on my alternate Sunday nights.
I will talk with my L today to get an idea about how long the process of filing the mediation agreement should take. Maybe I will call the mediator also and ask her when to expect her to file the report.
OMT,
I'm sure she WILL always be short of cash/love/time/etc., but this is her choice. As I mentioned above, we didn't start with mediation, we started with lawyers and court. My issue is that we need to get agreements in place as much as possible before we get to court. Last time I had 5 minutes to make a decision and I don't plan to be in that position again. Why wait until the court date to have the L's hash out my life in 30 minutes? We should be doing this all along and that is what I am going to stress to my L today. I want to write proposals for all of the contested items and present them to W's L well in advance of our next court date. Hopefully most of this can be settled before we have to see any Judge.
LSG,
You are right, this IS a FIGHT for my future and I need to remember that and not forget it. Sometimes I get so caught up in wishing this wasn't happening and hoping that it will end that I forget this is real. I just want things to be OK between me and W and it is easy to lose track of the fact that this really is happening and is not going away any time soon, no matter what I want.
I see my L at noon today to make estimates of what child support and alimony will look like under the scenario's that W has agreed to. I also have a list of questions to ask and statements to make regarding how I want the rest of this situation to be handled. My head will be clear for this meeting and I am determined to get this done the way I want it to be done.
Thanks to all of you for your continued support. Your thoughts and questions always help me see things more clearly. I don't know what I would do without you guys!!
I strongly urge you to take a step back and really think about what you said.
You said your W *should* understand that it makes more sense to have an agreement in place prior to the court date. Next you said she doesn't want to be responsible for any of this.
Reaching a settlement on your own (or via mediation and not the court system) is a process that requires TREMENDOUS responsibility on both ends. Your W has proven via her actions (in the realm of settling and working with attnys) she is not interested in being responsible with you.
My H badgered me for close to year to "work with him". And finally I did. We finally reached a settlement, my attny put it together and sent it to his attny. Both of our attnys signed off on it and as per the judges orders went to court to put our settlement on the oral record (all of this is common procedure). Once the settlement is put on the oral record it takes the court system 2 weeks to make it "formal" then all parties must sign it again and it's done.
When the formal court ordered agreement arrived I signed it and at the 11th hour my H and his attny refused to sign it and we were back and square one. Because of this stunt my H and his attny pulled a trial date was set. I was then put the legal and emotional wringer of two weeks of costly trial preparation only to have my H contact me at 11pm the night before the trial was to begin to say he would sign the agreement and did not want a trial.
All in all I was put through the utter trauma of my H badgering me to the point I became physically ill, 20K in legal fees and two years of my life dedicated to this mess only to walk away with the same settlement I offered in 2008.
I know my experience was extreme however WAS who prefer to let the attny or courts handle things is giving you a clear signal they are not interested in "working with you".
I strongly urge you to take a step back and really think about what you said.
You said your W *should* understand that it makes more sense to have an agreement in place prior to the court date. Next you said she doesn't want to be responsible for any of this.
Reaching a settlement on your own (or via mediation and not the court system) is a process that requires TREMENDOUS responsibility on both ends. Your W has proven via her actions (in the realm of settling and working with attnys) she is not interested in being responsible with you.
My H badgered me for close to year to "work with him". And finally I did. We finally reached a settlement, my attny put it together and sent it to his attny. Both of our attnys signed off on it and as per the judges orders went to court to put our settlement on the oral record (all of this is common procedure). Once the settlement is put on the oral record it takes the court system 2 weeks to make it "formal" then all parties must sign it again and it's done.
When the formal court ordered agreement arrived I signed it and at the 11th hour my H and his attny refused to sign it and we were back and square one. Because of this stunt my H and his attny pulled a trial date was set. I was then put the legal and emotional wringer of two weeks of costly trial preparation only to have my H contact me at 11pm the night before the trial was to begin to say he would sign the agreement and did not want a trial.
All in all I was put through the utter trauma of my H badgering me to the point I became physically ill, 20K in legal fees and two years of my life dedicated to this mess only to walk away with the same settlement I offered in 2008.
I know my experience was extreme however WAS who prefer to let the attny or courts handle things is giving you a clear signal they are not interested in "working with you".
Thanks for the advice CG. It will help me remember that it may come down to this in the end. I guess I am not proposing to work on this with my W directly, but through the attorneys. Rather than waiting until the court date for any progress to be made, I want my attorney to send proposals to her attorney and for them to accept, reject or counter them.
Because we have an agreement in mediation, there is no reason I can think of at this point not to file a motion with the court to enforce the agreement. Although my attorney did say that even if you agree in mediation, you can still change your mind. My question here is if I push too hard, will she change her mind about what she agreed to?
As I mentioned, at our last court date, we hadn't done ANY up-front negotiating through the attorneys. The attorneys met for 30 minutes, planned out my life and I was given 5 minutes to decide whether or not I wanted to accept what they had agreed to. That seems ridiculous to me and I do not want to be put into that position again.
So, my intention is to get as much of this as we can worked out through our attorneys before the court date, realizing that we still may end-up there like you did anyway.
Thanks again CG, your thoughts and suggestions are always appreciated.
