Thought I should get some feedback from y’all since I’ve been silent for a while. The news is that we’re done. It’s the beginning of the end.
wife is getting her own place after the holidays.
My first reaction was and always has been one of horror “how could this be? We can’t give up like this! Come on, soldier! Get up! Charge forward! We can work through this somehow”. Well, I’ve learned a lot from this and I’ve come to realize that I was wrong. We gave it a good effort, ‘bout a decade and a half of trying: more than enough to get it right or get out. I blindly hung on longer than was healthy for either of us.
What I always considered strengths, long-suffering and loyalty, are weaknesses and foolishness when given blindly to one that does not deserve them or appreciate or even really want them. The differences in approach to life, love, faith and almost anything else are actually tremendous. These can no longer be bridged.
While we care about each other very much and always will, we just can’t be partners. Our individual perspectives will keep us in a constant state of anguish and frustration. It is unfair of me to expect her to have feelings for me or to force her body to submit to a unifying process that should come naturally, given the closeness of our relationship over the years. I believe that it is equally unfair for me to ache for her and to be left continually unfulfilled or guilty because of my “dirty primitive desires”.
I passed the Sexual Aversion link from marriagebuilders.com on to her, like other things that I have tried to get her to read but instead of meeting with stubborn resistance, I was very surprised that she said that she recognized that was the problem. Now, I know Corri and a few others are going to jump up and down and do that jig and be all happy and tell me that we’re finally getting somewhere. DON’T. Sorry to burst your bubbles but... too little too late.
She says she recognizes the problem (that is, she has developed an aversion to sex because she forced herself to give it to me for all these years when she should have withheld it if she didn’t feel like it). Well, I’ve developed an aversion to not having sex and I will not submit myself to the damage that I’ve allowed to be done to me for all these years by NOT having sex. I can’t take it anymore. I CAN NOT. I have lived in fear, I have not been myself, all in the stupid fuuking hope that if I was a good little boy and did everything she wanted she might bestow upon me the honor of physical affection. How naive, stupid and foolish. I’ve been whipping myself with thorns, all the while asking her if it was enough yet.
I am so so tired of this battle. A year or two ago this would have been a breakthrough, we could have possibly made some progress; not because the result would have been any better but because my eyes had not been opened to the foolishness of living in unhappiness, clinging to hope and traditionalist philosophies of the holy grail of marriage. I do not have the strength to hope, to try.
At the very least, we are going to take a break from each other. The ONLY way I will get back with her is if she realizes how selfish and damaging she has been and resolves to win me back at any cost. Of course, this will not happen, she is simply too proud and wallowing too deep in her own world of self-pity.
Even though she has identified this problem as something that has developed within her (honestly, I’ve been a sweet, loving, patient husband) due to my imposition of this evil animalistic act upon her, she blasted me out of the water when she said that I was the one that had to decide, that if I wanted to be with her I would have to be willing to work a lot harder for her to get over the pain I have caused her. This is when the floor dropped out from under me. She can and never will be able to admit that she needs to work on this. She is always right and I am always wrong. Not anymore folks. I’m done. It’s not in me to carry this relationship by myself.
Yes, I’ve been a bit sarcastic and cynical here. Please, y’all don’t shred me apart for it, I’m not in the mood. I’m ready to lick my wounds and focus my attention on making the transition as healthy as possible for the whole family. My primary concern is for my son and, ironically, for her. I know I’ll be fine. I’m relieved. The world is full of joy, pleasure and enriching experiences, waiting for me. I am on my way to becoming myself. And sweet Jesus, there are a lot of beautiful ladies out there!
By the way, the depression thing was something of a smokescreen. Sure, she gets depressed sometimes, most of the time when she feels the pressure of having to grow up and act like a woman in a relationship. She had the gall to tell me that I needed to mature and not be so sexual, not to let myself get horny all the time. FK!FK!FK! What a crockpot of horsesheeit.
Call it a whim, perhaps even a passing infatuation, or maybe it is just because it has been so long since I have gotten any physical attention from my wife but, I think I love you! You have my undying respect!
However, your post makes me shudder. So much of what you say rings true for me that I fear my marriage will fail as well. Like you I have been the patient, supportive, and nurturing husband. It is a double edged sword to be sure. You cannot tell them you are miserable because that puts too much pressure on them, and you can't act as if everything is ok because they will think it is and nothing will ever change. So you are left "holding the bag" but this bag is not empty. It is chock full of frustration, hurt, sadness, and fear. Just remember dude, when you leave, give the bag to her, after all, everything that is in the bag exists because she was not willing to pull her weight. Forgive her, forgive yourself, and start over (just don't get married right away, go have lots and lots of meaningless sex for a while, just make sure you wear a raincoat).
Boy oh boy, don't they just love to bash that "depression" thing over your head. I mean, what can you say to that?!?! If if you do anything but completely ignore your NORMAL AND HEALTHY desires and say something like "It's ok honey, I love you and we'll get through this." you get crucified. YOU Mr. Normal and Healthy have NO VOICE! BAH!!!!!!!
One more thing, even though the LDrs like to say it is a challenge, obstacle, (insert newest "PC" term here), loss of sexual drive (for any reason) IS A HUGE PROBLEM, and there is something WRONG.
Sorry, went off on a rant there. I hope my marriage can make it but I really respect you and your strength for what you are doing. I feel like you are taking a stand for me and others in our situation, others who are painted out to be the bad guys because of our normal and healthy drives. Bravo I say, BRAVO!
Ah, you sweet man, I have sorely missed you. I am so sorry to hear of your pain.
But guess what? I don't have a single arrow in my arsenal to throw at you. I'm not doing any happy jigs either, because this is a very sad, sad situation.
HOWEVER.
Your present mood is what is technically called a 'BOUNDARY.' You've found it. You've drawn your line in the sand, and in part, this is where your peace is coming from. You know what you can take, and you know what you are no longer willing to take. For a very long time, you have been owning your wife's problem as your own. From the above description, it sounds like you are no longer willing to do that.
Regardless of what comes, you have stood up for yourself and have said, 'no more.' It's not a bad place to be. It doesn't mean that it's not going to get scary, it doesn't mean that you won't hurt, it doesn't mean that your marriage IS over, or that it isn't over... it simply means that your wife is now crysal clear on what you will and will not tolerate anymore.
As you have said, the ball is firmly in HER court.
My heart breaks for you that it has had to come to this. But for you, I can't tell you how, well, relieved I guess I am that you no longer put all of this on your shoulders. You are a man worthy and deserving of reciprocal love -- in ALL its forms. Move forward for yourself and your son. If your wife wakes up and can salvage things, I think that would be tremendous. But as you have said, you can't wait for her. You must put yourself first, and you must always put yourself first, for that is the only way you can truly love another, unselfishly.
I've missed you. I hope you keep posting, and we'll try to support you through this as best as we are able.
Sorry we are just not right for each other But I sincerely thank you for your respect and shuddering, I know the confused goolash that that combination makes. I hope my own frustrations and lofty declarations of independence don't necessarily influence others to give up too. Then again... Anyway, my new advice is only this: hang on as long as you can but don't hang on longer than you can.
Johanna: You've been bashed around long enough too. Give him a deadline to "git it figgered out or git it out", and start making plans for your new life; it is a bright one for such a loving and sexy lady. How do I know you're sexy? 'Cause I am AchingMan, Sensor of Sexy Ladies, Grande Bestower of Luv.
Corri: Thank you, thank you.
In spite of my sarcasm and foolish jokery, this is still a very serious and difficult situation. Some days are easier than others, but something is different, I'm not the same blind guy I was a month ago. I don't have the same feelings I had. My wife is still an attractive woman but I have lost a lot of respect for her and her manipulation. I am feeling even more like there are opposing forces battling within me. When I see her I feel a combination of wanting her with all my being and utter repulsion (like two magnets that are constantly flipping poles). I wouldn't be able to say no if she came on to me (miracles do happen) but I would wish I could. Does that make sense? It's all very wierd. I guess I don't want things to get sorta better, sorta back where we've always been, sorta ok but still frustrating. I want either the whole monty or no monty. I'm tired of a mediocre love life.
She is trying to be nice to me which is really confusing. The ball may be in her court but she thinks it is in mine. I feel guilty about wanting out so bad now but the feeling won't go away. She thinks we are working on it but I don't really see that she is trying to do anything. I'm just trying to survive day to day now. She still wants to hug me and says she loves me (nothing new here so don't get excited) but those things make me feel more guilty, more confused and more sad. You'd think it would make me feel better but at this point I can't stand the torture. I know we are not compatible and it's only a matter of time before things would crumble. If only she had been willing to face this issue and accept some responsibility to work for our relationship.
Thanks for the virtual bear hugs too, TC, everyone's support here has made a big difference in waking up and now as I attempt to stand up and walk on my own.
Your flattery is wonderful and so tongue in cheek I LOLed. Thanks, I needed that. I am having a different perspective being out of the house for over a month and little movement from him. Even if there were a "drop dead deadline," I think that would do nothing, either.
Feel as if I have been taken for granted by H all these years and I know I deserve more than what he is willing or able to give back in return. Trying to make that final decision, where you were several months ago, but each day I face it with a better frame of mind and not having the "beating a dead horse" feeling.
You have absolutly nothing to feel guilty for. You have given your M every ounce of your being, trying to get your W to understand that there is more to a M than clean laundry. There can be passion, fun, frivolity, and so much more if she would have just opened her eyes. Our Spouses are just blind to the "more" part of marriage and will settle for mundane everyday. You are on a journey as am I. Where it will lead, I have no clue, but I am becoming an explorer!!!!
Thank you for all of your support through my difficult days, too.
You've made a significant change... so significant in fact, that she is changing in response to it. Never doubt that what you are seeing is true... but whether or not it becomes a lasting change will largely depend on how well you stick to your new boundary.
Give your wife some time to find her footing. Believe it or not, she is probably shell shocked and completely unsure of herself. After all, she was good at the dance the two of you had done together for so long. She now has to learn a new dance. She may get the step mixed up, she may even want to go back to the old dance every now and then, but remember, the man leads in the dance. If you don't revert, neither will she.
When the fog lifted from me, like you, I was almost at a loss. I went to my shrink and said, "okay, believe it or not, I finally 'get it.' I get everything you've been trying to get through my thick skull all this time. I GOT it. Sooo.... how do I not screw this up?"
Stick to your boundaries.... You understand clearly now what you will not tolerate. You can hold up everything you do and everything she does to that one thing. Like Michele says in her book, "how is this conversation/action/belief getting me closer to my goal?" And the goal is to have a loving, sexually rewarding relationship with your wife. If her actions/words or your actions/words are not getting you closer to that goal, then change your behavior, actions, reactions, choice of words, see?
Now that you understand clearly that you cannot change her, you have let yourself off the hook for being responsible for her. If she can't get it together enough to work at saving her marriage, then follow plan A, you know?
But she is as lost as you are. Nothing is familiar to either one of you anymore. And that's not a bad thing. All your illusions are stripped away, and nothing looks or feels like anything you had ever imagined it would. That's good. The illusions screwed you up to begin with. Now you get to make it up as you go, if you both have the courage to try, and if you both have the courage to stick to your boundaries. This is where respect begins. Respect leads to trust. Trust leads to love.
Just remember that empathy and tolerance are your friends. It will be real easy now to be judgemental of her because you are just so damn angry and hurt. I don't blame you. You don't have to be all gushy-gooey when she hugs you and says she loves you, but you don't have to throw it in her face either, you know?
Go with what 'feels' right, go with what moves you closer to your goal. Sometimes saying no gets you closer to your goal. Sometimes saying yes gets you closer to your goal. Understand?
AM, this takes some practice, and you really have to pay attention because you are no longer on auto pilot. It's going to WEAR YOU OUT. But don't give up. The roller coaster of emotion you are experiencing is NORMAL, and just knowing that can make it easier to bear.
In the end, you gotta do what you gotta do. If nothing else, cling to that boundary and never let it go. Please update as you can.
"Marriage is a destructive and antiquated social construct that is better at tearing our humanity out of us than providing the refuge that it falsely advertises, preying on the lusts and insecurities of humanity and youth. Viva la revolución!"
I appologize for the big venting blowout on the DB.I have softened up a bit, since the wife seems to be making some effort and we have had some good talks. I’m down to 50/50 on whether we’ll separate after the holidays. We’ll just have to see how things go.
We have all been trying so hard to target the problem of no lib spouses that maybe we are missing the target. Does that make sense? I think Corri has been trying to pound this concept into us: be confident in yourself, try to rely less on others for comfort, let them stew about on their own if they are unwilling to grow along with you. You really can’t force someone to love you, either they do or they don’t.
I really started giving up on my marriage recently and realizing that there are lots of women that would really appreciate me. This, among other things, has giving me a lot of self confidence.
My wife has finally admitted that our sex life is a big problem and seems to be a little more willing to start working on it or start letting go of each other. Some days it feels like it is too late, other days I see hope. I know she knows that she will have a very difficult time finding a man that is as supportive and kind as I am, and one that doesn’t care about having a sex life. Realistically, it’s impossible. Maybe someday she will appreciate me for who I am, horniness and all.
Corri will be pleased to know that I finally got the insurance straightened out and starting seeing a shrink by myself, which feels like it is going to be fantastic. As soon as she(the therapist) said she understood that male sexuality has been horribly misunderstood and that sexual rejection is the most painful type anybody can go through...well, I knew she was going to be very helpful since she could understand what I was going through. She also just happens to be a Sexpert.
I think more than anything what will get my wife to wake up and make steps to improve things is me giving up, for her to see me at the end of my rope; willing to let go and yet making positive changes in myself, especially confidence-wise. It’s risky to step out that far, giving up, could backfire but hopefully she realizes that I’m serious about making change.
Quote: be confident in yourself, try to rely less on others for comfort, let them stew about on their own if they are unwilling to grow along with you. You really can’t force someone to love you, either they do or they don’t.
You are getting there, my man. Keep going...
Quote: there are lots of women that would really appreciate me. This, among other things, has giving me a lot of self confidence.
It's not what others think of you that is important. It is what YOU think of you. OF COURSE other women would appreciate you because you are WORTHY and DESERVING of appreciation. When YOU know this, you are reaching self-love.
You are finally getting to the point where you realize you can only be responsible for your half of the marriage. You have stopped carrying your wife's load, and she has noticed. She may bumble about for a time, trying to find her footing, but if you think she is truly, truly trying, then lovingly accept her efforts while lovingly maintaining and NOT BUDGING on your boundary.
I am so glad you have found a counselor with whom you are comfortable, and with whom you are finding your answers.
Quote: I think more than anything what will get my wife to wake up and make steps to improve things is me giving up
You aren't really giving up. You've just stopped doing her work. Big difference.
Quote: for her to see me at the end of my rope
Means you have drawn your line in the sand and indicates you are serious, you aren't budging, and you still love her. Ball's in her court.
Quote: willing to let go and yet making positive changes in myself, especially confidence-wise. It’s risky to step out that far, giving up, could backfire but hopefully she realizes that I’m serious about making change.
Great rewards require great risk. Seek your answers, love and accept yourself for the wonderful, incredible being you are. When you truly love yourself only then do you have love to share.
Keep on keeping on, AM. It's a hilly ride, but one that eventually evens out. Please post updates.
